Defibrillation on the Yacht?
- Thread starter Kings Gambit
- Start date
Recently, even with friends on their boat, going on a 12-day cruise, we were asked to complete a medical questionnaire that the skipper retained. There may have been a liability release there as well, don’t recall. I suppose to give any meds you’d have to have them, the correct ones and dosage. And I suppose prior “permission” would also be needed. We might have to start doing this.
I remember taking a couple of friends to Santa Cruz Island where we went ashore to hike and there were wasps around. I learned after the fact that one was very strongly allergic to wasp stings. They had the remedies but I did not know that or where to find them, etc., in case I was needed to attend. Santa Cruz Island is a long way from EMS assist.
I remember taking a couple of friends to Santa Cruz Island where we went ashore to hike and there were wasps around. I learned after the fact that one was very strongly allergic to wasp stings. They had the remedies but I did not know that or where to find them, etc., in case I was needed to attend. Santa Cruz Island is a long way from EMS assist.
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Absolutely. I would really want to make a difficult decision to not take someone at the dock compared to when you learn of a condition a day already out. I’d add the location of the meds, actual names, allergies, medical history and a contact person/number. One technique is to review the info in front of the person and then put it in a sealed envelope then give it back after.
Looking further into this subject it appears that the best, perhaps only, viable treatment initially is CPR combined with epinephrine administered intravenously, as alluded above (#20). The defibrillator is sometimes there, or applied, just in case there is an arrhythmia at work that can be corrected thusly. So no, the AED will not “restart” an arrested heart on its own. The rhythm that is lost evidently is not “shockable.” Good to know now. Saves boat buck and a half.
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Epi is a class 1 for CA which means it is currently the first thing you give for certain arrhythmias, not all. If you want to do some research look up Adenosine. That stuff is amazing. It’s always exciting to give it.Looking further into this subject it appears that the best, perhaps only, viable treatment initially is CPR combined with epinephrine administered intravenously, as alluded above (#20). The defibrillator is sometimes there, or applied, just in case there is an arrhythmia at work that can be corrected thusly. So no, the AED will not “restart” an arrested heart on its own. The rhythm that is lost evidently is not “shockable.” Good to know now. Saves boat buck and a half.
I am allergic to bee stings, and I keep an epi-pen on the boat in the summer. Got stung once in the tongue (long story short, the bee flew into a can of Pepsi I was drinking, and stung me before I swallowed it). After a bit, I realized I was having a hard time breathing, and drove myself to the ER...could not talk by the time I got there...but a shot of epinephrine and all was good. I was on land at the time....if I was on the water without the Epi-pen available, not sure I would have made it.
So keep one at home and one on the boat now.
Greg
I wouldn't advise administering any IV drugs, especially epi in any event, unless you are a medical professional ( Docs, EMT, Nurse with advanced training, etc.) with at least ACLS certification. Very narrow therapeutic window that can cause cardiac arrest / death if administered improperly. Good samaritin laws protect you when performing basic life support; however, that likely would not apply if you are administering drugs that are not qualified to administer. Epi pens are much different;; pre - measured dosage & concentration administered IM for severe allergic reaction only.
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Used to call it Kryptonite, first time was terrifying, thought we'd killed him until heart restarted.
Lots of opinions here, but in the end it's your risk analysis and willingness to get trained and keep up to date that decides for you what to carry. I'm a trained first responder and I have used a defib, but on land. We're all getting older, and at sea the chances of rescue getting to you in a timely fashion are slim. The defib might save someone's life. I carry a Philips heartstart, it's compact and self instructs the user on setup and it won't fire unless it thinks it's needed. Also, it's designed to be user maintained - battery and pads are easy to change, and it comes with a training kit. I have a pretty complete trauma kit on board to handle typical boat accidents. I also have oxygen - I've carried it for scuba accidents. A couple of years ago, we had a severe allergic reaction on a new crew but no breathing distress and we were close enough to shore to call his doctor and we administered benadryl. Turned out to be shellfish allergy he didn't know he had. Since my son-in-law's family has peanut allergies, I now carry epipens as a treatment of last resort (my doctor gave me an Rx after I described why I wanted it - he had previously helped me assemble my kit).
My epipen is for me, but if someone was having an allergic reaction and was in distress, I would probably offer to administer it to them.
