Classroom Boat

Mar 25, 2015
146
catalina 22 Fort Walton
Some of you know that my purchase was less than stellar and my boat has several issues.

After discussion with the Admiral, she's agreed to give me a budget to work on the boat with her. It was her suggestion since we both love sailing this is a great boat for teaching ourselves things like fg, repair, wiring and many other items that boat owners without large bank accounts should know.

The bonus is that no matter how badly we screw up it won't devalue the boat at all. Budget for our project is 3k $.

The hull has rotting stringers, the bulkheads are po's maladjusted attempt to put something in and are just slightly too small causing a lot of flex in the hull. There is mold inside the bilge and it's not bad but needs to be removed. The bilge needs to be painted. The hull needs a barrier coat and ablative paint on top of that.

The keel has rust spots, needs a new wire, probably new hanger pin, and the keel friction bolt area is a wreck. Specifically the nut area is cracked and the crack goes down towards the waterline. In choppy water it does leak a bit. The keel will need to be refinished. Maintenance needs to be performed on the winch.

The deck doesn't have soft spots but has a lot of gel coat cracks and is alligatoring in places. Hinges, locks and other hatch associated hardware is poorly put in and in awful shape.

I have no lights besides a jury rigged anchor light and clip on nav lights. I wish to wire the boat with basic lights.

Mast spreaders are old pot metal and look dangerously fatigued, cracked and in need of replacement. Because it's Fl, a lightning preventer or something is also a must add.

Trailer needs to have the hull pads raised so the keel doesn't contact metal crossbar when fully raised. Pad needs be on said crossbar to prevent damage to keel.

Those are the big structural things and the wife and I are gonna get our learn on. To make this boat nice would take $$$$$$ and time time time so we aren't going into this with any expectations at all. We are hoping to get some good experience and maybe get 1-2 more years out of her before she self destructs and we get a nicer boat. The project starts when I get home early next year from a deployment. This will give the boat several months of drying out. Pictures of the project areas to follow soon.

The goal is to accomplish this by the time the c22 nationals are here in Fort Walton Beach next year, I'd like to sail with like minded people. When is that date by the way?
 
Nov 19, 2008
2,129
Catalina C-22 MK-II Parrish, FL
A C22 has stringers? Are we talking about a diff boat?
Yes, many of the original design boats,(including mine), had 1/2" plywood stringers running along side of the keel bulge in the bottom of the hull. The plywood was covered with a thin layer of fiberglass. Water would make it's way in and eventually make it's way into the plywood, and cause it to rot. You can only get to the rear couple feet, the rest is under the cabin floor. Some boats had them, others didn't, no rime or reason which years or which factory the boat came from that I'm aware of. It's an issue..... :cussing:

Don
 
Mar 25, 2015
146
catalina 22 Fort Walton
So mine has them and the plan is actually to saw out the floor to get to them. The whole floor. Yes I'm serious. Lol.

Like I said, it's gonna be a classroom so I'll just go for it.
 
Apr 21, 2015
127
Catalina 22 Sport #15582 Indianapolis
2016 Nationals are May 21-26. Dates are subject to change as the NOR does not come out until some time around November.

Not sure if this is considered a stringer, my Sport has a board that runs from just aft of the volcano to the transom. There is no hull liner beneath the cockpit. So, this probably is used to keep the back/bottom half of the hull from oil-canning.
 
Mar 20, 2015
3,233
C&C 30 Mk1 Winnipeg
The goal is to accomplish this by the time the c22 nationals are here in Fort Walton Beach next year, I'd like to sail with like minded people. When is that date by the way?
You'd like to sail with crazy people ? :D;)
Maybe CloudDiver will show up for it LOL

I'd keep an eye open for another boat in case a good deal comes up in the fall.
As Hopefull Boat Owner's purchase of her boat for $2700 shows, good older ones are out there. For a new style you pay 5K maybe.
If the new boat doesn't include a trailer you could get a better deal, and use the trailer you have.
Then you could either keep the older boat for parts, or part it out.


That way, if you have storage room and are still inclined work on the project boat as time permits, without losing valuable sailing time.
FWIW: Once you have another boat you'd probably lose interest in the project boat.
There will be more than enough projects on the next one even, if it's in much better shape.

