My wife and I are about a week away from putting a deposit down on a new H380. This will be our first big boat. We currently have a 1995 H23.5 that we bought new, but we did not have to go through any commisioning process with it. I've been reading on this site about how much of a nightmare the commisioning process is on a new boat. You all have me terrified now. Could you all please explain why commisioning is such a problem and maybe give me some tips on what to look out for when the commissioning of my boat begins. Unless there is a drastic change in plans within the next week, I'll will be buying my boat through Tidewater in Annapolis, Md. Has anyone had any good/bad experiences with them? I'd appreciate any input you experienced big boat buyers have. I'm beginning to have anxiety attacks in the middle of the night now and wouldn't mind some positive feedback to alleviate them. Thanks, Marty
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Commissioning
I have bought and commissioned 2 boats new, a 29.5 and a 340, and the biggest problem that I have had is getting the boat when promised. I have bought both boats through Sandy Hook Yacht Sales and found them to be very good at getting the boat rigged and in the water, the major problem is that everyone wants their boat in the water at the same time (early spring) and Mother Nature is not always cooperative, especially in the Spring. This makes it harder for the dealer to have the boat ready when promised. Both of my boats had minor problems after they were commissioned but were fixed quickly, either by the dealer or myself with dealer supplied parts. All in all both times have been relatively painless and in fact in was kind of fun to spend time on the boat before it went in the water, "exploring." We have talked to Tidewater on many occasions, but have always gone back to Sandy Hook Yacht Sales. I like their willingness to talk and I know that I have gotten better pricing form Sandy Hook. From what I have heard about Tidewater, they do a nice job on commissioning boats and most owners are happy with their work. While I'm sure that there are horror stories about commissioning a boat at both Tidewater and Sandy Hook, there are also many good ones that you never hear about, where everything went exactly as planned. My suggestion would be to get everything in writing, what the dealer is suposed to do and by when. Another suggestion would be to be involved, I don't mean to help (hinder) the yard workers, but go down often and check on their work. If you see something that you don't think is right get in touch with your salesperson immediately. Another thing that you could is to hold back a portion of your settlement until after the boat is in the water and your are satisfied. Most dealers don't like to do this, but if they really want to sell a boat, they should agree to a 1,000 or 2,000 dollar hold back. I have never had to do that, but know of people that have. If you have a good relationship with the salesperson all of the commissioning problems should be handled promptly by them. After all, they may have sold you a boat and gotten their commission already but they should be trying to ensure that when you buy your next boat it is from them, so they can get future commissions. Good luck with your purchase and perhaps we will see you around the Bay next year. Tim Bowers s/v Moonlight Bay
I have bought and commissioned 2 boats new, a 29.5 and a 340, and the biggest problem that I have had is getting the boat when promised. I have bought both boats through Sandy Hook Yacht Sales and found them to be very good at getting the boat rigged and in the water, the major problem is that everyone wants their boat in the water at the same time (early spring) and Mother Nature is not always cooperative, especially in the Spring. This makes it harder for the dealer to have the boat ready when promised. Both of my boats had minor problems after they were commissioned but were fixed quickly, either by the dealer or myself with dealer supplied parts. All in all both times have been relatively painless and in fact in was kind of fun to spend time on the boat before it went in the water, "exploring." We have talked to Tidewater on many occasions, but have always gone back to Sandy Hook Yacht Sales. I like their willingness to talk and I know that I have gotten better pricing form Sandy Hook. From what I have heard about Tidewater, they do a nice job on commissioning boats and most owners are happy with their work. While I'm sure that there are horror stories about commissioning a boat at both Tidewater and Sandy Hook, there are also many good ones that you never hear about, where everything went exactly as planned. My suggestion would be to get everything in writing, what the dealer is suposed to do and by when. Another suggestion would be to be involved, I don't mean to help (hinder) the yard workers, but go down often and check on their work. If you see something that you don't think is right get in touch with your salesperson immediately. Another thing that you could is to hold back a portion of your settlement until after the boat is in the water and your are satisfied. Most dealers don't like to do this, but if they really want to sell a boat, they should agree to a 1,000 or 2,000 dollar hold back. I have never had to do that, but know of people that have. If you have a good relationship with the salesperson all of the commissioning problems should be handled promptly by them. After all, they may have sold you a boat and gotten their commission already but they should be trying to ensure that when you buy your next boat it is from them, so they can get future commissions. Good luck with your purchase and perhaps we will see you around the Bay next year. Tim Bowers s/v Moonlight Bay
Relax.
