Coast Guard Inspections

[sonofasailorsailing]

I believe there should be more inspections

The Cg, F & W, etc people I have come into contact with have all, without exception, been courteous, helpful and friendly. If they could be out in force and do 100% inspections on any given weekend, they would reduce the number of idiots on the water.

 

[Ctskip]

When it gets to splitting hairs

The split is obvious. Lets face facts, police are here to serve/protect,(skimming is just a sideline) just as the CG is here to provide a service. When the CG saves lives (just as the fireman does) they deserve all they get. Good for them. They are paid professionals. Just as the ball player is a paid professional. No problem, as long as they do their jobs. As for my safety, thats another matter. If I choose to mow my lawn while in bare feet, I don't expect a policeman to come and stop me "for my safety". Just as if I am not wearing a pfd while sailing. It's nobodys business but mine. Same goes for the seat belts. What ever happened to freedom of choice? I guess we "panicked" (9/11) ourselves into chicken poops. Are we really that afraid for our lives? Who/what, are we afraid of? Must we be lead to everything? Can we not use common sense? Or must it be dictated to us? I think not. Just as rock and roll was the work of the devil. Remember that one? PROPAGANDA. Its all BS. Pay us now, because there might not be a later. Oh yea, it's for your own good and that of your families too! Naturally, this is only my opinion, but its the one I have and stand behind. Same opinion today as it was 20 yrs ago. I love my country, but fear my government. Keep your powder dry!! Keep it up, Ctskip  John, post #19 We are all nuts of one sort or another

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

There is a difference

All well and good Ctskip until you call for help someday and thereby endanger my boat or my life or someone elses' while trying to save your's because you exercised your "freedon of choice" to do something the CG could have prevented in the first place.

 

[John Mack]

Any of you Idiots ever hear of the CONSTITUTION !!

If you can find a copy READ IT. Unfortunately our illustrious governments make laws that are unconstitutional and the 9 Supremes back them up and you idiot sheeple accept and applaud. Thanks to you I don't have a free country anymore.........

 

[Ross]

John Mack, I can remember when Hawaii

was a US territory and not a state. Today you have two senators and at least two congress men that you can write to with your complaints. I presume that you do that on a regular schedule. I also presume that you have uniform service experience so that you have seen the wonderful way that people live in other parts of the world. If I believed the negative responces that have been posted on this thread I could conclude that we live in a police state. But my experience tells me that there exist a few malcontents that would be forever unhappy no matter where or when they lived.

 

[sailortonyb Allied Mis]

I cant imagine.....

I just cant imagine myself living in such a paranoid state of mind as some of these radicals. They need to start their own colony on another planet. Interesting to note that the radicals are the ones that foam at the mouth and start with the name calling. IMFO Tony B

 

[George B., s/v Freya]

Let's Play Nice Fellas

Last week it was life vests, this week it's the USCG. The trifecta will be if we re-hash the ol' guns on boats controversy next week. The fact is the USCG has the authority to board all vessels in US waters. It always has. Am I the only one that actually had been boarded for a safety inspection before 9/11? About the only difference between then and now is they now run a warrant check via a blackberry (and I don't know if that has more to do with technology than the Patriot Act.) I was never inconvienced nor delayed in the three boarding's I experienced. Sometimes the boarding's bordered on the comical like the time (we were coming home from the Delta) when they asked if we were carrying any weapons and my wife answered: "Do super soakers count?" (You get a real strange expression on their faces when they are trying to process that one.) Later, when she was assisting the inspection in the cabin the young coastie asked her "Which one is the Y valve?" she pointed it out and then he asked her if it was closed or not. Friends of our were boarded once and a young trainee was reading through his inspection check list and asked if they had life vests for the crew, wherein his training officer nudged him and said, "lookup, they're wearing them."On a more practical note, all the times we were boarded, we were motoring. Has anybody been boarded while under sail? Also, they seem to be more active on major holiday weekends which leads me to believe that they are assisting in the enforcement of the drunk boating laws. Now if you want to talk jack booted thugs... A boat I was on in had a drug search performed by the Canadian CG way back in the seventies.

