I have always winter stored my P42 with the mast up until this year (so I could check swages and install a SSB antenna in the backstay). I was not present when the mast came down and the boat hauled, but I am told by the yard that nothing unusual happened then. I just inspected the boat and found a great deal of structural damage around the "windshield" area, both inside and out. The deck mounting plate for the mast has moved upward about an inch and a half, extending the mast compression post inside (there seems to be a telescoping post inside of the primary one). In addition, the headliner is badly cracked at both upper outer corners. The outer hull has separated from the headliner all along the upper edge and fractured the headliner in several places. The outer hull has cracked at the upper starboard corner and at the middle, the black windshield bonding material has broken away some of the gelcoat and fiberglass below. All of the black rubber bonding material has pulled away and/or broken. There is also a great deal of gelcoat cracking around the base for the mast step. This level of damage was a total surprise. It appears that the entire cabint top moved upward when the compression loads from the mast and rigging were removed. QUESTION #1. Has any one ever seen anything like this happen before and what is the cause? QUESTION #2. How do you repair it? since the cabin top has moved upward, it will be necessary to pull or push it back into place before making repairs. If this is done will it stay permanently or just break again? QUESTION #3. If you have experinced this type of failure, how was it repaired and what was the cost? Did Hunter help with repairs? If you have any answers, I would appreciate a call to 248-477-0096, so we can discuss it. Thanx
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arthur boas
Just a guess
This seems very strange, and the fact that you were'nt at the yard when the mast was pulled makes it hard to verify what happened. It almost sounds to me as though they were lifting the spar with the crane, and did not disconnect something at the base. The larger mast cranes certainly have enough lift capacity to cause this type of damage. As I said, just a guess
This seems very strange, and the fact that you were'nt at the yard when the mast was pulled makes it hard to verify what happened. It almost sounds to me as though they were lifting the spar with the crane, and did not disconnect something at the base. The larger mast cranes certainly have enough lift capacity to cause this type of damage. As I said, just a guess
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Warren Feldstein
Marine surveyor
Get a very good Marine surveyor to examine the problem. Insurance companies often use them to examine damage and assess how to repair it. It is critical to ensure that any opinion you receive is unbiased. Therefore try to find someone independant of the marina and your insurance company. Make detailed written notes as to what happened when as you may need the notes. Take photographs and send copies of the prints to Hunter as they probably could help. Hope this helps. Warren Feldstein
Get a very good Marine surveyor to examine the problem. Insurance companies often use them to examine damage and assess how to repair it. It is critical to ensure that any opinion you receive is unbiased. Therefore try to find someone independant of the marina and your insurance company. Make detailed written notes as to what happened when as you may need the notes. Take photographs and send copies of the prints to Hunter as they probably could help. Hope this helps. Warren Feldstein
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George Kornreich
Need the RIGHT surveyor
I certainly agree that someone tried to lift the boat by the mast! Since you may have an insurance claim or even a legal action, I would be sure that you comfirm with the surveyor before hiring him that he will be willing to provide IN WRITING as part of his report his professional opinion not only of the nature of the damages but also how he believes it occured. Surveyors tend to include lots of waivers and disclaimers in their contracts and reports, and often carry no "errors and omissions" (malpractice) insurance. Before hiring one, be sure you determine that he carries the appropriate insurance. (My brother once asked one if he had insurance, and of course he said "yes" but all he had was car insurance! This didn't work out very well when that surveyor really missed major defects in the boat and ultimately was sued, lost, but had no assets).
I certainly agree that someone tried to lift the boat by the mast! Since you may have an insurance claim or even a legal action, I would be sure that you comfirm with the surveyor before hiring him that he will be willing to provide IN WRITING as part of his report his professional opinion not only of the nature of the damages but also how he believes it occured. Surveyors tend to include lots of waivers and disclaimers in their contracts and reports, and often carry no "errors and omissions" (malpractice) insurance. Before hiring one, be sure you determine that he carries the appropriate insurance. (My brother once asked one if he had insurance, and of course he said "yes" but all he had was car insurance! This didn't work out very well when that surveyor really missed major defects in the boat and ultimately was sued, lost, but had no assets).
