Do we need yacht, or yachting, protocols and do many folks really care about them?

[Kings Gambit]

The yachtsman's world is rich with protocols, it seems. We have flag protocols, communication protocols, dress protocols, racing protocols, and ceremony protocols, to mention a few. Some are traditional extending back probably hundreds of years; others are relatively new, such as where to fly a yacht club burgee if not from the boat's masthead on a pig stick. Some are general and some are narrowly specific; such as what is done at a particular club or association on particular days. Protocols represent formality, and many folks do not especially like formality. Clearly some evolve. If nearly every boat you see is flying the US Flag below a spreader, does that eventually become "accepted" protocol b/c that's what people do? Does anyone really care where they flew it during the age of sail?

 

[justsomeguy]

Clearly some evolve.

I wish everyone would.

 

[Jackdaw]

If you sail in one geographic area only, then sure it's less of a deal. Start mixing in differing countries, languages, bouyage, flag standards, VHF frequencies and channels, and if you do not accept standardization you are in for a real mess.

 

[Brian D]

Probably has a lot to do with tradition. But I think more so the "gentlemanly" thing to do from the older days. "Yachting" was a gentleman's activity. Fishing on the other hand was done by the common folk. So to distinguish between the two, gentlemen would set rules about etiquette and making sure every thing was done properly. Very ship-shape. Very seamanship appointed. Like in Master And Commander when the Captain told his crew to be very un-seamanship to fool the French into thinking they were a whaler.

Just my take.

 

[Justin_NSA]

I think the rules., etiquette and protocols were more stringent in the early years of sailing. Militarily speaking. Yachting among gentlemen was probably more relaxed. At least more forgiven.

I sailed by another boat in our club one day and said, "pardon me, do you have any Grey Poupon?". Got a good chuckle. I may be dating myself....

 

[Benny17441]

Jackdaw, strongly agree, if you boat a small local area these do not matter but go cruising in the outside World and they will bring order and stability to your endeavors.

 

[rgranger]

.... Like in Master And Commander when the Captain told his crew to be very un-seamanship to fool the French into thinking they were a whaler.

My Favorite Show.. Now if only they would send me my royalty check.....

 

[Bob J.]

Having protocols in place for using stuff like a vhf radio is important.
All the other stuff, personally I get out on the water to get away from garbage like that.
If that means I'm not a gentlemen in some peoples eyes, so be it.

 

[capta]

I've always felt many of the traditions of "sailing" versus "yachting" were a good bit of the fun of sailing. On my old (1909) gaff rigger each evening I would light the oil anchor light and hang it in the fore triangle. As much as I can, I'll douse the running lights at the same moment the anchor drops, and on comes the anchor light. I think the steaming light is the coolest light on the boat and run it whenever appropriate. Calling things aboard by their proper name (sheet, line, helm, cleat and of course the bar) is also something I really enjoy and it does have the function that all who know the language can easily communicate.
I fly the quarantine and courtesy flags on the starboard flag halyard because that's where they belong. My national flag (if not the same as the vessel's registry) or my guests' and my house or club flag are flown to port. Vessel's national flag is aft. Need they all be so? I guess not. Certainly no LEO is gonna hassle me (except for the quarantine and courtesy flags in some countries) about it in the US. Heck, the local water Sheriff probably has no clue anyway.
Radio etiquette has a definite place aboard every vessel afloat and shame on anyone who operates a boat without knowing it.
In general, the practical traditional boating etiquette is part of the fun, sort of like immersing oneself in the culture of the places one visits, instead of hopping off the plane/cruise ship and heading for the nearest MacDonald's.

 

[Kings Gambit]

Take a practical example. Suppose you're the member of a yacht club and you're visiting another club by boat as a (reciprocal) guest. Typically, the "protocol" is to fly the burgee of your club so members of the host club know you're visiting from another club. Where do you "fly" it? I suppose just about anywhere would qualify, but "protocol" says at the masthead on a pig stick, or on a halyard run to the lower or lowest starboard spreader if more than one. What if you're an officer of your club-where should you fly that flag? OK--just below the burgee on the same halyard. Now, where should the US National Flag be flown? At the starboard stern, etc., and so it goes. If there is no protocol, then who knows where the flags would end up; probably different places on the yachts of different visitors. Would it be proper to fly the burgee at the masthead and the US National Flag on a halyard to the starboard spreader (which is where the US Flag is often flown)? No; that could or might put the burgee directly above the US Flag in certain wind conditions, which would be contrary to a very old protocol regarding the US Flag.