 

[Clyde]

USCG Boarding

A boarding isn't limited by law to safety inspections only; they can do warrant-less searches of the vessel. The USCG boarding team will notify you that they are coming aboard to conduct an USCG boarding. The USCG boarding party is considered federal agents and will be armed. Once on board they will conduct an initial safety inspection to identify any obvious safety hazards, and to ensure the sea worthiness of your vessel. The boarding officer will then ask to see the vessel registration or documentation, and proceed to inspect your vessel. The scope of the vessel inspection, during most boardings, is limited to determining the vessel's regulatory status (e.g. commercial, recreational, passenger, cargo, and/or fishing vessel) and checking for compliance with U.S. civil law applicable to vessels of that status. The CG may also enforce U.S. criminal law. The boarding officer will complete a US Coast Guard boarding form, and note any discrepancies. You will get a signed copy before they depart. The US Coast Guard can at anytime and anywhere the United States has jurisdiction, make inquiries, examinations, inspections, searches, seizures and arrests on vessels. They can also do this in international waters for US flagged vessels. Boarding of vessels by agents of the federal government has been in affect since the 1790 session of the US Congress. Back then they were looking for non-taxed contraband. In 1983 the US Supreme Court upheld the warrant-less searches of vessels by federal agents of the USCG.37 states have laws giving state, county, or municipal law enforcement officers the right to boarding your vessel without probable cause. The other 13 states require the state, county, or municipal law enforcement officers to have probable cause before they can board your vessel. Minnesota is the only state not allowing any boarding by state, county, or municipal law enforcement officers; based on the reference guide to state boating laws, sixth edition, 2000.If you haven't been boarded yet, it's only a matter of time before the USCG or your state fish and game warden will be boarding your vessel.Fair Winds,Clyde

 

[CalebD]

It is interesting how this post generated such a

pissing match. The real question is WHY would you not want to permit the CG onto your boat if they requested? Are some things not up to code, standards or regs? If so, and you do not know about them then you do need to know what you should address if they can find it. Frankly, I am happy that they are out there stopping and inspecting people (especially powerboats and go-fast guys) to make sure they are legit. I have nothing to hide (for the most part) and I know what is and isn't on my boat and what works and what does not. While I am not particularly happy with the state of our union I do not think that safety is a political issue that belongs to the left of the wright. The real big pissing match should be about whether the CG/DHS will start requiring licensing for ALL boaters. I for one am a patriot but am not proud about the Patriot Act but I am glad to have the CG out there and doing their thing. I would expect to see more of this as there is a perception that our local waters are kind of a soft spot where someone could reek havoc if they wanted to (think USS Cole). To keep this boating related I will add that my boat was CG inspected and registered when we bought it. We have never re-registered with the CG but I may just consider this plan someday if I start encountering a lot of interdiction/boarding incidents while rounding Manhattan Island (just a few potential targets there; a bridge or two, a tunnel, the UN to name a few). When I visited Hawaii earlier this year the DHS airport stuff seemed way out of place except maybe in Honolulu and other Intl airports (Maui & Kapuna). Why would Alkyda want to blow up a fishing village and a few surfers with a boat/weapon? They wouldn't (think: 'pounding sand'; a phrase that was used when talking about bombing Afghanistan). They would go for Waikiki beach or better yet Milwaukee. People would be really pissed that their local cheap brew was currently unavailable but if the body count was high enough Alkyda would try it. Liking the CG and the few liberties I can enjoy very much.Your mileage may vary in Montana or elsewhere.

 

[dancing bear]

Not sure I see it as so bad...

For all this debate, only a couple of people have actually described a boarding, and it sounds like if you have your act together, it's not so bad.I would like to know more about boardings: do they assume you have drugs, guns or illegal immigrants on board? Do they check all your lockers and bins for contraband? Do they check your blood-alcohol if a cooler is on board? From those that have described a boarding it does not sound like guilt is assumed, if guilt is not assumed, I say no big deal.

 

[sailortonyb Allied Mis]

Dancing Bear

All of the times I was boarded, I was either at anchor or motoring except once when they towed me.To answer your question, Dancing Bear, and this is only from my own personal experiences, because I cant speak for others. The boardings were from relatively young men that seemed more like they were out to socialize from boredom and offer any assistance we needed even though we didnt ask for any. Like I said, the boardings were very congenial, very professional and very friendly. They didnt seem to presume any quilt but it didnt take long to figure out that there curiousity questions that seemed friendly enough were really a ploy while they were looking for drugs or contraband. Kinda like "Oh wow, I never been on a sailboat before, can you show me around?, you dont mind do you. Hey what neat cushions, may I look underneath them?" Its almost comical. We didnt laugh though, they were just doing their job and trying NOT to make us feel like criminals. I think the first thing they checked was the head and the "y" valve. While they were acting like curiosity seekers, one of them was checking my paper work. The others were just looking around. Then they asked about my safety eqpt. like life jackets and such. They kept reassuring us that this was just routine. They were very nice and courteous young men and we actually enjoyed the experience. Most of the time I was boarded was usually in Florida. We had a Ms. registration. They made conversation about where they were from and other misc. small talk. The whole experience didnt take more than 20 mins. each time. They didnt comment about the beer, wine and rum. They just acted like all was normal, except one time one of the coasties recommended a particular type of Puerto Rican Rum.It really is no big thing. Not even close to being as intrusive as a traffic check on the highway. Tony B

 

[Ctskip]

Come on Tony???