Marty, Put your feet up, close you eyes, take some deep breaths and visualize yourself sailing that 380 on a perfect autumn day. The hard part is over. If you got yourself all the way to here, this needs to be the goodtime. You've already doen the hardpart, i.e. working for this. Tim's advise is sound. DOCUMENT EVERYTHING. Tidewater is good. I have had some of the greatest experiences with them and some others. Your in the driver's seat. I like Tim's suggestion about retainage of a percentage of the purchase price. Congrads and good luck!!!!!!!!!!!!! Taking delivery on a new boat is such an elevating experience. Figure out how to make it shear pleasure and go for it! The only acceptable reason to loose sleep at this point needs to be " How can I get out of work to get down and sail the 380 an extra day" (laughing). Mike D
Marty, Put your feet up, close you eyes, take some deep breaths and visualize yourself sailing that 380 on a perfect autumn day. The hard part is over. If you got yourself all the way to here, this needs to be the goodtime. You've already doen the hardpart, i.e. working for this. Tim's advise is sound. DOCUMENT EVERYTHING. Tidewater is good. I have had some of the greatest experiences with them and some others. Your in the driver's seat. I like Tim's suggestion about retainage of a percentage of the purchase price. Congrads and good luck!!!!!!!!!!!!! Taking delivery on a new boat is such an elevating experience. Figure out how to make it shear pleasure and go for it! The only acceptable reason to loose sleep at this point needs to be " How can I get out of work to get down and sail the 380 an extra day" (laughing). Mike D
next time
Next time I commission a boat (I'm only half a million bucks away from being able to buy a Sabre 452)I'm going to insist that it be written into the contract that I be present for the comissioning process. The dealer that I bought my 410 through actively discouraged boat owners from hovering around during commissioning for fear it would slow down the work. I would drop in every two or three days, despite not feeling welcome to do so, and there would be a ton of decisions to be made about such things as the placement of instruments or spinakker winches. Don't get me wrong, the dealer did good work, but in my opinion the owner's need to get the boat right far outweigh's the dealer's need to get the work done fast. Next time my "hovering rights" are going to be in writing. Another thing I learned is that the owner looses out whenever the dealer subcontracts work. For example, I paid a thousand dollars more to have a dodger built than if I'd hired the very same canvas-maker directly. Even worse, when the job was done poorly, I found out real fast that the canvas maker wasn't working for me, he was working for the dealer. Not good.
Next time I commission a boat (I'm only half a million bucks away from being able to buy a Sabre 452)I'm going to insist that it be written into the contract that I be present for the comissioning process. The dealer that I bought my 410 through actively discouraged boat owners from hovering around during commissioning for fear it would slow down the work. I would drop in every two or three days, despite not feeling welcome to do so, and there would be a ton of decisions to be made about such things as the placement of instruments or spinakker winches. Don't get me wrong, the dealer did good work, but in my opinion the owner's need to get the boat right far outweigh's the dealer's need to get the work done fast. Next time my "hovering rights" are going to be in writing. Another thing I learned is that the owner looses out whenever the dealer subcontracts work. For example, I paid a thousand dollars more to have a dodger built than if I'd hired the very same canvas-maker directly. Even worse, when the job was done poorly, I found out real fast that the canvas maker wasn't working for me, he was working for the dealer. Not good.