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Michael Cohn
Ouch
I don't think you can do that sort of damage simply by lifting a mast off a boat unless somebody forgot to disconnect something. Of course, the yard will deny any fault, as yards always deny fault in my experience. You will indeed need a surveyor, and a good one, but be aware that you may have a very difficult time proving that the yard is at fault unless somebody admits to screwing up. If it were me, I would let the insurance company for the yard and my insurer just hassle each other - in any event, your boat gets repaired, and at most you pay the deductible. I would primarily use the surveyor's report as a guide to what is going to be a major repair, and I would be very careful about picking the people who do the repair. MC
I don't think you can do that sort of damage simply by lifting a mast off a boat unless somebody forgot to disconnect something. Of course, the yard will deny any fault, as yards always deny fault in my experience. You will indeed need a surveyor, and a good one, but be aware that you may have a very difficult time proving that the yard is at fault unless somebody admits to screwing up. If it were me, I would let the insurance company for the yard and my insurer just hassle each other - in any event, your boat gets repaired, and at most you pay the deductible. I would primarily use the surveyor's report as a guide to what is going to be a major repair, and I would be very careful about picking the people who do the repair. MC
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Rod Leonard
Mike Cohn, Foxfire
Mike, Just bought a new 1987 45'. I will be comissioning it this spring. Anything I should look for. I have to put in new Batteries & Prop. You seem to be very knowledgeable & I see you have a 45'. What a great looking boat and it seems like it's built like a tank. Any help is appricated. Thanks Rod
Mike, Just bought a new 1987 45'. I will be comissioning it this spring. Anything I should look for. I have to put in new Batteries & Prop. You seem to be very knowledgeable & I see you have a 45'. What a great looking boat and it seems like it's built like a tank. Any help is appricated. Thanks Rod
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Michael cohn
Hi Rod
Write to me at shfwilf@pacbell.net and we can talk about the boat - you are going to have a great time with it! MC
Write to me at shfwilf@pacbell.net and we can talk about the boat - you are going to have a great time with it! MC
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Donald Guggenheim
Did it freeze ???????
From the other responses and my own experience with deck stepped mast, the problem was caused by the yard. There must be a hole for the various mast wiring (mastheat instruments, lights, radar, etc.)to pass to the interior oof the cabin. If this hole is properly sealed there is no migration of moisture. If not, moisture could pass through. It sounds as though the yard removed the mast, removing the sealant where the wires passed through, and did not properly seal the hole allowing moisture to pass through, accumulate in the compression post, and freeze causing the damage you have suffered. A hole drilled in the compression post may or may not help as in freezing conditions the water could freeze over the hole, trash could block the hole, etc. Stopping the migration at the step prior to entering is the solution. Any good yard knows to seal all possible opportunities for water to enter a hull or cabin. This precaution is more important in freezing climates. I don't see the problem as a design problem from Hunter. Sorry for your problem, if this applies surely the yard will accept the responsibility. Don Guggenheim S/V OZ Hunter 460
From the other responses and my own experience with deck stepped mast, the problem was caused by the yard. There must be a hole for the various mast wiring (mastheat instruments, lights, radar, etc.)to pass to the interior oof the cabin. If this hole is properly sealed there is no migration of moisture. If not, moisture could pass through. It sounds as though the yard removed the mast, removing the sealant where the wires passed through, and did not properly seal the hole allowing moisture to pass through, accumulate in the compression post, and freeze causing the damage you have suffered. A hole drilled in the compression post may or may not help as in freezing conditions the water could freeze over the hole, trash could block the hole, etc. Stopping the migration at the step prior to entering is the solution. Any good yard knows to seal all possible opportunities for water to enter a hull or cabin. This precaution is more important in freezing climates. I don't see the problem as a design problem from Hunter. Sorry for your problem, if this applies surely the yard will accept the responsibility. Don Guggenheim S/V OZ Hunter 460
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mike katz
Compression post P-42
GERRY, Sorry I haven't responded. Been out of the USA. My mast was up when I had the freeze/split. The culprit was uncovered when the mast was unstepped. The conduit for the inmast wiring was crushed(when the mast was commisioned improperly, allowing water to enter the post. Fortunately, the cabintop was only slightly elevated-no damage. Insurance(Boat US) covered it(less my deductable(1500!) Hunter may have split the cost of the new compression post(maybe). I honestly can't recall. I personally installed a new Flexible hose for the conduit which I caulked properly and the mast was restepped. Since then, no leakage. I am going to drill a weep hole at the base as you suggested. Good luck, I know you're aggravated, but Hunter's always been fair ith me. Mike
GERRY, Sorry I haven't responded. Been out of the USA. My mast was up when I had the freeze/split. The culprit was uncovered when the mast was unstepped. The conduit for the inmast wiring was crushed(when the mast was commisioned improperly, allowing water to enter the post. Fortunately, the cabintop was only slightly elevated-no damage. Insurance(Boat US) covered it(less my deductable(1500!) Hunter may have split the cost of the new compression post(maybe). I honestly can't recall. I personally installed a new Flexible hose for the conduit which I caulked properly and the mast was restepped. Since then, no leakage. I am going to drill a weep hole at the base as you suggested. Good luck, I know you're aggravated, but Hunter's always been fair ith me. Mike
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