charging problems while powering

Feb 10, 2004
204
Hunter 426 Rock Hall, MD
When I purchased my 2003 Hunter 426 (44) in 2010 I found that the alternator was not charging during the trip from RI to DE. I replaced the Alt. w/generic and fried it also. I had a Balmar 100AMP w 614 external smart regulator installed with new AGM batteries (2 4d house; gp27 AGM start; gp27 AGM bow thruster bat.). The starting solenoid went bad (or was bad from the get go) and on Hunter’s recommendation I replaced it with a Blue Seas VSR after being told that the stock solenoid was inadequate with the 85 amp alternator upgrade by the PO. The VSR was wired into an “on/off” switch (as recommended by Blue Seas) where the “off” position combined the house and start banks if ever needed. I also installed a Victron battery monitor. All work was professionally done with the exception of the Victron which was installed by myself.

What is happening – at start up the initial up charge as shown by both the panel and cockpit meters is usually 13.8 - well below the 14+ it should be, however both banks are charging. (In fact I rarely see anything approaching 14v.) After running under power for some time my voltage readings come down to anywhere between 11.9 and 12.6. This, to me, indicates that the batteries are not charging and, in fact, it is necessary for me to run the generator at anchor to charge after powering ALL DAY!!! OR----after the batteries are sensed as being fully charged the process stops and appears not to go into the float stage. I don’t know if this is an accurate analysis since I am not well versed in electrical issues.

A Balmar tech. suggests removing the regulator sensor wire from the alternator and running it directly to the start battery to get a more accurate reading – which I have done with an improvement in the voltage readings (see chart below). I don’t see how this will solve the “not charging” problem which does not manifest itself until after running for a period of 2 to 4 hours.
HELP! There is something odd going on and I am trying to avoid an expensive professional analysis if I can avoid it – which seems unlikely at this point. Any Suggestions will be much appreciated?

......................Alternator.........House Bat. ........Start Bat.......Panel Meter

Readings
while at rest.............................12.83................12.83....................
for 15 mins.


Readings
while running
before sensor........14.2..............13.9.................13.93.............13.93
wire changed


Readings
while running
after sensor..........14.3..............14.0..................14.6..............14.6
wire changed


There is some difference but I don't see how changing the location of the regulator sensor wire from the alternator to the start battery will solve my charging weirdness.
 
Feb 26, 2004
23,095
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
You wrote: There is some difference but I don't see how changing the location of the regulator sensor wire from the alternator to the start battery will solve my charging weirdness.

The regulator sense wire should go to the house bank, since the start bank is almost always full even after starting the engine.

The after sensor readings seem reasonable.

Have you (re)programmed the MC-614? What program are you using for/on it?
 
Feb 10, 2004
204
Hunter 426 Rock Hall, MD
Thanks Stu - I posed that question to Balmar and he insisted to wire to the start battery.
 
Feb 6, 1998
11,716
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
Thanks Stu - I posed that question to Balmar and he insisted to wire to the start battery.
The real question is where does the alt output go? If it goes to the start battery then you must sense the start battery. If the alt is wired to the house bank, as it should be, then you need to sense the house bank + terminal. If the alt is wired through the battery switch the closest to the batteries you can sense is the switches "C" post.

It should be noted that the regulator neg cable should ALSO be routed directly to the sensed battery neg terminal. The only way to get accurate sensing of the voltage regulator is to run the reg negative AND the sense wire to the house bank.

With a bank like you have the alt output should go nowhere other than direct to the house bank.

You might have paid for a professional install but an MC-614 with the reg sensing the alternator is anything but a pro level execution.

We really need a lot more info and a wiring diagram.

How is the bow bank charged?
Which Blue Sea ACR?
How is the ACR wired?
Which banks is the ACR between?
Is there an alternator temp sensor?
What are the settings in the MC-614?
Was the MC-614 just installed with a "factory program" selected?
Is there a battery temp sensor?
Where does the alt feed to?
Is the alt direct wired to a switch or direct wired to a battery bank?
Do you have solar?
Is there a diode type battery "isolator" anywhere in the system?


What is happening – at start up the initial up charge as shown by both the panel and cockpit meters is usually 13.8 - well below the 14+ it should be
It can and should take a LONG time for a discharged 400Ah bank of AGM batteries to break 14.0V during charging with just a 100A alt.. This is called BULK charging. With a 100A alternator on a 400+ Ah bank of AGM batteries you are barely at 20% of capacity, in charge rate, and I have not even included the two group 27's which should usually be pretty full.

This is a 125Ah flooded battery with a 20% of capacity charge rate. Pay attention to the time and voltage current was the full 25A until the bank hit the limiting/absorption voltage. This battery started at 50% SOC....

2 Min = 12.59V / 25A = BULK / Constant Current
10 Min = 13.0V / 25A
20 Min = 13.12V / 25A
30 Min = 13.22V / 25A
40 Min = 13.33V / 25A
50 Min = 13.45 / 25A
60 Min = 13.6V / 25A
70 Min = 13.76 / 25A
80 Min = 13.95 / 25A
90 Min = 14.16V / 25A
100 Min = 14.39 / 25A
102 Min = 14.4V / 24.5A = ABSORPTION VOLTAGE / Attained Voltage Limiting