A few days back a post was written about end splicing a continuous furling line. I've been there and created (what I thought, at least) was a perfect end splice. Unfortunately, over a few seasons of continuous usage, the splice has very slowly been slipping apart along the length. This is probably due to the fact that the splice is continuously being worked around the sheave at the mast. Has anyone come across a glue which will stick to polyester line and prevent this slippage ? Thanks and Regards, s/v Island Hunter
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Glue is not the answer
Hi, neighbor, Glue is not the answer. I've done several end for end splices now and so far they are all holding. Let me tell you a true tale, however, in answering your question. I have a Hunter 380 with a roller furling main and a continuous furling line. About a year after I got the boat, the furling line came apart--two ends. So I bought a video tape on splicing at West Marine made by Brion Toss (Port Townsend) for $29.95, a "wand" marketed by BT for splicing, $49.95 and some new furling line, around $60 green ones (Opps, I forgot what colour in Canada). Then I spent a number of hours watching the tape at home. Because I didn't have a video on board, I also bought the book that Brion Toss wrote for $19.95 so I could take that with me. So I went down to the boat, rerove the furling line and started in on the splice. I measured carefully like he said, did my cuts and started in. Things did not work well and the damn wand would not go through the double braid line that I had bought. I pushed and pushed and it wouldn't go. Finally I broke the damn wand (by now "damn" was the least of my adjectives). Back home I watch the tape again, but before I could really see what I was doing wrong, the tape jammed in my VCR. I took the VCR apart, cleaned and set it right and put it back again. Once more I started the tape and once more it jammed--this time it wrecked my video tape. So back to West Marine and buy another video tape $29.95 and another wand ($49.95), over to the Good Guys and buy a new VCR (I have to have the top of the line to go with my top of the line boat) for $395.00. Back home to set up the new VCR and watch the new tape--can't see a thing that I'm doing wrong. Back to the boat and I break the second wand trying to push the line through. Double Damn! Back home to watch tape again and there it was plain as it could be, Brion puts the want in and PULLS the line through, he doesn't push it. Back to the boat again and using one of the broken wands, I finish the splice and it looks good. I don't want to know what this splice has cost me but it was considerable. But I watch the video tape one more time (don't worry, nothing happens), I'm getting good at looking closely at the tape and Brion says after the splice is done to stitch it with sail thread a number of times throughout the splice. Back to the boat and I do just that. That part of the video tape is not very long nor does it sound important but a friend didn't sew the lines together on his splice and his came apart. Brion was a good guy and repaired both my wands as soon as he quit laughing. I've been to Port Townsend and have laughed over this story with him. Interestingly, I had the old VCR repaired and it now works fine--I now have two VCRs and of course, we going to switch to DVDs. I also bought a 9" TV with VCR to take to the boat for my next splice (Got a deal, $169.95) which puts my splice expenses in the neighborhood of $800 American dollars. Not bad for my first splice. I don't think glue will work; want me to come to Vancouver and do your splice? I don't charge much.
Les
Hi, neighbor, Glue is not the answer. I've done several end for end splices now and so far they are all holding. Let me tell you a true tale, however, in answering your question. I have a Hunter 380 with a roller furling main and a continuous furling line. About a year after I got the boat, the furling line came apart--two ends. So I bought a video tape on splicing at West Marine made by Brion Toss (Port Townsend) for $29.95, a "wand" marketed by BT for splicing, $49.95 and some new furling line, around $60 green ones (Opps, I forgot what colour in Canada). Then I spent a number of hours watching the tape at home. Because I didn't have a video on board, I also bought the book that Brion Toss wrote for $19.95 so I could take that with me. So I went down to the boat, rerove the furling line and started in on the splice. I measured carefully like he said, did my cuts and started in. Things did not work well and the damn wand would not go through the double braid line that I had bought. I pushed and pushed and it wouldn't go. Finally I broke the damn wand (by now "damn" was the least of my adjectives). Back home I watch the tape again, but before I could really see what I was doing wrong, the tape jammed in my VCR. I took the VCR apart, cleaned and set it right and put it back again. Once more I started the tape and once more it jammed--this time it wrecked my video tape. So back to West Marine and buy another video tape $29.95 and another wand ($49.95), over to the Good Guys and buy a new VCR (I have to have the top of the line to go with my top of the line boat) for $395.00. Back home to set up the new VCR and watch the new tape--can't see a thing that I'm doing wrong. Back to the boat and I break the second wand trying to push the line through. Double Damn! Back home to watch tape again and there it was plain as it could be, Brion puts the want in and PULLS the line through, he doesn't push it. Back to the boat again and using one of the broken wands, I finish the splice and it looks good. I don't want to know what this splice has cost me but it was considerable. But I watch the video tape one more time (don't worry, nothing happens), I'm getting good at looking closely at the tape and Brion says after the splice is done to stitch it with sail thread a number of times throughout the splice. Back to the boat and I do just that. That part of the video tape is not very long nor does it sound important but a friend didn't sew the lines together on his splice and his came apart. Brion was a good guy and repaired both my wands as soon as he quit laughing. I've been to Port Townsend and have laughed over this story with him. Interestingly, I had the old VCR repaired and it now works fine--I now have two VCRs and of course, we going to switch to DVDs. I also bought a 9" TV with VCR to take to the boat for my next splice (Got a deal, $169.95) which puts my splice expenses in the neighborhood of $800 American dollars. Not bad for my first splice. I don't think glue will work; want me to come to Vancouver and do your splice? I don't charge much.