There is no way you can compare a traffic stop to a boarding by the CG. We all know the percentage of criminals and illegals that drive on our road ways verses boating.  I agree the CG has a job to do, just as the police and the fireman do. I have respect for all who risk their lives, so that some may be rescued. Soon the fire marshal will be coming into our homes to be sure the smoke detectors are up to the task. Hey, it's for our safety. I just feel the the CG can be better used searching commercial shipping and with the use of radar (planes) they know who is traveling and where they are coming and going to. Why are they bothering locals? For our safety? I don't think so. The fire marshal doesn't come by my house to check on the safety of my home. It's all a matter of numbers. They must spend the money today, so they can ask for more tomorrow. And they'll get it. We all want to be warm and fuzzy. The powers that be, know how to get the most money from its citizens. They are pros at it. Don't kid yourself into thinking they are doing all this for your safety. That just happens to be one of the services they offer. Cushy jobs in the pentagon and double dippers for the pensions. Not bad for most. I know I have relatives that are working the system and they are living pretty good on our money. Just how big can the govt get? Which is what it all gets down to. Money. The govt uses scare tactics to get every penny out of those who want that warm and fuzzy feeling. Just look at train derailments and explosions. One half baked shoe bomber and we all must pay. Forever too! They get analyzed to death and used to reinforce their concept of "we will protect you". But it's going to cost you. Most folks just bend over and say do what ever you must do to make us warm and fuzzy. And say thank you to boot! The CG does some great things, like save lives and give a safe feeling. Sure they get tons of drugs every year, but they also miss most too. Maybe they were visiting your sailboat bsing and thats why they missed most of the crooks. They know the locals and who belongs and who doesn't. They know the comings and goings. Quit bothering the locals and intercept the crooks and secure our ports. Then you'll be doing something really worth while. As long as our ports are open we are not safe. Don't kid yourself Hassle a 25 footer for out of date flares I've been boating for some 45 years at least and have never been boarded, towed in once while taking on water. Most boaters never call the CG for assistance. I have higher standards than the CG has. I also have higher standards for just about everything I do as compared to "your local codes". It's just "my standards". Maybe licensing is the answer. Leave the safety issue up to your local parks and recs dept or fish and game. Or whom ever does the registering of the vessel. Leave the CG to secure our ports and save lives in emergency situations. I still mow my lawn in bare feet. I like the grass between my toes. And I still have them all. I use my head for more than a hat rack. Keep it up, Ctskip

 

[dancing bear]

You have higher standards than the CG...

but mow the lawn in your bare feet?

 

[sailortonyb Allied Mis]

Ctskip

You say "I've been boating for some 45 years at least and have never been boarded" most people will never be boarded. So, again, whats the problem. They are not out there like flies on shit. The reason I've been boarded 4 times over the years is that when I'm traveling on the water, I happen to pass a lot of CG stations on the Gulf. Also, since 9/11, I have never been boarded. Its a random thing.As for "The fire marshal doesn't come by my house to check on the safety of my home." he does if you have a business. Maybe not a home business, but if you rented a location he will.Now this one really makes sense "Quit bothering the locals and intercept the crooks and secure our ports." I know you dont like big govt. but my proposal is everyone must have a sign on their sailboat. Only 2 choices. You either have the sign that says "I am a local" or a sign that says "I am a crook" That ought to prevent a lot of useless boardings. Your other statement " I still mow my lawn in bare feet. I like the grass between my toes. And I still have them all. I use my head for more than a hat rack." Now thats worth quoting. One last thing, you can read the Constitution all you want to, but the bottom line is that Americans were never really free. A freedom for one person is an infringement for another. The only way you can enjoy true freedom is to buy your own Island and live totally alone. Freedom like a lot of other things in life is an illusion. Sometimes the freedom you preach is also the cause of what you despise the most......the liberal left. How did I know you are not a liberal?, The Psychic Hotline tells all. I'm not thoroughly convinced that our Govt system is the best, nor am I convinced that the U.S. is the best place to be either. But for now, I'm not that discontent that I'm looking elsewhere. My question in life is, why do sailboat owners flatter themselves to the point of thinking they are better than everyone else?  Tony B

