Has anyone had experience with a 3 blade Campbell Sailer propeller? I have been leaning towards a feathering prop, but the expense has kept me from it. While doing research into fixed 3 blades I have found that the main props seem to be Michigan and Campbell, and the Campbell looks much more efficient and actually pretty good for a fixed 3 blade. It is also about 1/4 of the cost of a feathering prop and does not have the maintenance requirements that the feathering props have. I would be interested in any feedback on fixed 3 blades, and specifically on the Campbell. Rob McClain
Campbell Sailer Propeller
- Thread starter Rob McClain
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Contact Bay Props in Alameda!
Rob: Contact Bay Props in Alameda, CA. They will set you straight on the different prop configurations. If you have the honor of speaking with Bob Kilian he can/will explain everything you want to know. www.bay-ship.com/bayprp_nonsliptip.html
Rob: Contact Bay Props in Alameda, CA. They will set you straight on the different prop configurations. If you have the honor of speaking with Bob Kilian he can/will explain everything you want to know. www.bay-ship.com/bayprp_nonsliptip.html
We have a Cambell 2 blade
I know its not a three blade so take this at face value. Works great for us, 34 ft'er 10,500 lbs disp. 15 hp, drives us to 7 kts@ 2500 rpm, cruises @ 6 kts @ 2100 rpm. We are pleased with it. Can't see going to a folder etc to gain 1/2 or 1 kt under sail. Too much expense and complexity... D.
I know its not a three blade so take this at face value. Works great for us, 34 ft'er 10,500 lbs disp. 15 hp, drives us to 7 kts@ 2500 rpm, cruises @ 6 kts @ 2100 rpm. We are pleased with it. Can't see going to a folder etc to gain 1/2 or 1 kt under sail. Too much expense and complexity... D.
Campbell 3 Blade
Rob, I have a Campbell 3 blade 13x9 on a Catalina 30 with a re-power Yanmar 2GM with 13 HP. I picked the prop up used as a 14x10 for $125.00 in Vancouver and took it to Victoria Props in Naniamo BC (the manufactor) and had them cut it down to 13 inch and re pitch to 9 inch. (Cost $100.00 and same day service) This was suspose to be the correct size/pitch however the little diesel out rev's the prop so I need more pitch. Speed at 2900 rpm is 4 knts and 5 at 3500 rpm with no lug on the engine at all. I called the shop and explained the problem and their answer was: bring it back up and we will re-pitch it to 11 inch. Drop if off in the morning and go for lunch at the local pub and it will be ready in the afternoon. (Shop is an hour north of here)That is service! As for sailing speed there was no loss what so ever. Cliff Carter PlusOne cliffc@city.victoria.bc.ca
Rob, I have a Campbell 3 blade 13x9 on a Catalina 30 with a re-power Yanmar 2GM with 13 HP. I picked the prop up used as a 14x10 for $125.00 in Vancouver and took it to Victoria Props in Naniamo BC (the manufactor) and had them cut it down to 13 inch and re pitch to 9 inch. (Cost $100.00 and same day service) This was suspose to be the correct size/pitch however the little diesel out rev's the prop so I need more pitch. Speed at 2900 rpm is 4 knts and 5 at 3500 rpm with no lug on the engine at all. I called the shop and explained the problem and their answer was: bring it back up and we will re-pitch it to 11 inch. Drop if off in the morning and go for lunch at the local pub and it will be ready in the afternoon. (Shop is an hour north of here)That is service! As for sailing speed there was no loss what so ever. Cliff Carter PlusOne cliffc@city.victoria.bc.ca
I have the Campbell 3 blade
