Catalina 27 - Soft cabin floor/sole issue

[rtdbphoto]

Was wondering if anyone there has ever come across this. I have a Catalina 27 (1972). and the cabin sole as you enter the v-berth is starting to get soft and a little crunchy. Sounds like wood rot. I checked the bilge, and there's water in there (brown... probably from the wood rotting.) I'm trying to figure out if the catalina smile has set it, flooded the bilge and rotted out the core of that area. The soft area is limited to just this area and no where else on the boat. Everything else is rock solid. I don't know how to fix a cabin floor... I'm about 200 lbs and it still supports me in that area with no problems. I'm looking for some insight, so if you are familiar with this problem or the extent of damage I've gotten myself into let me know! And if you've paid to have this fixed let me know the damage... I think I'm in for another few $$$$.

 

[Tom Monroe]

I think your analysis is very probable for a '72.

The "fix" for the Catalina smile is well documented. Catalina will send you detail on the process. On the spongy floor, I seem to remember that in this vintage of C27, there is some structural wood down there. Whatever it is, it's not going to get better, and the only way to determine the problem is to open the area up. Not easy cause there are bulkheads and lockers and stuff that will have to be removed. All this is not a task for someone who, like me, is not real handy and happy doing the work.

On a '72 boat, the cost might not be worth it?

Just my opinion.

Tom
'86 C27

 

[kenn]

Tricky, but not impossible

Our boat has a common issue with some floor rot, so I sympathize.

I don't know the specifics of your boat, but what I would most likely do is to simply cut out the floor in the vee-berth area, leaving a "flange" of floor edge that you can re-attach to later. This gives you the access to survey the problem, and to easily rip out wet foam. You could leave this open for a month or 6 to let the whole area dry out as much as possible.

To rebuild, you have good access to replace any rotted floor supports. I would not replace any foam at the floor level. You can rebuild the removed floor section on your workbench, or fabricate a new one.

You have the option of permanently glassing the floor back in, but I'd prefer to have it removable so you can inspect the area in future.

Does your boat have a bilge, accessible at the lowest point? If not I'd consider putting in one so that you can monitor and remove any water that gets in.

Good luck.

 

[rtdbphoto]

Thanks for the advice!
Looks like its time to take out the old dremel and get to work...I'm definitely going to turn whatever I cut out into a panel for future access.

I trust myself with fiberglass repair but not the keel work. Anyone have any ideas on how much yards are charging to fix "the smile"???

After all of this I'm tempted to just remove all the seacocks all together, switch to a porta-potti with a pumpout, and have an impermeable hull!

 

[Hermit Scott]

I had a few inches of catalina smile on my 79. I cut it away and the crack was only in the filler used to fair the keel. I removed all the filler around the keel. I used fiberglass and epoxy to add 1" in the front and rear of the keel and about 1/4" on the sides. Now it is water tight and probably strong enough to hold the keel on with no keel bolts.
If you are ok with fiberglass work you can do it yourself. However yoru boat most likely has a plywood layer to the keel stump that the keel bolts go through in the bilge.
Clean out the bilge and look for cracking around the keel bolts. This is one of the signs that your plywood is now oatmeal. There is a fix but requires dropping the keel.
You really should have someone who has experience with this check it out. You don't want to lose a keel.

 

[Joe]

Posting a picture of the problem could help.

If you're talking about the floor board (sole) that covers the bilge, just make a new one, use the old board as a pattern for the new one.... or you could probably order one from Catalina Yachts parts dept.

When's the last time you removed the bilge water? Just because it's brown doesn't mean it came through the keel bolts. Before you start tearing the boat apart you need to determine the source of the water in your bilge. The reason it's there...... is because that's what a bilge is for... it's the lowest point inside the boat. Now matter where the water comes in it's going to end up there. Check for leaks in the mast step, packing gland, deck fittings, holding tank and head.... fresh water tanks etc. Do not assume water is seeping in through the keel bolts until you've investigated the rest of the boat. You can try sprinkling talcum powder on the inside of the hull a foot or so outside the bilge. Get a hose and wash your boat. Start looking for water pathways left in the talc.... See what I mean? If you have an inboard motor there are quite a few potential leak sources....... check them out.

A very common way water gets into the bilge is through the bilge pump's hose itself. On my 27, the hose runs to a manual pump on the cockpit bulkhead, then back to discharge into the OB motor well. It took a while... like 5 years... for me to figure out the water was entering the hose in the motor well then siphoning itself back through the pump's ineffective check valve. The immediate solution was to put a bend in the hose to act as a trap ... it also got the end of the hose out of the motor well. Problem solved. I still get water in there on occasion.... but not a problem... that's why you have a bilge pump and a wet vac.

 

[maxxx]

OK, call me dumb. What is a Catalina smile??????, max

 

[sailingdog]

The catalina smile is the smile shaped crack that forms at the keel-hull join when the plywood that was used in the keel support stub starts to rot and the keel starts to drop. This was a fairly common problem on the earlier boats, later boats (post 1988 IIRC) used solid fiberglass for the keel stub support area, so didn't get this issue.

OK, call me dumb. What is a Catalina smile??????, max