Greg
Greg
Training is the investment here. 12 years on ski patrol, as both an OEC (outdoor EMT) instructor, and BLS CPR instructor. I've never had to save anyone with CPR or an AED though others certainly have. The challenge is maintaining a sufficient level of skill to respond appropriately in what can be a very confusing situation that rarely happens. I took this year off and am likely to be really rusty when I go back.
I also considered an AED a few years ago but decided that it would only help if I was in a marina slip and could then call a paramedic. I have noticed that relatively few marinas seem to have an AED. That's unfortunate.
Since this thread seems to have some knowledgeable folks - what do you think of carrying oxygen? It would seem potentially more useful than an AED - but I really don't know.
And to the OP - I do carry a clotting agent. Deep cuts are certainly possible on a boat.
Since this thread seems to have some knowledgeable folks - what do you think of carrying oxygen? It would seem potentially more useful than an AED - but I really don't know.
And to the OP - I do carry a clotting agent. Deep cuts are certainly possible on a boat.
Not for CA but defiantly for breather patients like COPD or Congestive Heart Failure. You would have to have a big bottle. Compressed gas of a oxidizer on a boat.........cost to benefit again......
There is some interesting literature out that talks about the effectiveness of different type of tourniquets. I have always just planned on using a belt or something. There is a high rate of failure if the application doesn’t use the twist stick (can’t remember what it is called) to tighten it down.
I carry an air splint for lower extremities, mostly because I have one and it takes little space. Chemical cold pack, mylar blanket. SAM splint, vet wrap, roller gauze, 4x4's, Burn Jel and a collection of bandaids, small tools and odds and ends. The bandaids get used, but not much else fortunately.
My emergency kit includes a very handy intensive care registered nurse who is certified in basic life support, CPR & such. The unfortunate thing is she doesn't always go with me on the boat...
As others have noted above, she too has told me that survival after the need for and an attempt of CPR is low even when everything is close by. We too have discussed buying an AED to have at home but never gotten around to it.
As others have noted above, she too has told me that survival after the need for and an attempt of CPR is low even when everything is close by. We too have discussed buying an AED to have at home but never gotten around to it.
The best course of action is to follow the KISS formula.. Too many meds is a sure way to complicate an already compromised system. NSAIDs were mentioned. These are contraindicated for persons on anticoagulants such as Xarelto. Tylenol to can effect people with liver disorders. Oxygen is considered a drug and may require a script to acquire.
So, stay with your original thought regarding the AED. A water proof case would be advantageous and record in an obvious location the expiration dates of the battery and electrodes. Resist the sales effort to acquire extra sets of electrodes ( patches) as you may very be tossing them all out at the same time.
In any event, prior to any intervention you need to contact the USCG for an EMS response.
So, stay with your original thought regarding the AED. A water proof case would be advantageous and record in an obvious location the expiration dates of the battery and electrodes. Resist the sales effort to acquire extra sets of electrodes ( patches) as you may very be tossing them all out at the same time.
In any event, prior to any intervention you need to contact the USCG for an EMS response.
Our cruising club in FL had doctors and nurses who were members, and who attended the cruise outs. Once, one of our elderly members, a retired army colonel, fell through his companionway and broke an arm. The nurse who was on the cruise set and wrapped it in a sling. We got him ashore and sent him off to the hospital. All in a day’s work! Another time while we were anchored with the club the admiral started having some kind of debilitating allergy attack that was impacting her breathing. A bit frightening
. Less than 300 ft away in their boat were two members, married physicians, and their medical kits. We took her over, they administered Benadryl (shot), and she was fine after that. We finished the cruise. So—I get your point!A few years ago a friend asked me to help him with the Baja Bash; i.e., bringing his boat home to Long Beach from Cabo San Lucas. I went down there but ultimately had to fly home b/c no suitable weather window appeared (It was spring time—May.) in the time I had left to commit. (There was back-up, so he got the boat home w/o my help.) He was in the EM business. The medical “kit” he had aboard was more the size of a small trunk. It was larger than his tool kit. Couldn’t find the right screw driver, but if I had needed a shot—it was there!
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i ain't saying they will save my life, but they will be able the pronounce me dead, have the traditional burial at sea, and continue the cruise as planned
