Do you leave your tank(s) full or emply in winter?

[Maine Sail]

I have a feeling the GuyT...

Comment was directed my way. Rather than me answering this I'll let the ABYC explain it in simple terms from a question posed to them back in 2001..

"Q. Can welding cable be used on boats?

A. Welding cable is often used for battery cables on boats. However, the welding cable's insulation must be oil and water-resistant. Cable that is not oil and water resistant may become impregnated with the water or oil and reduce the insulation's effectiveness. ABYC E-9.15.2 covers the requirements for the construction of cables and conductors."


Simple, and I did NOT write it. Some cable jackets are just NOT water-resistant, including but not limited to, welding cable..

 

[Ross]

Mainesail , You and I are both old enough to have

seen electrical wire insulated with waxed cotton thread, varnished chambric. and plain old rubber that got as brittle as hard candy after a few years. All of the insulation used today is superior to what was on the market when the houses we were born in were built. The makers continue to improve the insulation and the end users continue to demand better and get it. A study of an electronic supply catalog shows a range of insulation that was undreamed of forty years ago. With todays insulation and electrical codes we rarely hear of an accidental electocution. The better the quality the longer it can remain in service.
Mainesail hang in there. you do good work.

 

[NYSail]

Personally

I do not top off my tanks as I would rather keep as much additives and old fuel out of my engine as possible. By the way, isn't a fuel seperator supose to get the water and debris out of the fuel prior to the engine? I have a Racor 500 as a primary filter, which has a clear bowl and a value at the bottom to drain any water or crud in the fuel. I have not filled my tanks over the winter in the 3 years I have owned this boat, and never topped off the tanks in the 5 years with my former boat and I never had any water problems. And the only thing that comes from my Racor is dirt and no water....Probably just been lucky and will have a fuel/water problem next weekend.


By the way, I'm located on Long Island with boat on the hard from Nov. to about May.

 

[MoonSailer]

Bob Airplanes are not Boats!!!!!

Airplanes even little Cessnas burn a lot of fuel!!!! My old Cessna 172 burned about 7 gallons/hour. I think the tanks held about 35 gallons. Yes we did top it off after flight. But you may have noticed that an airplane gets cold at altitude and that condensation forms all over it when you land on a hot day. My boat has only been about 500' above sea level and that took over a week!!!!! My sailboat burns about a quart to 1/2 gallon/hour . Also my airplane burned more fuel on average during a week than my boat burns/year. We never had any problems with "OLD FUEL". If I owned a stinkpot and burned a lot of fuel I would probably keep the tanks topped off so that the boat was always ready to go. BUT AGAIN 'I've burned less than 10 gallons of fuel this year!!!!!! I normally burned more gas than that on every flight!!!!! But next time I take my sailboat up to 10,000' I will check the tank for condensation!!!!!! Also I would NEVER fly an airplane with fuel that was over a year old!!!!! And even in an airplane I rarely found any water in my sample cup. A drop or two every now and then after a rain. Ithink that water was rain water as the fill cap was in a little depression that tended to catch a little water.

 

[sailaway78]

Now wait just a minute

I have been reading the responses on this post, and most have at least some relevant information. But GuyT, I think maybe you have it bass ackwards in one of yours. You state that when the tank is warmer than the outside temp, air is drawn into the tank. I know I spent a lot of time, when in school years ago, asleep, but seems like I was taught that when things warm up they expand. And they contract when they cool down. Or did I sleep through that part too.

 

[Ross]

Moonsailor, Has it occured to you that the reason you didn't find water in the gasoline

on your Cessna was because you kept the tank topped off? The empty /full question here is simple: they both work. Half full is the worst case you can have. A large mass with considerable thermal inertia and a large volume of air from which you derive moisture and extended periods between uses. Hot days and vey cool nights are the worst. Hot days and sultry nights probably don't matter. That fuel mass has to have time to cool at night to a temperature below the daytime dew point for any of this to matter.

 

[Ross]

N&E , wouldn't that be "Now wait just a cotton pickin minute here?"

;D

 

[Maine Sail]

Ross..

First that post was taken totally out of context. Second I was referring to DIY owners who install cheap jacketed speaker wire or "lamp cord" that is NOT oil and water resistant. There are hundreds of wires suitable for use on boats but some of the wire I pulled out of mine was not. Not all wire today is made as oil and water resistant.

Even Allied Wire and Cable, a large cable & wire manufacturer, states that certain cables that are not "Oil & Water Resistant" and can thus become saturated.

Quote Allied Wire: "Can I use welding cable in marine applications?

Although welding cable is often used for battery cables in marine applications, the insulation must be oil and water-resistant. If the cable is not oil and water resistant, it can become saturated."

I know you're still a doubter of moisture passing through a jacket of a wire so I'll post the link directly to Allied Wire;

http://www.awcwire.com/FAQ-Welding-Cable.aspx

 

[Ross]

Mainesail, first off I apologise if you thought my

post was throwing off on you. That was not my intention. I was trying , in my often inept way, to agree with you. I have no doubt that much of the wiring material in use today is marginal for use on boats. Lamp cords and thermostsat wire should never leave the house. There are areas on a boat that require the finest wiring material on the market. There are other areas that are not so demanding but who is going to buy 47 different grades of wire just to save a few pennys? When I wired Bietzpadlin I used Ancor wire and cable and Ancor heat shrink terminals and tubing.

 

[GuyT]

Air motion

Air will move from cold to warm Nice&Easy - up north we can feel this phenomena by a "Cold Draft" on our doors and windows in the winter.
That is not to be confused with a "Cold Draught"

Air as it warms expands but it also becomes less dense. Cold air being more dense fills up the voids that the warm air has allowed.