Commisioning my H 380
Commisioning a boat is primarily a dealer's task. I commissioned my H40 years ago and it took two of us two weeks to get the job done properly. There is a lot to do. Whatever the schedule, figure on doubling it in time. I have a 1999 H380 and it took over two months in Seattle to get it commissioned by the dealer. There really is two parts to this task, getting the boat ready for the seller and then getting the problems sorted out and fixed. The latter takes time and in some cases, you may not want to fix it according to Hunter or Dealer standards. On my boat we had a number of problems after commisioning. To list: windless not properly mounted, cockpit table support put on backwards, broken light switch in galley, faulty rudder, freezer/refrig not working well, through hull fitting not correctly placed, engine/shaft bolts not tightened or checked, wheel brake not working and a few others that I have forgotten. Another problem with commisioning a boat is that you have to decide is it a Hunter problem or a manufacturer problem. In our case Grunert (refrig) says the problem is Hunter and Hunter says the problem is Grunert. I finally got tired of Hunter, Grunert and the dealer and had SeaFreez come in and change the freezer and refrig. It now works to my satisfaction but interestingly enough not to SeaFreez. They want to do some more work this winter. My engine battery kept getting fried. No water in it after two weeks. It drove me crazy and I thought it might be the solar power switch. No, it was the Guest battery charger--it might have been wired wrong at the commisioning. Who's problem is that? Dealer, Guest, or Hunter. In our case, I yanked all the electrical stuff out, installed a StatPower battery charger, a combiner, an engine room regulator for the alternator, a Hart monitor and golf cart batteries. We are now pleased with our electrical system and can stay on the hook for 4 or 5 days without charging. Hunter and the Dealer refunded us for the Guest charger. It has taken us a year and a half to work out the kinks and problems of a new boat. We still have some problems to solve such as the Edson Wheel Brake, a royal pain. There are other little problems such as a galley faucet that we replaced only because I can't understand having a faucet where hot and cold turn in opposite directions. I installed a single level faucet that is much better. HOWEVER, and this is a big however, this Hunter 380 is an outstanding boat. Once you get everything working to your satisfaction, you will have one of the best boats on the water. If you will read in the "Sailor to Sailor forum" you will note that we just returned from Desolaton Sound in BC and had the trip of a lifetime. At the moment, I can't think of a way to improve the boat FOR US. Other people may have different needs, but this H380 is a great boat for this family. I hope you have a much fun with it as we do. Les Blackwell Trumpeter
Commisioning a boat is primarily a dealer's task. I commissioned my H40 years ago and it took two of us two weeks to get the job done properly. There is a lot to do. Whatever the schedule, figure on doubling it in time. I have a 1999 H380 and it took over two months in Seattle to get it commissioned by the dealer. There really is two parts to this task, getting the boat ready for the seller and then getting the problems sorted out and fixed. The latter takes time and in some cases, you may not want to fix it according to Hunter or Dealer standards. On my boat we had a number of problems after commisioning. To list: windless not properly mounted, cockpit table support put on backwards, broken light switch in galley, faulty rudder, freezer/refrig not working well, through hull fitting not correctly placed, engine/shaft bolts not tightened or checked, wheel brake not working and a few others that I have forgotten. Another problem with commisioning a boat is that you have to decide is it a Hunter problem or a manufacturer problem. In our case Grunert (refrig) says the problem is Hunter and Hunter says the problem is Grunert. I finally got tired of Hunter, Grunert and the dealer and had SeaFreez come in and change the freezer and refrig. It now works to my satisfaction but interestingly enough not to SeaFreez. They want to do some more work this winter. My engine battery kept getting fried. No water in it after two weeks. It drove me crazy and I thought it might be the solar power switch. No, it was the Guest battery charger--it might have been wired wrong at the commisioning. Who's problem is that? Dealer, Guest, or Hunter. In our case, I yanked all the electrical stuff out, installed a StatPower battery charger, a combiner, an engine room regulator for the alternator, a Hart monitor and golf cart batteries. We are now pleased with our electrical system and can stay on the hook for 4 or 5 days without charging. Hunter and the Dealer refunded us for the Guest charger. It has taken us a year and a half to work out the kinks and problems of a new boat. We still have some problems to solve such as the Edson Wheel Brake, a royal pain. There are other little problems such as a galley faucet that we replaced only because I can't understand having a faucet where hot and cold turn in opposite directions. I installed a single level faucet that is much better. HOWEVER, and this is a big however, this Hunter 380 is an outstanding boat. Once you get everything working to your satisfaction, you will have one of the best boats on the water. If you will read in the "Sailor to Sailor forum" you will note that we just returned from Desolaton Sound in BC and had the trip of a lifetime. At the moment, I can't think of a way to improve the boat FOR US. Other people may have different needs, but this H380 is a great boat for this family. I hope you have a much fun with it as we do. Les Blackwell Trumpeter
Given the opportunity ............................