Boats are like GF/BFs. After a short time, some get to be too much effort in time or money vs enjoyment, and once you have a better one you forget about the previous one. ;):D

But... If you have the cash to throw away, and are willing to do it.... it's your time and money.
 
Nov 19, 2008
2,129
Catalina C-22 MK-II Parrish, FL
Keep in mind you can't simply cut out sections of the liner. The liner is an integral part that adds to the overall strength of the boat, and I believe IAW the C-22 Class rules, liner sections, including the floor, if removed, would have to be re-installed to race. Would be a good question for the National C-22 Measurer, depending what you end up removing.

Checkout the WEST epoxy web site. Lot's of GREAT information on the proper repairing of fiberglass boats.

Don
 
Aug 2, 2009
651
Catalina 315 Muskegon
School's over. Lesson learned: spend more time, smarts, and money on your next purchase. Why beat your head against a wall, when you could be out sailing?

Ditch the boat. You have 3k for repairs. Why not put that and whatever you can get for project boat towards a good boat? If you would have had this one surveyed, you could have avoided this problem. Sure, some will scoff at the idea of surveying a 22 foot trailerable, but if they do, I would just refer them to you for a reality check.

There are good used trailerables out there, and why shouldn't you have one?
 
Jun 8, 2004
2,943
Catalina 320 Dana Point
You started with the purpose of sailing and learning to sail, I'd suggest you not allow your focus to be shifted into putting all your time, effort and money into trying to repair that which may not be repairable.
Consider it "disposable", sail the heck out of it till it sinks or breaks than start over with the considerable knowledge you've gained the hard way.
As an old CPO once told me "Ya can't polish a turd, idjit".
 
Mar 20, 2015
3,233
C&C 30 Mk1 Winnipeg
As an old CPO once told me "Ya can't polish a turd, idjit".
Your CPO was wrong... it least in regards to actual turds. ;) LOL

I agree with your post. Heck he could use it for "docking under sail" practice, and not care if he mashed the dock.
 

kito

.
Sep 13, 2012
2,011
1979 Hunter Cherubini 30 Clemmons
Not sure why anyone would buy a C22 that needs that much work. Restoring a boat sounds romantic but believe me, it becomes a drag after a while. With the $3k budget allowed to fix this one up, you could have bought a darn near turn key C22. There are tons of them out there.
 
Mar 25, 2015
146
catalina 22 Fort Walton
Okay. I've had many of these same thoughts.

I will put it to the admiral.

Also, Don ,the plan was to cut out the liner and build up new bulkheads and interior.

New thread name is either the Rollercoaster or undecided but I can't make up my mind!
 
Sep 8, 2014
2,551
Catalina 22 Swing Keel San Diego
The problem with being crazy is you don't actually realize you are in-fact crazy until you are elbow deep into the restoration.

At the time I found my boat I was mostly broke... that is broke enough not to be able to pony up $4k or better for a better boat, but able to scrape together a few hundred every other pay-day to buy just enough supplies and material to keep a project going. So I found an $800 boat that seemed like it wasn't too far gone to reasonably invest the sweat equity into a resto.

After I finished the blister repair/bottom job and the keel I looked at what was left to do, how much it was going to cost, and my ever pushing to the right launch date and said to myself "Dude, You're *explicative* Crazy..."

You'd like to sail with crazy people ? :D;)
Maybe CloudDiver will show up for it LOL

I'd keep an eye open for another boat in case a good deal comes up in the fall.
As Hopefull Boat Owner's purchase of her boat for $2700 shows, good older ones are out there. For a new style you pay 5K maybe.
If the new boat doesn't include a trailer you could get a better deal, and use the trailer you have.
Then you could either keep the older boat for parts, or part it out.


That way, if you have storage room and are still inclined work on the project boat as time permits, without losing valuable sailing time.
FWIW: Once you have another boat you'd probably lose interest in the project boat.
There will be more than enough projects on the next one even, if it's in much better shape.