LesA Knot?
Ralph, I have a conventional furler with a line wound on a drum. However I have noticed that the point where the line meets the drum when the sail is unfurled only comes part way towards the cockpit when the sail is furled up. Does this lead one to understand that with an endless line one part of the loop will never touch the furling sheave or the cockpit winch? If this is so on your boat then a simple old knot might do - The line will need to be quite tight else it might slip on the furling sheave. Think about it. Regards.
Ralph, I have a conventional furler with a line wound on a drum. However I have noticed that the point where the line meets the drum when the sail is unfurled only comes part way towards the cockpit when the sail is furled up. Does this lead one to understand that with an endless line one part of the loop will never touch the furling sheave or the cockpit winch? If this is so on your boat then a simple old knot might do - The line will need to be quite tight else it might slip on the furling sheave. Think about it. Regards.
No. 2 sail thread
It is considered good practice to secure double braided rope splices with some simple stitching. To secure your splice, I would use no. 2 sail thread. No. 4 may be too thick for smooth operation around the mast drum. You will also need some large eye needles. Do not use tapestry needles although they look like they will work fine. Tapestry needles are too blunt to go through double braided line. Bachelor's tip: the large eye needles and no. 2 thread work great for sewing on buttons. They are easier to use than button thread and regular sewing needles.
It is considered good practice to secure double braided rope splices with some simple stitching. To secure your splice, I would use no. 2 sail thread. No. 4 may be too thick for smooth operation around the mast drum. You will also need some large eye needles. Do not use tapestry needles although they look like they will work fine. Tapestry needles are too blunt to go through double braided line. Bachelor's tip: the large eye needles and no. 2 thread work great for sewing on buttons. They are easier to use than button thread and regular sewing needles.
Great Story Les !
I really enjoyed your story. Thanks for sharing this. And thanks for all the tips and lessons. Hopefully this will save others from so much pain when trying this. I purchased all the tools to splice braid on braid and took a course given by a friend in our local power squadron (not a regular power squadron course)and was delighted when I completed my first eye splice. This skill has come in handy. I have never done an end splice for continuous furler line but that sounds like a challenge. Your story reminded me about the guy that cut and burned his own firewood to save money. Other than the cost of the stove and the new 4wd pickup truck and chain saw, there were miscellaneous cost, medical bills, a new window in the back of the pickup, steel toe shoes, repainting the interior of the house to cover the smoke damage and it went on and on. But there was great satisfaction !
I really enjoyed your story. Thanks for sharing this. And thanks for all the tips and lessons. Hopefully this will save others from so much pain when trying this. I purchased all the tools to splice braid on braid and took a course given by a friend in our local power squadron (not a regular power squadron course)and was delighted when I completed my first eye splice. This skill has come in handy. I have never done an end splice for continuous furler line but that sounds like a challenge. Your story reminded me about the guy that cut and burned his own firewood to save money. Other than the cost of the stove and the new 4wd pickup truck and chain saw, there were miscellaneous cost, medical bills, a new window in the back of the pickup, steel toe shoes, repainting the interior of the house to cover the smoke damage and it went on and on. But there was great satisfaction !
A Real Pain
I have had the same problem -- what a royal pain! The best answer I can come up with is to start aving for a new furling system! The continous line furling system should go the way of the 8-track!
I have had the same problem -- what a royal pain! The best answer I can come up with is to start aving for a new furling system! The continous line furling system should go the way of the 8-track!
Les, it is a little late but did...
Les: I know it is a little late know but did you EVER consider switching to a single line furler. In all the years that I have been on this wonder website, I don't think I have ever heard anyone say that they would rather have a continous line furler. The store here on the website probably sells the best furler made. If someone is thinging about a furler for a 30' boat or larger they should take a look at the Spin-tec furler.
Les: I know it is a little late know but did you EVER consider switching to a single line furler. In all the years that I have been on this wonder website, I don't think I have ever heard anyone say that they would rather have a continous line furler. The store here on the website probably sells the best furler made. If someone is thinging about a furler for a 30' boat or larger they should take a look at the Spin-tec furler.
I'm a cheater
I feel guilty, I just hired a local rigger who charged me $25 to do that splice. It has held for five years now with no problems. I admit it would be a good to know skill but I'm sure that with my seven remaining brain cells I'd forget how to do it before I got off the boat.