..... to do it again, I would definitely have the boat surveyed by someone who is attuned to the fine details before taking delivery. Our 1999 H310 had 28 defects in it when we took possession. After a year of continuously chasing the broker, most of them were repaired. I am still finding really stupid stuff (the radio antennae cable full of water because it was improperly installed) as a result of the commissioning but find it easier to pay for it myself than go through the hassle with the dealer. A friend was not so lucky when he recently found his 1998 H310 (purchased new) had serious deck delaminations. He's on his own for that one. For the small cost of a survey, it will be the greatest piece of mind you can buy. Regards, s/v Island Hunter
..... to do it again, I would definitely have the boat surveyed by someone who is attuned to the fine details before taking delivery. Our 1999 H310 had 28 defects in it when we took possession. After a year of continuously chasing the broker, most of them were repaired. I am still finding really stupid stuff (the radio antennae cable full of water because it was improperly installed) as a result of the commissioning but find it easier to pay for it myself than go through the hassle with the dealer. A friend was not so lucky when he recently found his 1998 H310 (purchased new) had serious deck delaminations. He's on his own for that one. For the small cost of a survey, it will be the greatest piece of mind you can buy. Regards, s/v Island Hunter
Be Happy-Don't Worry
Marty, Don't worry- be happy. Tidewater will treat you right . The crew at Tidewater is first rate, you will not have any problems with commissioning you new H380. Whoever told you that commossioning is a nightmare has not delt with Norton's in Virginia or Tidewater in Maryland. Gene Roberts H35.5 "WINDSONG"
Marty, Don't worry- be happy. Tidewater will treat you right . The crew at Tidewater is first rate, you will not have any problems with commissioning you new H380. Whoever told you that commossioning is a nightmare has not delt with Norton's in Virginia or Tidewater in Maryland. Gene Roberts H35.5 "WINDSONG"
Flexible Commissioning
We bought our H380 at the Annapolis show last year. We decided to keep the boat at Tidewater Havre de Grace during this first year so that the yard could complete all the commissioning tasks and take care of any problems that might arise. We sat down with Garrett with the list of items to be completed. We identified the immediate items and the later items. They completed the immediate items so that we could cruise this summer. They worked on the later items over the season. There were some additional issues that arose and we asked for action on them. They were very responsive to our request. We have no more items on the list. We are still excited about our H380; it has met or exceeded all our expectations. It sails great in any wind. Two weeks ago we were blasting down the bay in 25+ knots with reefed main and jib. This evening we were sailing on the Susquehanna in just a zephyr. The boat is fun. We are positive you will love your 380. Check out the Hunter Sailing Association in your area to add to the fun - HSA#1 in the Annapolis area; Northern Star HSA in the northern bay; HSA#8 on the Potomac. NEVERMORE
We bought our H380 at the Annapolis show last year. We decided to keep the boat at Tidewater Havre de Grace during this first year so that the yard could complete all the commissioning tasks and take care of any problems that might arise. We sat down with Garrett with the list of items to be completed. We identified the immediate items and the later items. They completed the immediate items so that we could cruise this summer. They worked on the later items over the season. There were some additional issues that arose and we asked for action on them. They were very responsive to our request. We have no more items on the list. We are still excited about our H380; it has met or exceeded all our expectations. It sails great in any wind. Two weeks ago we were blasting down the bay in 25+ knots with reefed main and jib. This evening we were sailing on the Susquehanna in just a zephyr. The boat is fun. We are positive you will love your 380. Check out the Hunter Sailing Association in your area to add to the fun - HSA#1 in the Annapolis area; Northern Star HSA in the northern bay; HSA#8 on the Potomac. NEVERMORE
commissioning
I have had good success with the commissioning process. However, if there are things that you want done a particular way...be firm and insist on it. Sometimes the dealer wants things done his way to save time and money. I have commissioned both a 380 and a 460. JR
I have had good success with the commissioning process. However, if there are things that you want done a particular way...be firm and insist on it. Sometimes the dealer wants things done his way to save time and money. I have commissioned both a 380 and a 460. JR
Tidewater Marine-First Class
Tidewater is a first class organization. I bought a boat in Havre de Grace over the winter, a 1997 40.5 which they had sold originally. They also winterized it in the Fall of 1998. Due to the death of its first owner,it sat "on the hard" until they recommissioned for me last Spring. I picked the boat up and immediately left for Oriental. Eight days later we arrived with all systems having worked perfectly. I cannot say enough good about their honesty and professionalism
Tidewater is a first class organization. I bought a boat in Havre de Grace over the winter, a 1997 40.5 which they had sold originally. They also winterized it in the Fall of 1998. Due to the death of its first owner,it sat "on the hard" until they recommissioned for me last Spring. I picked the boat up and immediately left for Oriental. Eight days later we arrived with all systems having worked perfectly. I cannot say enough good about their honesty and professionalism
Tidewater - Helpful & Great Service
I bought an older 34 through Tidewater last Spring and although they did not do the commissioning as I had the boat transported, they were very helpful and expeditious in accomodating my demands for stepping the mast down. Dealing with them was a pleasure.
