The previous owner allowed a chainplate to leak for some time, with the result that there is some dry rot in the bulkhead it's attached to. From what I've looked at, this is not such a complicated job (other than having the keel-stepped mast removed). If I do this myself and do a good job, would this affect the resale value of the boat compared to having a professional or a yard do the work?
DIY & resale value
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Have you seen some of the work that
Have you seen some of the work that some so called pros do? You could probably do a better job, because you could take your time and do it right. Most pros race the clock so they can get onto their next job/paycheck.
Have you seen some of the work that some so called pros do? You could probably do a better job, because you could take your time and do it right. Most pros race the clock so they can get onto their next job/paycheck.
why would it?
As long as you effect a repair that is as good or better than what a yard could do which is a very relative factor. I would not trust many yards to do such work. Hire a good surveyor to consult with you on the repair if you feel you do not have the expertise to do this. Most DIYs can make such repairs that turn out better than the original job done by the factory.
As long as you effect a repair that is as good or better than what a yard could do which is a very relative factor. I would not trust many yards to do such work. Hire a good surveyor to consult with you on the repair if you feel you do not have the expertise to do this. Most DIYs can make such repairs that turn out better than the original job done by the factory.
I agree with Mike and Tim, John
If you can find a "professional" please let me know, I've been looking for years. If, however, you are interested in good workmanship, try Donnie at S&R Marine in Grand Marina. He's truly one of the good guys. Tell him I sent you. If YOU do it, you'll learn a lot. There's plenty of info on the C36 website about just your problem, as well as a great article on leaky chainplates. We have one, too, on our C34 website: http://www.c34.org/projects/projects-chain-plate-rebedding.html We also discussed this just the other day, right here: http://www.sailboatowners.com/forums/pviewall.tpl?&fno=24&uid=73200280089&sku=2008113143826.57 PS - as I recall, you're a retired carpenter, aren't you? Who could possibly do it better?
If you can find a "professional" please let me know, I've been looking for years. If, however, you are interested in good workmanship, try Donnie at S&R Marine in Grand Marina. He's truly one of the good guys. Tell him I sent you. If YOU do it, you'll learn a lot. There's plenty of info on the C36 website about just your problem, as well as a great article on leaky chainplates. We have one, too, on our C34 website: http://www.c34.org/projects/projects-chain-plate-rebedding.html We also discussed this just the other day, right here: http://www.sailboatowners.com/forums/pviewall.tpl?&fno=24&uid=73200280089&sku=2008113143826.57 PS - as I recall, you're a retired carpenter, aren't you? Who could possibly do it better?
If your lucky
You will find someone who is knowledgable, and conscientous and does good work. But chances are you won't. DIY and you know how it's done, and if it is done right.
You will find someone who is knowledgable, and conscientous and does good work. But chances are you won't. DIY and you know how it's done, and if it is done right.
Okay, you convinced me
Although I'm pretty new to boat repair, and it is different from construction carpentry, I feel pretty confident that I can do a good job. I just didn't know if doing it myself would automatically lower the value of the boat. From what others say, it won't, so I guess I have my job cut out for me for next fall! By the way, the C36 is evidently constructed differently from the C34, Stu; the chain plate is directly bolted to the bulkhead. But thanks for the link. Every bit of knowledge helps.
Although I'm pretty new to boat repair, and it is different from construction carpentry, I feel pretty confident that I can do a good job. I just didn't know if doing it myself would automatically lower the value of the boat. From what others say, it won't, so I guess I have my job cut out for me for next fall! By the way, the C36 is evidently constructed differently from the C34, Stu; the chain plate is directly bolted to the bulkhead. But thanks for the link. Every bit of knowledge helps.
John, I know the C36 and C34 chainplates are different
and mentioned the C36 website as a source for you. Here's the link to their well written article. There is also another one about fixing the bulkhead, but you should be able to find it on the old or new C36 homepage. This link's article doesn't deal with what's down below...
and mentioned the C36 website as a source for you. Here's the link to their well written article. There is also another one about fixing the bulkhead, but you should be able to find it on the old or new C36 homepage. This link's article doesn't deal with what's down below...
Go for it
Go for it John. If you have even decent carpentry skills should not be too difficult for you. As for the value, a prospective buyer probably won't know the difference, and it will more than likely be nicer than what you would get if you had it done. Any future surveyor is going to look at the quality of the repair, and won't ask or care who did it.
Go for it John. If you have even decent carpentry skills should not be too difficult for you. As for the value, a prospective buyer probably won't know the difference, and it will more than likely be nicer than what you would get if you had it done. Any future surveyor is going to look at the quality of the repair, and won't ask or care who did it.
The Catalina Site
I read the Catalina site posted, and I have to disagree with one item. I do not remove the stay. You can unscrew the plate, and raise it enough to do the necessary work. I just use a small piece of masking tape, to hold the plate up out of the way. I have never done a Catalina, but it looks from the pics like there is enough room there to just lift the plate and get to it.
I read the Catalina site posted, and I have to disagree with one item. I do not remove the stay. You can unscrew the plate, and raise it enough to do the necessary work. I just use a small piece of masking tape, to hold the plate up out of the way. I have never done a Catalina, but it looks from the pics like there is enough room there to just lift the plate and get to it.
Nice, the trick is to NOT just do the TOP
as the C34 site mentions, taking the whole assembly apart is much more watertight eventually.
as the C34 site mentions, taking the whole assembly apart is much more watertight eventually.
do it yourself
Hi, I've done this job myself. Remove bulkhead, use it as a template to cut a new bulkhead (used teak faced plywood) and a router with a bearing bit, fiberglassed it to the hull. Surveyor thought is was as good as new.