Rob, I have had a 3 blade 12X7 Campbell on my CS 27 (27 ft., 6100#, 8 HP Yanmar YSE8) for two seasons. Replaced a fixed 2 blade 13X8. I got it to fix two complaints: 1) Not enough power into waves and wind, and 2) bad prop walk in reverse. There is less prop walk but its still there. As for power, there was a definite improvement. Going out the harbour entrance into a head wind and waves use to slow the boat down to about 2 knots, now I can go out at 4 to 4.5 knots with some throttle to spare. Note, I don't have a tach so I can't supply before and after rpm comparisions. Motoring in calm conditions improved by 1 knot, but I think I may be too conservative with my rpms and could probably motor a little faster. Have not noticed any reduction in sailing speed. Here is my only complaint. The finish on the prop was a bit rough. There are a lot grove marks on the blade surfaces left from the machining/polishing. This lets the algae get a good hold on the prop and it builds up more than my smoother two blade. You may want to talk to North by West to see if they have improved on this. I know two other boat owner who are very happy with the improved motoring performance. Kevin
Rob, I have had a 3 blade 12X7 Campbell on my CS 27 (27 ft., 6100#, 8 HP Yanmar YSE8) for two seasons. Replaced a fixed 2 blade 13X8. I got it to fix two complaints: 1) Not enough power into waves and wind, and 2) bad prop walk in reverse. There is less prop walk but its still there. As for power, there was a definite improvement. Going out the harbour entrance into a head wind and waves use to slow the boat down to about 2 knots, now I can go out at 4 to 4.5 knots with some throttle to spare. Note, I don't have a tach so I can't supply before and after rpm comparisions. Motoring in calm conditions improved by 1 knot, but I think I may be too conservative with my rpms and could probably motor a little faster. Have not noticed any reduction in sailing speed. Here is my only complaint. The finish on the prop was a bit rough. There are a lot grove marks on the blade surfaces left from the machining/polishing. This lets the algae get a good hold on the prop and it builds up more than my smoother two blade. You may want to talk to North by West to see if they have improved on this. I know two other boat owner who are very happy with the improved motoring performance. Kevin
Cliff,
when you said you had the diameter reduced I said to myself *yks don't do it! Always go for as much diameter as possible. Do you know what will clear your hull? Or where you (I hate to say this, sorry,,) guessing?
when you said you had the diameter reduced I said to myself *yks don't do it! Always go for as much diameter as possible. Do you know what will clear your hull? Or where you (I hate to say this, sorry,,) guessing?
Fred
Fred, When I had the 14 inch prop cut down to 13 inch it was done so as to clear the bottom of the hull and leave enough clearance to prevent cavitation. At 14 inch and the distance from the strut it was just to close in my mind. I measured several times(under water) before the cut. When you compare a 3 blade Campbell to a normal 3 blade prop they look way different. Cutting the Campbell down an inch did not change the view or shape of it at all. The prop still has to go back into the shop to be re pitched and I believe that will bring the performance back up to where it should be. By the way where is Seabeck Washington, one place this boat has not been as yet? Cliff Carter PlusOne Oak Bay, B.C.
Fred, When I had the 14 inch prop cut down to 13 inch it was done so as to clear the bottom of the hull and leave enough clearance to prevent cavitation. At 14 inch and the distance from the strut it was just to close in my mind. I measured several times(under water) before the cut. When you compare a 3 blade Campbell to a normal 3 blade prop they look way different. Cutting the Campbell down an inch did not change the view or shape of it at all. The prop still has to go back into the shop to be re pitched and I believe that will bring the performance back up to where it should be. By the way where is Seabeck Washington, one place this boat has not been as yet? Cliff Carter PlusOne Oak Bay, B.C.
3 blade may not HELP prop walk.
Look at what happens with most sailors claiming that they have reduced prop walk by using a 3 blade prop. It is usually a function of a smaller diameter prop. The normal tip to hull clearance sould be at least 15% of the diameter of the prop. If you have a smaller prop, then you will have more hull to tip clearance. The other function that you may experience is the fact that you have additional thrust in reverse. This will get you more headway which also can be achieved by give a 2 bladed prop more power to get the boat moving.