I feel guilty, I just hired a local rigger who charged me $25 to do that splice. It has held for five years now with no problems. I admit it would be a good to know skill but I'm sure that with my seven remaining brain cells I'd forget how to do it before I got off the boat.
Cheaters are nice people too.
Steven: I am with you on this point. When I go to the sailboat shows and see these guys splicing these braided lines I think to my self. 'How much time do I have left in this world' (not that much). Sometimes it is good to know your limitations (of which I have many)
Steven: I am with you on this point. When I go to the sailboat shows and see these guys splicing these braided lines I think to my self. 'How much time do I have left in this world' (not that much). Sometimes it is good to know your limitations (of which I have many)
You don't give me much hope
To the two Steves, First, my wife has already taken the position that I should have had it done professionally. But just between you and me, I now can suggest that I get something done by a professional and she seys yes right away--she sees me as Tim, the Toolman sorta guy. This has been a bonus. But the sad part of your e-mails is that you only paid $25 for your splice. I have to do 32 end to end splices to recoup my loses. And the way I work that means about 30 days. I'm in deep trouble--I don't think there are thirty two roller furling lines in the harbor. Her nibs is going to kill me.
To the two Steves, First, my wife has already taken the position that I should have had it done professionally. But just between you and me, I now can suggest that I get something done by a professional and she seys yes right away--she sees me as Tim, the Toolman sorta guy. This has been a bonus. But the sad part of your e-mails is that you only paid $25 for your splice. I have to do 32 end to end splices to recoup my loses. And the way I work that means about 30 days. I'm in deep trouble--I don't think there are thirty two roller furling lines in the harbor. Her nibs is going to kill me.
something missing in your equation.
Les: There is something missing in your equation. You say that you need to do 32 splices. You ARE making an assumption that you DO NOT break any more fids. Based on your track record, you may NEVER EVER catch up on the ROI (return on investment)<g>. Do you remember the song by Kenny Rogers "The Gambler", you gotta know when to holdem, know when to foldem, know when to walk away and know when to run.....<haha> I'm sitting here laughing, cause I have done this more than once myself.
Les: There is something missing in your equation. You say that you need to do 32 splices. You ARE making an assumption that you DO NOT break any more fids. Based on your track record, you may NEVER EVER catch up on the ROI (return on investment)<g>. Do you remember the song by Kenny Rogers "The Gambler", you gotta know when to holdem, know when to foldem, know when to walk away and know when to run.....<haha> I'm sitting here laughing, cause I have done this more than once myself.
Ahh, Steve, Steve....
You don't give a guy much hope. You're probably correct that something else will go wrong. With my track record (should that be spelled "wreckord"?) I probably will drop something overboard or cut the line too short. But at least I have the knowledge and confidence (notice the word "fid" embedded in that last word?) to do an end for end splice. Thanks for laughing with me. Les
You don't give a guy much hope. You're probably correct that something else will go wrong. With my track record (should that be spelled "wreckord"?) I probably will drop something overboard or cut the line too short. But at least I have the knowledge and confidence (notice the word "fid" embedded in that last word?) to do an end for end splice. Thanks for laughing with me. Les
Dave's Super Splicing Tool
This brings up another disatisfied customer of these expensive highway robbery splicing wands and tools that break and are too hard to figure out the instructions. Search on this site and see my Super Splicing Tool. I made this tool for less than 50 cents (materials = free time = 50 cents. It works better than anything you can buy!!! I broke three different tools before I decided to invent my own. I should sell these for 49.95 but how much would you pay for a bent up coat hanger. THIS IS THE BEST SPLICING TOOL EVER INVENTED!! best regards, dave
This brings up another disatisfied customer of these expensive highway robbery splicing wands and tools that break and are too hard to figure out the instructions. Search on this site and see my Super Splicing Tool. I made this tool for less than 50 cents (materials = free time = 50 cents. It works better than anything you can buy!!! I broke three different tools before I decided to invent my own. I should sell these for 49.95 but how much would you pay for a bent up coat hanger. THIS IS THE BEST SPLICING TOOL EVER INVENTED!! best regards, dave
he was a friend
It makes you feel any better, the guy I paid the $25 to is not only a rigger but a friend. He comes over occasionally for coffee and a good BS session, I cough up some cash and he does what ever kind of black-magic he does on my yacht braid, it is the kind of relationship my wife cleanly approves of.... As for the price, I suspect he is giving me a deal but I've never hired anyone else so I don't know the going rate.
It makes you feel any better, the guy I paid the $25 to is not only a rigger but a friend. He comes over occasionally for coffee and a good BS session, I cough up some cash and he does what ever kind of black-magic he does on my yacht braid, it is the kind of relationship my wife cleanly approves of.... As for the price, I suspect he is giving me a deal but I've never hired anyone else so I don't know the going rate.
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