Boats are like GF/BFs. After a short time, some get to be too much effort in time or money vs enjoyment, and once you have a better one you forget about the previous one. ;):D

But... If you have the cash to throw away, and are willing to do it.... it's your time and money.
 
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jmczzz

.
Mar 31, 2013
515
O'Day 26 CB New Orleans
Cloud, and Spartacus99
IMO yours is a good approach. Buy it cheap enough, use cash flow $ and part time labor to restore. From following your thread, at the finish you are going to have a better than new boat with custom features structurally and cosmetically that will make it exceptional. You will also have pride of accomplishment and in ownership
The other advantage you have is you have the facility, the tools, the expert know how to do the job better than any factory or pro shop would, not to mention you have the youth and energy to get it done, the drive to see it thru and a vision of the end results. If I were to explain to someone contemplating a boat restoration I would tell them the above are the things needed to get it done.
Proceed man you are on a good track do not let na-sayers deflect or dim your vision.
Spartacus99, sounds to me like your plan is a good one. You and partner are in agreement on the plan, goals and budjet. what else do you need? An appropriate approach for you situation I'd say. You are lucky to have a compatible mate. Go at your own style, speed and course. Good work.

That it not to say the “bye it ready to sail for more up front cash” guys are wrong. Each has used the approach best suited to his situation.

I think my approach is just as valid as any. I.e. Bought a “good old boat” after my own survey, and sea trial cheap ($400.). Brought it to my home waters, launched it and sailed it making what ever fixes necessary to keep it afloat and upright. Took it out for the winter, re-worked the keel, upside down hangers and minimal fairing and painting the bottom and got her re-launched as soon as possible. I’ve been sailing daily and have over nighted or longer several times. I have been adding needed repairs, updates and gear as cash flow allows.
I bought some new items, a lot of used ones and so far am pleased with my boat and investment. I've spent much more time sailling her than working on her but they all take $. I don’t recommend people go out and by a 1972 sailboat unless they can determine if it is or can be seaworthy. And do not need the latest styles and stuff or don’t mind less than pretty in some spots.
“To each his own”, none are better than the other.

BTW did anyone check out the “free boat”? see link in my previous post.
James
 
Mar 25, 2015
146
catalina 22 Fort Walton
Yes I did and if I get another boat it has to be fixed keel, fin or wing. Plus free boat. .. I shudder when I think what that may mean.

All, this has great advice so far, thank you.
 

azguy

.
Aug 23, 2012
337
Catalina 22 Lake Pleasant
Your crazy to undertake a project like that, it'll cost you way more in the end IMHO...
 

jmczzz

.
Mar 31, 2013
515
O'Day 26 CB New Orleans
It could be a useable boat or could be parted out? Trailer may be worth something? I would go get it except I'm 1300 miles away. Has anybody called the seller and discussed the boat’s condition?

I don't think a “good old boat" is necessarily a bad investment. It may be useable while being brought back up. And does it have to be a complete rebuild to be a good sailable and enjoyable, fun boat. IMO no. Of course it would never be a spotlight rebuild project that would compete with the refit / rebuilds that are on this forum. Nor would I expect to ride out a serious Gulf gale on it without making sure it would handle that. But if that is not your purpose then it might be the best way to go. So far I have lake sailed my "good old boat" two seasons and gradually fixed or replaced some things. The first thing I did was insure it. However, now it’s a seaworthy, comfortable, clean boat that the mate and I really enjoy. So far we have about $1000 invested and some not to strenuous work hours. Not counting the motor and trailer I already had.

My point is everybody regardless of budget needs a chance to spend some time sailing and staying on a sailboat. It refreshes the spirit and gives a different perspective from the wall mart & pontoon mentality.
James
 
Mar 25, 2015
146
catalina 22 Fort Walton
James. Incredibly well stated. It's the quiet moments on the boat that I use to rebuild me after long days of work. I'm addicted to the flap of the sail filling, the Burble underneath the transom, the singing of the rigging in a good wind. Prettiest songs I've ever heard.

Those quiet moments with my kids when they unconfidently grab a sheet to adjust something and I nod and smile. A volume of instruction passing from father to son or daughter with that simple nod and grin, unvoiced and not needed to be.

Yeah it's special stuff being on the water away from the world.