I bought an older 34 through Tidewater last Spring and although they did not do the commissioning as I had the boat transported, they were very helpful and expeditious in accomodating my demands for stepping the mast down. Dealing with them was a pleasure.
New boat comissioning experience
I just took delivery of a new (first 2001) H340. The boat was delivered thru and comissioned by Larsen Marine in Waukegan, IL. The folks had no problems with my "hanging around" and actually i was able to help with some small tasks. it was a great opportunity to get an inside look at the wiring, ducting, etc. as I plan on doing some work on the boat myself during the winter. Had only a few small squawks (refirg unit not working, faulty temp sensor on engine, one bad breaker on dc panel) and the dealer was able to rectify everything prior to our departure. There were a few other minor items that came up in the following weeks but all were able to be taken care of over the phone. I've been very happy with the boat, the dealer, and the experience.
I just took delivery of a new (first 2001) H340. The boat was delivered thru and comissioned by Larsen Marine in Waukegan, IL. The folks had no problems with my "hanging around" and actually i was able to help with some small tasks. it was a great opportunity to get an inside look at the wiring, ducting, etc. as I plan on doing some work on the boat myself during the winter. Had only a few small squawks (refirg unit not working, faulty temp sensor on engine, one bad breaker on dc panel) and the dealer was able to rectify everything prior to our departure. There were a few other minor items that came up in the following weeks but all were able to be taken care of over the phone. I've been very happy with the boat, the dealer, and the experience.
Relax #2
All boats will have some minor tuning after commissioning. My dealer would have loved to have me sail my 340 from his dock for a month so that he could have fixed those things. However I was 2,000 plus miles away and took care of the problems myself via phone. My 30 had similar problems, but nothing that was very bad. Remember your new car may have a rattle that needs fixing or a computer chip that needs replacing. Boats are no different. Besides, its fun to get a new boat.
All boats will have some minor tuning after commissioning. My dealer would have loved to have me sail my 340 from his dock for a month so that he could have fixed those things. However I was 2,000 plus miles away and took care of the problems myself via phone. My 30 had similar problems, but nothing that was very bad. Remember your new car may have a rattle that needs fixing or a computer chip that needs replacing. Boats are no different. Besides, its fun to get a new boat.
Commisioning Question
I'm in the market for a new 410 in the SF Bay area and am discouraged to hear your experience. Can you tell me the dealer who commisioned your 410?
I'm in the market for a new 410 in the SF Bay area and am discouraged to hear your experience. Can you tell me the dealer who commisioned your 410?
Two experiences
I've purchased two boats new, one in Seattle and one in Alameda, and both times it paid dividends to be there as much as possible during the process. The trick is to keep a low profile and let the guys get on with their work. I learned more about the boats doing that anything before or since. In contrast to John, I had no problems with subcontractors. I think I got fair prices and it was benefitcial to have the yard's input on the design and placement of canvas, etc. They see a lot of these boats roll through and have a ton of experience with them, which can't always be said for the subs.
I've purchased two boats new, one in Seattle and one in Alameda, and both times it paid dividends to be there as much as possible during the process. The trick is to keep a low profile and let the guys get on with their work. I learned more about the boats doing that anything before or since. In contrast to John, I had no problems with subcontractors. I think I got fair prices and it was benefitcial to have the yard's input on the design and placement of canvas, etc. They see a lot of these boats roll through and have a ton of experience with them, which can't always be said for the subs.
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