Dave, what do you think?

[John23883]

So Crazy Dave, in my old age I am tired of having the mainsheet in the way and most of all not being able to raise the bimini when it is hot or raining. So I am doing the numbers on a traveler across the cabin top.

Do you know how much aluminum is under the clutch plates on the H26?

What are your thoughts on this? I'll fasten a traveler track to the bar and a couple of bales to the boom. The numbers show the boom will be ok and I think the cabin roof will be fine as well, but I would like to hear what you have to say.
Thanks,
John

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

Not a good idea. First there are only a few places with encapsulated aluminum in the cabin coach house deck which is not enough. Secondly, I do not feel that it is strong enough if under tremendous load and fear what damage it could do. Hunter never advised this. Finally, you would kick yourself with that piece of metal in the way when going into the cabin.

I am not sure about the bimini. Where did it come from? The ones built by Ameriseam were long enough just to go right up to the mainsheet which came either in a 4 or 6 foot section. Advise.

I have placed a traveler right on the flat surface in front of the companionway entrance and added an additional u hanger for lack of terms on the boom forward. However, You can move the original hanger that the mainsheet attaches on the boom forward so the bimini will not hit the mainsheet. I did this for the 6 footer bimini from Ameriseam. Cannot recall the distance moving the attachment forward on the boom but it worked fine. Hope this helps you sir.

crazy dave

 

[John23883]

Dave

The bimini came with the boat from the previous owner and it's huge! Which is nice when you need one. I would guess it is 8 feet in length as It actually hangs over the cabin about 8 inches and the back is about even with the stern.

Since we never open the sliding hatch more than about 6 or 8 inches, I wouldn't hit my head on it, as I never hit my head on the sliding hatch itself.

I did talk to z-spars and they don't have a problem with me moving the attachment point on the boom to mid-boom position. Obviously, they way over-built it. Always a good thing on a sailboat.

I have been on Dave Craigie's boat and he has his traveler on that flat surface at the entrance of the cabin and he has had no problems over the years.

I did a lot of looking at cabin-top travelers in Traverse Bay a few weeks ago and their attachment points in some cases are only about 2 inches by 3 inches in some cases. Of course, there is no telling how big the plate is imbedded in the fiberglass.

According to the Harken calculator the load would be about 550 lbs. at 15 knots of wind.

I'll keep thinking....

Thanks for the advice!
John

 

[Chris14830]

Hi John, I think Dave's advice is worth heeding. However if you have your heart set, you could put a massive backing plate inside to distribute the load:
http://forums.hunter.sailboatowners...028bddda178f09ee7c99d_19018.jpg?dl=1372992928
(I hope that link worked.)
I would think it's the accidental heavy wind jibe that will cause the damage. It would be difficult to calculate the shock load.
Good luck either way.
-Chris

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

John;

Remeasure the length of the bimini and advise the actual length and not estimated. The 6 foot bimini from Ameriseam was as long as we could put on the boat. IF it is 8 feet, then send it off and have it cut back which I recommend a maker do vs. you as you do not have the experience. Again, I urge you to forget doing anything with a traveler on top. I did not tell you but might as well. I repaired a customer' coach house or companionway top as he tried and it was overstressed in high wind and I had to repair it. Repair bill was very expensive. So if you insist, I will not help you or advise any further. The bimini if it is 8 foot will not work and will have to be recut to a 6 foot. Trust me here on this one sir.

crazy dave condon

 

[Brian M H23]

Easier answer - perhaps a you could add a zipper and make the foremost poles adjustable length, to shorten the bimini while underway

 

[John23883]

Huge bimini

I just measured the bimini and it is 87" wide by 96" long. One of the things I like about it is that it goes all the way to the stern and overlaps the hatch by 8 1/2 inches and that is nice when motoring in the rain as it keeps most of the rain from coming in the cabin.

 

[John23883]

OK, change of direction...

After reading what Dave had to say, I must change direction. Placing the traveler on the step is a good way of moving the mainsheet out of the middle and I have a friend who has done just that and it works well. However for a variety of reasons the step mounted traveler won't work for me.

I pulled off the inspection plates for the winches and they are only held on by bolts and large washers. I suspect there is no aluminum backing plate, just the washers. So I fear that any backing plates that are in the roof are small and unusable.

It occurs to me that I can cut two 4 inch by 4.5 inch inspection holes in the headliner and then reattach the pieces I remove, if I am careful. This would allow me to slip a 4 inch wide by say 12 inch long piece of aluminum between the headliner and the roof. Drilled and tapped to match the traveler bracket and epoxy spread on the top of the plated to adhere to the roof once bolted in place.

Now I need to figure out the actual size the backing plate needs to be and the orientation required to take the stress. If I can find the answer to these two questions, I think this project is feasible.

But, it must only be done if the stress analysis numbers can be made to work. We'll see!

 

[BrianW]

John, when you calculate the shock load forces from a 20 knot accidental gybe, please share that number with us. You know, the force that has snapped our sail slugs and damaged our rigging. I'm sure there is a way to figure this, but up to now, that number has evaded me. BrianW

 

[Steve Dion]

If you insist on doing this you will need to consider thru bolting risers to the cabin and having a custom track made.

Garhauer Marine would be an excellent option. As Dave indicated this is really not advisable and it is doubtful that you are going to find any alum. backing plates where you need them.

www.garhauermarine.com

 

[Brian M H23]

Disclaimer: Not a Naval Architect

This boat isn't that heavy, and fin keeled - there is really a practical limit to the impact on the traveler because the boat itself has some give. I mean, how reinforced is the attachment to the cockpit floor; a piece of plywood glassed on the back and a single U-bolt? And then the traveler itself has shock absorbtion in the lines, plus the mainsheet, I doubt he's using ultra low stretch racing lines. This is far from a hard impact.

Just do it, and make sure your two attachments are at least as strong as the existing one. 3/8" fiberglass backers epoxied to the underside of the cabin, through bolt your bar with nice big washers, and go sailing.

In any case, the boats isn't exactly designed to take high wind flying gybes anyway, as the sail slugs and rigging coming apart would indicate.

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

I just responded privately advising this is the long bimini probably made by Ameriseam advising to move the attachment of the mainsheet further forward on the boom as it supposedly should be. However, the wife likes to sit in front of the companionway and/or stand in the companionway. I am not sure what to say other than to sit under the bimini further back in the cockpit while under sail. If at anchor or motoring without sailing of course, the bottom of the mainsheet on the deck can be attached to the life line or bottom of the station so the boom is out of the way. I stil advise against any traveler on top of the cabin coach house. If anyone does, then there is a saying I told you so.