Hi, I've done this job myself. Remove bulkhead, use it as a template to cut a new bulkhead (used teak faced plywood) and a router with a bearing bit, fiberglassed it to the hull. Surveyor thought is was as good as new.
Couple of places that I know.
John: There are a couple of places that I know about. 1. The old Richmond Boat Works, now KKMI. 2. Up in the Delta at Walton's in Rio Vista. They did my compression post it it was better than the original. It also looked better than the original job. Not cheap but no one would ever ask if it was original or not.
John: There are a couple of places that I know about. 1. The old Richmond Boat Works, now KKMI. 2. Up in the Delta at Walton's in Rio Vista. They did my compression post it it was better than the original. It also looked better than the original job. Not cheap but no one would ever ask if it was original or not.
HMMMMMMMMMMMM
Stu, For me I only want the seal outside. While sealing it inside and out may be better as far as keeping water out of the boat, that is not my major concern. If you do it right, on the outside, it is sealed. If you get water inside, you know you have a leak. If you do this little operation inside and out, it is possible to get a leak on the outside that is sealed up from coming in. And where does this water go. Into the core. I can sort of see how this could work, if you slathered a bunch of caulk on there, and then pushed it back up into the hole. I didn't check the C34 site to see if that is what they implied. But basically I want to know if there is a leak at the deck, so I can take care of it, before it gets into the core. Best way to do this is to allow it to come inside where you can see it. I only do mine outside. Slide the plate up, clean it up real good, and use a good caulk. I put the plate back down, with the caulk still damp, so it squeezes up around the inside of the plate. Then screw it down. Any excess that comes out I clean up and done. Have never ever had a leak problem doing it this way.
Stu, For me I only want the seal outside. While sealing it inside and out may be better as far as keeping water out of the boat, that is not my major concern. If you do it right, on the outside, it is sealed. If you get water inside, you know you have a leak. If you do this little operation inside and out, it is possible to get a leak on the outside that is sealed up from coming in. And where does this water go. Into the core. I can sort of see how this could work, if you slathered a bunch of caulk on there, and then pushed it back up into the hole. I didn't check the C34 site to see if that is what they implied. But basically I want to know if there is a leak at the deck, so I can take care of it, before it gets into the core. Best way to do this is to allow it to come inside where you can see it. I only do mine outside. Slide the plate up, clean it up real good, and use a good caulk. I put the plate back down, with the caulk still damp, so it squeezes up around the inside of the plate. Then screw it down. Any excess that comes out I clean up and done. Have never ever had a leak problem doing it this way.
My concern..
My big concern with sealing both the top side of the deck and the bottom side, around a chain plate, would be crevice corrosion and potential failure of the chain plate..
My big concern with sealing both the top side of the deck and the bottom side, around a chain plate, would be crevice corrosion and potential failure of the chain plate..
The issue is to check the integrity
of the deck below the top seal. If water's gotten in, then fairing the edge of the hole (and the core) with epoxy after cleaning out the rotten wood is what is required. The C34 description is very good (and I did NOT write it) - it's thorough with pictures. Give it a try, and you may bookmark it and send it to others as a guide. I agree, if water's coming in, that's a great indicator. We're just dealing with degrees here, so let's all look at the referenced material and go from there.
of the deck below the top seal. If water's gotten in, then fairing the edge of the hole (and the core) with epoxy after cleaning out the rotten wood is what is required. The C34 description is very good (and I did NOT write it) - it's thorough with pictures. Give it a try, and you may bookmark it and send it to others as a guide. I agree, if water's coming in, that's a great indicator. We're just dealing with degrees here, so let's all look at the referenced material and go from there.
Nice and easy, I agree You never,ever try to keep the water from dripping out
once it has gotten in there the most important thing is that it can get out. Basic rule of the world, water (and some other things) runs down. If it gets in, let it get out!
once it has gotten in there the most important thing is that it can get out. Basic rule of the world, water (and some other things) runs down. If it gets in, let it get out!
Surveyors
When you got to sell the boat, it is likely the prospective buyer will hire a surveyor. If the job is done right, a good surveyor will note it and it won't matter who did it. The new owner of my old Irwin 32 commented to me how the surveyor liked the modifications and repairs that had been done (all by me) and he thanked me for the care I had given the boat.
When you got to sell the boat, it is likely the prospective buyer will hire a surveyor. If the job is done right, a good surveyor will note it and it won't matter who did it. The new owner of my old Irwin 32 commented to me how the surveyor liked the modifications and repairs that had been done (all by me) and he thanked me for the care I had given the boat.
I agree
I am in total agreement with you Ross. If I have some water getting into the deck I want to know. ASAP I am continually amazed by the amount of caulking I see on the inside. From my perspective caulking anything on the inside is wasted effort.
I am in total agreement with you Ross. If I have some water getting into the deck I want to know. ASAP I am continually amazed by the amount of caulking I see on the inside. From my perspective caulking anything on the inside is wasted effort.
windows
Just like installing windows, or any other sort of exterior trim on a house: Caulk the hell out of the top and sides but not the bottom. That way, if any water does get in, it has an escape route.
Just like installing windows, or any other sort of exterior trim on a house: Caulk the hell out of the top and sides but not the bottom. That way, if any water does get in, it has an escape route.
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