Sorry. when I first posted this autofill made it look like a 30yr old boat. Again, I recently retired. Live in Michigan. I"m considering buying a late 1980's or early 1990's catalina 30. Besides Great Lakes sailing I'm thinking about a trip down the ICW to Florida. I'm leaning toward the wing keel. I have heard pros and cons about the wing. I'm not concerned about sailing performance as much as the 3' 10" vs 5' 3". I would welcome any input. Also if anyone has made this trip or has had experience with these keels on the ICW or the Florida Keys I would really appreciate your advice. Thanks in advance for your help. Tom
catalina 30 draft question
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Well the smarty pants answer is its only a problem when the water depth is less than that. I'm a Puget Sound sailor and my experience is with tides, not so much shifting shoals. The problem is usually-- through neglect or poor data--not know how much water you really have under the keel.
Those that have been there can say better that the ICW is getting silted in, you have increasingly few options in terms of tide and time to make certain passages.
But that is the case anywhere. I spent four embarrassing hours at the entrance to Fisherman Bay on Lopez Island in the San Juan's Islands, because I entered the keel depth off-set incorrectly. I used the time to get very knowledgeable on the setting of my particular depth sounder.
Those that have been there can say better that the ICW is getting silted in, you have increasingly few options in terms of tide and time to make certain passages.
But that is the case anywhere. I spent four embarrassing hours at the entrance to Fisherman Bay on Lopez Island in the San Juan's Islands, because I entered the keel depth off-set incorrectly. I used the time to get very knowledgeable on the setting of my particular depth sounder.
"I'm not concerned about sailing performance as much as the 3' 10" vs 5' 3". I would welcome any input."
Since sailing performance isn't a primary consideration, the one thing I can tell you is that the wing has a shallower draft than the fin.
Boom crash. Appearing 2 shows nightly, 'til the end of the week. Seriously, there is one more option with the C-30's and it is a shoal draft keel (4' 5" draft, a bit longer keel stub). When I was looking for mine, I looked at a SD in Rock Hall, MD that was supposedly Don Moyer (of Moyer Marine, #1 Atomic 4 Guru)'s old boat. While funny for the reason it had a 11hp 5411 Universal diesel in it, the SD keel on the other hand looked like a nice compromise. Good luck with your search. Sorry, I don't know about getting down the ICW. Seems like a wing would be easier? Like Brad suggests, a 30 foot boat will have some draft considerations that will require keeping watch on the tide situation.
Since sailing performance isn't a primary consideration, the one thing I can tell you is that the wing has a shallower draft than the fin.
Boom crash. Appearing 2 shows nightly, 'til the end of the week. Seriously, there is one more option with the C-30's and it is a shoal draft keel (4' 5" draft, a bit longer keel stub). When I was looking for mine, I looked at a SD in Rock Hall, MD that was supposedly Don Moyer (of Moyer Marine, #1 Atomic 4 Guru)'s old boat. While funny for the reason it had a 11hp 5411 Universal diesel in it, the SD keel on the other hand looked like a nice compromise. Good luck with your search. Sorry, I don't know about getting down the ICW. Seems like a wing would be easier? Like Brad suggests, a 30 foot boat will have some draft considerations that will require keeping watch on the tide situation.cat 30 draft
Thank you both for the input. Having recently retired I sort of have that uncaged feeling. So I want to think things through. --- you know, not rush off to town and "lose the egg money." On the other hand I can think things to death. Thanks again. Tom
Thank you both for the input. Having recently retired I sort of have that uncaged feeling. So I want to think things through. --- you know, not rush off to town and "lose the egg money." On the other hand I can think things to death. Thanks again. Tom
Re: cat 30 draft
sometime in the period you're looking - before 5961 was completed in 1991 - catalina switched to a walk-though stern. a big safety and convience change. just think of hauling someone overboard over a gunwale as oppopsed through an open stern, which is also self-bailing. this can be more important to you than the keel, but it won's be free; these later boats command premiums; they're worth it, this is one of the few options whose cost won't evaporate with the years.
sometime in the period you're looking - before 5961 was completed in 1991 - catalina switched to a walk-though stern. a big safety and convience change. just think of hauling someone overboard over a gunwale as oppopsed through an open stern, which is also self-bailing. this can be more important to you than the keel, but it won's be free; these later boats command premiums; they're worth it, this is one of the few options whose cost won't evaporate with the years.
Tom,
I recently helped a pal bring his new 1987 Newport 30 back from Charlott Harbour to Tampa Bay. It was about 120 nm total. Lenny's boat is a wing keel. I myself own a C30 (1980) w/fin keel. With a loaded boat, I draw 5'-6". Len's boat draws 4'-3".
The trip back was rough, with at some times 5-7 foot seas clocking from aft the beam to bow and back to astern. I was paying attention to differences between fin & wing and here are my observations:
There was less tendency to rounding up with wind gusts.
Less side to side roll when getting hit with waves broadside.