 

[Ctskip]

the local CG station knows

who the locals are and who isnt. You know your hood,don't you? and thats not your job. Safety first. It's not like the George Washington Bridge we are talking about. Most guardsmen are from the area and if they are doing their job, they know the locals. Their boats anyway. As for signs on the vessels, I'm not for that idea. As for freedom being a state of mind. So is terrorism. My freedom isn't infringing on anyone. How do you figure that one? Please don't get me wrong I understand the reason for laws, the control aspect, but there comes a point that there are so many laws, nobody knows them all. Yet someone can be clearly up to no good, with a rap sheet, yet the law WON"T do anything till he breaks a law. Yet they invade folks having a good time "just to make sure all are safe". Give me a break! As for your life's question. Most everyone thinks they are better than the next guy. Aren't we better than the average? I thought I was .... till now... I'll have to check and get back to you on that one. As Americans, we are WAY above the average human being that inhabits the earth. Now narrow it down to Americans only, and we are probably better off than the average. How do you feel? I feel blessed to be, and way above the average. Keep it up, Ctskip

 

[PrivateerTradin]

Too personal...

I don't usually hop into discussions like this...But I would like to add something... *boxConsider for a minute, a situation where the CG boards a vessel...They "make nice" with the crew...Everyone is friendly...Nothing seems out of place...One of the Coasties lifts a cushion and finds 4 cans of peanut butter.NOW...lets talk about the boarding that took place 2 hours earlier:They "make nice" with the crew...Everyone is friendly...Nothing seems out of place...One of the Coasties lifts a cushion and finds 40 pounds of columbian weed.You don't really think that they confiscate those amazing amounts of drugs annually, by only boarding the bad guy's boats do you? Can YOU come alongside a boat from 150 feet away and tell if they are criminals...or illegals, or smugglers?If so...you should join the CG, I am sure they would appreciate the help.Folks tend to take things personally...When it is not...The Coasties are not looking for YOU when they board your vessel...They dont KNOW you... Yes, when they board your boat, they ARE looking to see if you have broken any laws...They will do it again, later..to someone elses boat...and again, and again. They are not looking to mess up your day...They are not looking to harrass you...They are not trying to infringe on your rights. They don't KNOW you...It's not ABOUT you...They are trying to find bad guys, and maybe the occaisional idiot. Don't take it personally...because it's not. (Unless you are a criminal...or an occaisional idiot...) ;DSKip

 

[sailortonyb Allied Mis]

Ctskip

Well, it's nice to know that at least 2 of us can have very strong opinions that are 180 degrees out of sync. and not have to resort to name calling.Maybe you are right about sailors, some of us may be better than average. Tony B

 

[abe]

I love the CG boarding me...I have fun...

..sometimes they have rookies and they are in training. I always find them to be polite and never have had any problems. Sometimes I teach them a lesson, like the time they asked if my buddy and I had any weapons on board and we said yes. So they took our had guns and hid it in the boat before inspection for their safety. As I was looking for my flares...I came apond the hand guns they hid in the boat. So I looked at the rookie, smiled, and asked "I think I found them...you hid the guns in here didn't yah?" He didn't think it was funny...but I think I taught him a lesson about safety. Imagine if I were the bad guy when suddenly I have a loaded gun and catch these guys by surprise.By the way, my friend is an xcop and I used to do a little work for US Secret Service..so we both were legaly carrying conceled weapons.

 

[sand sailor]

fight to the death *box

i will for my rights and my country(some of us took that oath at one point weather we want to remember it or not) but i may never have to thanks to the USCG and others of that nature we salute you for keeping our shores safe

 

[aa.aunins]

smuglers and idiots

I think that there's two points to being boarded. If you could be comeing from international waters they should be able to check you for smugling. IF your on a lake the way you handle your boat could efect others. This is more of a motor boat issue but if you're drunk or stupid you can kill others on the lake that have no choice about it, ie they didn't get in the boat with you.I say that if what you do can and will only harm yourself then live and let live,but if your actions can and will harm others without there consent then you need to be stopped and that's what any form of "law enforcement" is all about.