Look at what happens with most sailors claiming that they have reduced prop walk by using a 3 blade prop. It is usually a function of a smaller diameter prop. The normal tip to hull clearance sould be at least 15% of the diameter of the prop. If you have a smaller prop, then you will have more hull to tip clearance. The other function that you may experience is the fact that you have additional thrust in reverse. This will get you more headway which also can be achieved by give a 2 bladed prop more power to get the boat moving.
Further to Cliff
Rob, After reading Cliff and Steve's comments I thought I'd expand on my original post. I reduced the prop diam. by 1 inch to get more clearance as mentioned by Steve. I only had 1 inch and you could feel the cavitation on the bottom of the hull. My model year CS 27 was the first year of manufacture and later models had the skeg increased by about 1.5 inches while retaining the same size 2 blade prop. So it looks like the builder recognized the problem early on. AS for pitch, like Cliff I think that I could probably increase mine to 8 or 9 as the engine never seems to get overloaded. Keep in mind that the folks at West by North can only do a best guess at what will work for your boat-engine config. You should try to find someone with a campbell on a similar boat to yours and work up or down from their experience. Kevin
Rob, After reading Cliff and Steve's comments I thought I'd expand on my original post. I reduced the prop diam. by 1 inch to get more clearance as mentioned by Steve. I only had 1 inch and you could feel the cavitation on the bottom of the hull. My model year CS 27 was the first year of manufacture and later models had the skeg increased by about 1.5 inches while retaining the same size 2 blade prop. So it looks like the builder recognized the problem early on. AS for pitch, like Cliff I think that I could probably increase mine to 8 or 9 as the engine never seems to get overloaded. Keep in mind that the folks at West by North can only do a best guess at what will work for your boat-engine config. You should try to find someone with a campbell on a similar boat to yours and work up or down from their experience. Kevin
Great Feedback
I appreciate all of the feedback! I have little expertise with props so this is very helpful. I have been debating this decision for the past year, but I am making some progress. As Steve mentioned, located in Alameda is Bay Props and they can put a tip on the prop which is supposed to help with efficiency - similar to how airplane wings now have tips. They tried to do that with mine but unfortunately it was cast in too much sand so it was too brittle to do the work. They said it was perfectly fine to continue using, just couldn't bend the tip. I have thought about getting a 3 new blade from them and then having them tip it, but no decision yet. My diesel mechanic read a technical test review from Michigan Props once that was inconclusive regarding tipping a prop or just leaving a bit more hull clearence. According to the Michigan study, bending the tip a 1/4" gave better hull clearence so that alone might have been why there was less prop walk. I don't know, but I am quite intrigued by the tipping idea, and it still far more economical than going to the expense of a feathering prop. I am not sure how it would effect a Camplell Sailer, and will certainly talk to them first if I go that way. Rob
I appreciate all of the feedback! I have little expertise with props so this is very helpful. I have been debating this decision for the past year, but I am making some progress. As Steve mentioned, located in Alameda is Bay Props and they can put a tip on the prop which is supposed to help with efficiency - similar to how airplane wings now have tips. They tried to do that with mine but unfortunately it was cast in too much sand so it was too brittle to do the work. They said it was perfectly fine to continue using, just couldn't bend the tip. I have thought about getting a 3 new blade from them and then having them tip it, but no decision yet. My diesel mechanic read a technical test review from Michigan Props once that was inconclusive regarding tipping a prop or just leaving a bit more hull clearence. According to the Michigan study, bending the tip a 1/4" gave better hull clearence so that alone might have been why there was less prop walk. I don't know, but I am quite intrigued by the tipping idea, and it still far more economical than going to the expense of a feathering prop. I am not sure how it would effect a Camplell Sailer, and will certainly talk to them first if I go that way. Rob
Cliff
Gotchya. Seabeck is on Hood Canal, same latitude as Seattle, due west, as is Brownsville where we keep our boat. If you get down here, let me know. I'll buy.
Gotchya. Seabeck is on Hood Canal, same latitude as Seattle, due west, as is Brownsville where we keep our boat. If you get down here, let me know. I'll buy.
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