A stiffer boat when heeled.
A softer more tame ride overall making way.
Easier steering in following seas, with less instances of stern twisting off wave.
Overall I thought a better, smoother, & more comfortable ride.
If I had it to do all over again, I would look for a winged keel for myself.
Also of note, the dimensions between the Newport & C30 are very close.
Yet, Len runs @ 7.5kts over ground to windward with a 135 jib.
I have a 155 jib and usually max out @ 6.3 kts (windward), slower in bigger seas.
One more difference between fin & keel is with a fin, I go aground in deeper water than with a wing. I have heard that if aground a wing may be tougher to break free.
Just my thoughts pal.
CR
I recently helped a pal bring his new 1987 Newport 30 back from Charlott Harbour to Tampa Bay. It was about 120 nm total. Lenny's boat is a wing keel. I myself own a C30 (1980) w/fin keel. With a loaded boat, I draw 5'-6". Len's boat draws 4'-3".
The trip back was rough, with at some times 5-7 foot seas clocking from aft the beam to bow and back to astern. I was paying attention to differences between fin & wing and here are my observations:
There was less tendency to rounding up with wind gusts.
Less side to side roll when getting hit with waves broadside.
A stiffer boat when heeled.
A softer more tame ride overall making way.
Easier steering in following seas, with less instances of stern twisting off wave.
Overall I thought a better, smoother, & more comfortable ride.
If I had it to do all over again, I would look for a winged keel for myself.
Also of note, the dimensions between the Newport & C30 are very close.
Yet, Len runs @ 7.5kts over ground to windward with a 135 jib.
I have a 155 jib and usually max out @ 6.3 kts (windward), slower in bigger seas.
One more difference between fin & keel is with a fin, I go aground in deeper water than with a wing. I have heard that if aground a wing may be tougher to break free.
Just my thoughts pal.
CR
I have the wing keel but only by chance. I was looking for the most boat my budget could buy and I ended up spending a little more than originally planned. I was lucky to find a boat that sat on the hard for 4 years because the owner took a job on the west coast with intentions of coming back. He never did and I got a great boat for a good/fair to him price. I can't tell you but have heard the fin keel will hold a better course and is faster. What I like is our ability to anchor in shallower waters than most other boats. Often time at 5' MLW and we share space with multihulls . It's less crowded and I still have peace of mind.
. It's less crowded and I still have peace of mind.Another thought on the ICW aspect: engine choice. I would rather have the three cylinder diesel for that trip. I've heard there's lots of motoring down the Ditch.
Rob
Rob
Thank you all again. Im going to Sandusky, Ohio tomorrow to look at a1988 wing keel. It also has the xp 25 diesel which I would definitely want. By the way, 75 degrees here in Michigan! And forecast of over 70 for the next 10 days. Time to get a boat in the water.
By the time you get to Sandusky, I should be under sail! I will be thinking of you!tom power said:
Good luck checking out the boat. Had a fin keel 30 (1979) that sailed great and currently have a wing keel 310 that sails just as well. I'm sure you'll be happy with whatever you decide on as the 30 is a great boat to own.
Take lots of pics and post them for us and feel free to ask for opinions/advice from the forum members.
I just made the trip in my C30
I have the 85 C30 tall rig, fin keel. My wife and I made the trip from Petoskey to Daytona Beach last year, it was awesome, I took video of the entire trip. You can see it on my You tube channel . Just google blowinganddrifting and you should get a link to it, or try this.
http://youtu.be/4kOO6Wz5_uk
Any questions are welcomed, email me at blowinganddrifting@yahoo.com
Thanks, Dean
I have the 85 C30 tall rig, fin keel. My wife and I made the trip from Petoskey to Daytona Beach last year, it was awesome, I took video of the entire trip. You can see it on my You tube channel . Just google blowinganddrifting and you should get a link to it, or try this.
http://youtu.be/4kOO6Wz5_uk
Any questions are welcomed, email me at blowinganddrifting@yahoo.com
Thanks, Dean
Thanks again to all. I went to see the 1988 cat 30 in Ohio. I liked it. Hasn't been in the water for almost 2 years. Covered nicely. But water standing in the bilge. Pumped it out. Checked the wood part of the compression post under the cabin floor and stuck my finger right through it. That was discouraging. Not much deflection of the cabin top at the mast base. Several bullseyes in the non skid around the mast base which are open and haven't been taken care of. A friend of mind who does some surveying is going to look at it with me. Thanks again. Tom
I looked at a 1990 today also on the hard and the water in the bilge was almost up to the floor. Pumped some out with the manual pump and attempted to check the compression post block but it was all glassed in. The shower tube protruded about half way up on the port side and the mast wiring exited at the top of the bilge. I wasn't able to poke my finger in anything. This boat also could use bulkheads replaced. It seems the cushions keep the wood damp and causes rot where ever they touch so there is a 2-3" strip of rot.
Doug
Doug
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