Thanks to the remains of hurricane Ivan, I got my first chance over the weekend to practice a little bit in wind bigger than I am used to in my Oday 25( 25-30 mph ). Once I was out on the water it occured to me that I didnt know the order in which sail area should be decreased. For example should I reef the main first or hank on a smaller front sail, sail with no front sail at all or sail with just the front sail, etc. Are there some general rules on how you decrease sail area and still keep the boat moving forward effeciently? I opted on not raising my storm jib and just raised a reefed main. I had a hard time standing my ground while sailing upwind.
Decreasing sail area in higher winds?
- Thread starter JayK
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Depends on your boat
Hello, Much of what you do depends on your boat set-up. If you have a roller-reefing headsail, the easiest thing to do when the wind picks up is to shorten that sail. Note that you can't change it too much and have it still be effective. Maybe you can go from a 150 to a 130 genoa or so. If there is still too much wind you should reef the main. Still too much wind, then change the headsail to a jib or smaller. Still too much? If it were me I would lower all sail and go home! Also, if your boat has a masthead or fractional rig will make a difference. With a masthead rig the headsail provides a lot of power. Without a headsail you can't go to weather very well. You would be better off with a 100% jib and double reefed main than single reefed main and no jib. If you have a fractional rig, then maybe you don't need the headsail. I wanted badly to sail Sunday (or was that sail badly?) but the weather was too rough for me and my crew (wife and 3 young kids). I did go to the boat in the afternoon and the LI Sound was very rough, large waves, whitecaps as far as I could see, blowing spray, etc. So I'm glad I didn't subject my family to that. Barry
Hello, Much of what you do depends on your boat set-up. If you have a roller-reefing headsail, the easiest thing to do when the wind picks up is to shorten that sail. Note that you can't change it too much and have it still be effective. Maybe you can go from a 150 to a 130 genoa or so. If there is still too much wind you should reef the main. Still too much wind, then change the headsail to a jib or smaller. Still too much? If it were me I would lower all sail and go home! Also, if your boat has a masthead or fractional rig will make a difference. With a masthead rig the headsail provides a lot of power. Without a headsail you can't go to weather very well. You would be better off with a 100% jib and double reefed main than single reefed main and no jib. If you have a fractional rig, then maybe you don't need the headsail. I wanted badly to sail Sunday (or was that sail badly?) but the weather was too rough for me and my crew (wife and 3 young kids). I did go to the boat in the afternoon and the LI Sound was very rough, large waves, whitecaps as far as I could see, blowing spray, etc. So I'm glad I didn't subject my family to that. Barry
Agree
The Oday 25 usually balances better with a smaller jib AND a reef or two in the main. Any gusts are easily dumped with the mainsheet or traveller without heavily luffing/flogging the main. Plus: Smaller jibs are easier to tack in big winds. If you prefer to sail with main only, I suggest putting more ballast in the bow. Move everything from the lazarettes to the vberth and it'll help some. This keeps the keel working better and pulling the boat to windward.
The Oday 25 usually balances better with a smaller jib AND a reef or two in the main. Any gusts are easily dumped with the mainsheet or traveller without heavily luffing/flogging the main. Plus: Smaller jibs are easier to tack in big winds. If you prefer to sail with main only, I suggest putting more ballast in the bow. Move everything from the lazarettes to the vberth and it'll help some. This keeps the keel working better and pulling the boat to windward.
We reef the main first
That reducs the weather helm that builds up in higher winds. Then comes the jib, then the main again. Remember that you need to move the jib fairleads forward to keep any kind of shape in the sail when tou roller reef it. We also have a 110 as our standard foresail, using an asymetric for light air. That sets us up to get to an 80 jib, and a double reefed main if things really pipe up. David Lady Lillie
That reducs the weather helm that builds up in higher winds. Then comes the jib, then the main again. Remember that you need to move the jib fairleads forward to keep any kind of shape in the sail when tou roller reef it. We also have a 110 as our standard foresail, using an asymetric for light air. That sets us up to get to an 80 jib, and a double reefed main if things really pipe up. David Lady Lillie
Try this
1. If whitecaps, do first mainsail reef at dock. 2. If it calms down out there, unroll the jib. 3. If pipes up too much, pull in the jib. Took a class Sat in 20-25 and sailed 51 miles!
1. If whitecaps, do first mainsail reef at dock. 2. If it calms down out there, unroll the jib. 3. If pipes up too much, pull in the jib. Took a class Sat in 20-25 and sailed 51 miles!
Hey BarryL, and other LIS sailors. Make me feel
better. I also wanted to sail badly on Sunday. This is my first year on LIS and it hasn't been very good for weekends. Both Memorial Day and Labor Day weekends had small craft advisories and other weekends also, like this one. I've only sailed in those sweet 10-15 southerlies three times this season. I know this summer has been an off one for weather but is a "normal" one better on the LIS? I have an Oday 222 so when it kicks up I have to stay home. I'm ok in 20 or a bit higher when reefed but only when the wind direction is on a short fetch such as straight south or north and I can stay in Fishers Island sound. Needless to say I've been frustrated in this my first year on LIS.
better. I also wanted to sail badly on Sunday. This is my first year on LIS and it hasn't been very good for weekends. Both Memorial Day and Labor Day weekends had small craft advisories and other weekends also, like this one. I've only sailed in those sweet 10-15 southerlies three times this season. I know this summer has been an off one for weather but is a "normal" one better on the LIS? I have an Oday 222 so when it kicks up I have to stay home. I'm ok in 20 or a bit higher when reefed but only when the wind direction is on a short fetch such as straight south or north and I can stay in Fishers Island sound. Needless to say I've been frustrated in this my first year on LIS.