 

[justsomeguy]

Take a practical example.

I'll be the one wearing the tee shirt, treating everyone as if they're a guest.

 

[Kings Gambit]

I'll be the one wearing the tee shirt, treating everyone as if they're a guest.

I don't get it, please 'splain.

 

[justsomeguy]

I don't get it, please 'splain.

Call me an iconoclast.
I find the use of flags, burgees and the like, when used as identifiers to be somewhat pretentious and clique-ish, except for the courtesy and quarantine flags one might fly as a nod to one's hosting country and their attendant fears of disease, pests and economic control issues.
And even then, I can and do envision a time when we'll have free reign to travel anywhere, unencumbered by those fears.
Long after I'm gone, most likely.

 

[Kings Gambit]

Yacht clubs support the competitive sport of yacht racing. If a member of one, you might want your racing teams to win--correct? So, you display the regalia, i.e., the burgee, in support and expression of team "pride" (although the competing yachts usually do not have their club's burgee hoisted while racing). If someone is against that, then I suppose they'd also wish to see no sports regalia on display during competitive games, or otherwise. Somebody please get that silly Bruin off the field! No school mascots, no college sweat shirts bearing logos (and no NFL regalia). After all, not everyone goes to one's own school! Gee, there's an admittance procedure--better do away with that too!

 

[Justin_NSA]

We needs rules

 

[justsomeguy]

Yacht clubs support the competitive sport of yacht racing. If a member of one, you might want your racing teams to win--correct?

Bragging rights?
If I raced, I would be competing for the love of the sport, but that's just me.

So, you display the regalia, i.e., the burgee, in support and expression of team "pride" (although the competing yachts usually do not have their club's burgee hoisted while racing). If someone is against that, then I suppose they'd also wish to see no sports regalia on display during competitive games, or otherwise. Somebody please get that silly Bruin off the field!

You folks can do that if you wish, no one's stopping you. I just find it a little too "tribal" for my tastes. My peeves regarding this subject may a bit more of the macro variety.

No school mascots, no college sweat shirts bearing logos (and no NFL regalia). After all, not everyone goes to one's own school! Gee, there's an admittance procedure--better do away with that too!

Reductio ad absurdum much?
Damn I miss the war room!

 

[Jackdaw]

Yacht clubs support the competitive sport of yacht racing. If a member of one, you might want your racing teams to win--correct? So, you display the regalia, i.e., the burgee, in support and expression of team "pride" (although the competing yachts usually do not have their club's burgee hoisted while racing). If someone is against that, then I suppose they'd also wish to see no sports regalia on display during competitive games, or otherwise. Somebody please get that silly Bruin off the field! No school mascots, no college sweat shirts bearing logos (and no NFL regalia). After all, not everyone goes to one's own school! Gee, there's an admittance procedure--better do away with that too!

Yachts while racing do not fly bergees or ensigns for a very good, simple and time-honored reason. It is the one straightforward way to tell they they are racing, and are subject to ISAF RRS rules.

 

[Gunni]

So are those "ISAF RRS rules" the justification raceboat yahoos have in mind when they form up a mile-wide race line off Annapolis and insist that boats returning the South River channel "get out of the way" as they sweep down bay in phalanx?

 

[Justin_NSA]

Uh oh

 

[Kings Gambit]

Yachts while racing do not fly burgees or ensigns for a very good, simple and time-honored reason. It is the one straightforward way to tell they are racing, and are subject to ISAF RRS rules.

So, partially my point--observers would need to know what the absence of a YC burgee on a group of yachts speeding across their path means. However, I think it (the Rule) may be for a different reason; to suppress the flying of any "flags" on the yacht during a race (except a protest flag) including the national ensign and any flags or banners of an advertising nature. There might be other reasons as well. Not every racer knows this, so you'll still see some out there in a race with the club burgee hoisted and w/ the national ensign or US flag flying from the stern (considered disrespectful to the flag while racing). Protocol--who needs it?