We sailed the Greenwich Cup....
... this weekend on a J 27. About 1/2 the fleet did not show up on Sunday. It was blowing 25 to 40 kts and a 4-5 ft chop. Our first weather leg was sailed with a #3 only. Boat speed was 6 to 6.4 up wind and 10+ down. Second weather leg we carried a reefed main which increased our pointing and better VMG. No chutes down, just a poled out #3.
... this weekend on a J 27. About 1/2 the fleet did not show up on Sunday. It was blowing 25 to 40 kts and a 4-5 ft chop. Our first weather leg was sailed with a #3 only. Boat speed was 6 to 6.4 up wind and 10+ down. Second weather leg we carried a reefed main which increased our pointing and better VMG. No chutes down, just a poled out #3.
20 degrees heel rule of thumb
Rule of thumb I use is reef the main when the boat heels over twenty degrees. Think of it this way. Once a displacement hull reaches hull speed any more power will only cause more heel and extra stress on the rig and crew but no additional speed. With the boat heeled more the rudder loses efficiency as it has a large vertical force component trying to push the stern out of the water. I use a 110% jib as standard on a roller furler so I can carry the jib in a lot broader conditions than people using 150% genny's. I also have an asymmetrical for light air. Trying to use a semi-rolled up headsail is painful at best, better to use the right size jib for the conditions. Dave
Rule of thumb I use is reef the main when the boat heels over twenty degrees. Think of it this way. Once a displacement hull reaches hull speed any more power will only cause more heel and extra stress on the rig and crew but no additional speed. With the boat heeled more the rudder loses efficiency as it has a large vertical force component trying to push the stern out of the water. I use a 110% jib as standard on a roller furler so I can carry the jib in a lot broader conditions than people using 150% genny's. I also have an asymmetrical for light air. Trying to use a semi-rolled up headsail is painful at best, better to use the right size jib for the conditions. Dave
Rob and the LIS
Hi Rob, This season has been strange. Many times we had either no wind, or too much wind. There have been only a few days with real good wind. But what can you do? I started the year with a Catalina 22. It was a nice boat, but not really heavy enough (IMHO) for the open Long Island Sound. I am not a very experienced sailor, this being my second year, and my family (and I) were not comfortable at all when the wind picked up to 15+ kts and the waves to 3-4 ft. We tried sailing a few times in windy conditions, but after the kids screamed and hid in the cabin we headed home. Anyway, I suffered from 'bigger boat-itis' so I sold the Catalina and bought a Newport 28. The Newport is much better at handling bigger waves and more wind. We had a great sail a few weeks ago when the wind was 15-20 kts and the waves 3-4. We went out with a reefed main and a full 150 jib and the boat was just great. If we were on the C22 everyone would have been screaming. On the N28 we had a great time. The boat was moving at 5-6 kts and 15-20 degrees of heel. We took a lot of water over the bow and the kids just laughed at it. Anyway, with a smaller boat maybe you are better off staying in more protected water? Fortunately, I was able to do a lot of sailing midweek during the summer evenings. The weather was good, no crowds to deal with, and I found I realy like night sailing. In fact, tomorrow I'm going to take the two younger kids (3 and 6) and get to the boat at 5:30, sail for 2 hours, then head home. Take care, Barry
Hi Rob, This season has been strange. Many times we had either no wind, or too much wind. There have been only a few days with real good wind. But what can you do? I started the year with a Catalina 22. It was a nice boat, but not really heavy enough (IMHO) for the open Long Island Sound. I am not a very experienced sailor, this being my second year, and my family (and I) were not comfortable at all when the wind picked up to 15+ kts and the waves to 3-4 ft. We tried sailing a few times in windy conditions, but after the kids screamed and hid in the cabin we headed home. Anyway, I suffered from 'bigger boat-itis' so I sold the Catalina and bought a Newport 28. The Newport is much better at handling bigger waves and more wind. We had a great sail a few weeks ago when the wind was 15-20 kts and the waves 3-4. We went out with a reefed main and a full 150 jib and the boat was just great. If we were on the C22 everyone would have been screaming. On the N28 we had a great time. The boat was moving at 5-6 kts and 15-20 degrees of heel. We took a lot of water over the bow and the kids just laughed at it. Anyway, with a smaller boat maybe you are better off staying in more protected water? Fortunately, I was able to do a lot of sailing midweek during the summer evenings. The weather was good, no crowds to deal with, and I found I realy like night sailing. In fact, tomorrow I'm going to take the two younger kids (3 and 6) and get to the boat at 5:30, sail for 2 hours, then head home. Take care, Barry
Thanks!
Thanks to all for the info. I dont have a roller furler so actually going up to the bow and changing it is a little bit of a chore when it is blowing hard. But in any case looking back on it I should have tried putting a small 50% jib out and a double reefed main to see if it handled / balanced any better. Next time its that windy out on the hudson Ill have to give it a try for sure! It was fun in any case....
Thanks to all for the info. I dont have a roller furler so actually going up to the bow and changing it is a little bit of a chore when it is blowing hard. But in any case looking back on it I should have tried putting a small 50% jib out and a double reefed main to see if it handled / balanced any better. Next time its that windy out on the hudson Ill have to give it a try for sure! It was fun in any case....
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