Hello, I am new to sailing and considering purchasing a used sailboat. I plan on using the boat primarily on a lake nearby. It will need capability to sleep 2 couples comfortably on weekends, shower not necessary. I did not want to spend more than 25,000. Any suggestions on a good boat for a new sailor?
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What part of the country are you located Tom?
And what do you mean by "comfortable"? I had a Hunter 22 once that could sleep 4 . . . if they didn't mind crawling all over each other. Do you need a private head? Sounds like something in the 27 - 30' range is what you'd need but those are fairly large boats for a beginner. Lots of nice boats in that range - Cat 27, 28, 30, Hunter 28.5, 28, 280, 30, Pearson 28, 31, . . . many manufacturers built and still build boats of that size range. The best advice is to look at clean and fairly well kept examples as opposed to specific makes or years. Your learning curve would be vertical (electricals, inboard engines, plumbing systems, large sails, etc.) Keel draft might be a consideration as well depending on which lake. You maybe should start out in a cheaper 23-26 to see if you'd really like to take a leap larger.
And what do you mean by "comfortable"? I had a Hunter 22 once that could sleep 4 . . . if they didn't mind crawling all over each other. Do you need a private head? Sounds like something in the 27 - 30' range is what you'd need but those are fairly large boats for a beginner. Lots of nice boats in that range - Cat 27, 28, 30, Hunter 28.5, 28, 280, 30, Pearson 28, 31, . . . many manufacturers built and still build boats of that size range. The best advice is to look at clean and fairly well kept examples as opposed to specific makes or years. Your learning curve would be vertical (electricals, inboard engines, plumbing systems, large sails, etc.) Keel draft might be a consideration as well depending on which lake. You maybe should start out in a cheaper 23-26 to see if you'd really like to take a leap larger.
boat
I am living in Tennessee, plenty of lakes around. Any experience with the Hunter 240/260 class? These boats seem to be a good starting size and the prices of used boats are reasonable.
I am living in Tennessee, plenty of lakes around. Any experience with the Hunter 240/260 class? These boats seem to be a good starting size and the prices of used boats are reasonable.
240 is good for a couple +kids
I have a 1998 Hunter 240. The interior is roomy. The back berth is huge for a 24 ft boat. The V-berth in the bow is a bit short for grown adults.. I'll sleep in the V berth curled up (I'm 6'2") if the night is too hot to climb into the aft berth. I think the max length in the V berth is around 5'6'. The front hatch with a wind scoop really provides ventilation. The benches in the cockpit are big enough to sleep on, but the overnight dew makes this impractical. I don't think that you gain much bunk room in the 260 as most of the increased interior volume goes to the enclosed head. My advice is too climb on one and see what you think. Ken
I have a 1998 Hunter 240. The interior is roomy. The back berth is huge for a 24 ft boat. The V-berth in the bow is a bit short for grown adults.. I'll sleep in the V berth curled up (I'm 6'2") if the night is too hot to climb into the aft berth. I think the max length in the V berth is around 5'6'. The front hatch with a wind scoop really provides ventilation. The benches in the cockpit are big enough to sleep on, but the overnight dew makes this impractical. I don't think that you gain much bunk room in the 260 as most of the increased interior volume goes to the enclosed head. My advice is too climb on one and see what you think. Ken
Run Forrest Run!
Tom, this may be your last chance. Put down the mouse and run! Try golf, buy a motorcycle or invest in pork belly futures, or Lucent options as a safe and cheap hobby. Sailing / boat owning / is not for the weak of heart. If you need a boat that will sleep 2 couples "comfortably" find a marina that is attached to a Hilton hotel. j/k
Tom, this may be your last chance. Put down the mouse and run! Try golf, buy a motorcycle or invest in pork belly futures, or Lucent options as a safe and cheap hobby. Sailing / boat owning / is not for the weak of heart. If you need a boat that will sleep 2 couples "comfortably" find a marina that is attached to a Hilton hotel. j/k
Merg's advice
reminds me of similar advice I gave to a friend whose daughter developed an interest in showing horses. I suggested getting her involved in a nice inner-city street gang instead, as it would be cheaper and less stressful on him. To echo other comments, I think the 2 couple thing is potentially a challenge. I regard my H260 as a single couple boat (aft berth), since the forward V berth is not suited to an adult couple IMHO. Depending on the size, might not even be suitable for a single adult. Thus, to fit 2 adult couples comfortably, you are getting out of the simple trailerables and into boats with a full complement of marine systems. For the most part, lake sailing would be reasonably forgiving, but mastering and maintaining a host of complex systems would initially be nightmarish. If the 2 couple thing is non-negotiable and you decide to get a mid-size cruiser, ingratiate yourself to someone with experience in those types of boats that can step aboard and periodically give you a hand or on-site advice.
reminds me of similar advice I gave to a friend whose daughter developed an interest in showing horses. I suggested getting her involved in a nice inner-city street gang instead, as it would be cheaper and less stressful on him. To echo other comments, I think the 2 couple thing is potentially a challenge. I regard my H260 as a single couple boat (aft berth), since the forward V berth is not suited to an adult couple IMHO. Depending on the size, might not even be suitable for a single adult. Thus, to fit 2 adult couples comfortably, you are getting out of the simple trailerables and into boats with a full complement of marine systems. For the most part, lake sailing would be reasonably forgiving, but mastering and maintaining a host of complex systems would initially be nightmarish. If the 2 couple thing is non-negotiable and you decide to get a mid-size cruiser, ingratiate yourself to someone with experience in those types of boats that can step aboard and periodically give you a hand or on-site advice.
First boat
I think the first boat you should experience is anything you can rent. I am not being facetious.
I think the first boat you should experience is anything you can rent. I am not being facetious.
First sail boat
You have a lot of good advice so far . I would suggest you go to a fairly good sized lake and find the local sailing /club / association / whatever the local sailors are calling them selves and introduced your self . You won't find a group of nicer people who are eager to share their passion . Most sailing clubs have races on weekends and usually short of crew . Offer to crew on a boat . You could spend a summer sailing and not spend a dime other than buying a few barley pops after the races . By getting to know the locals you will learn a lot about different boats and can decide what you like and hopefully avoid spending a lot of money on something that does not suit your needs .Good Luck , Mike
You have a lot of good advice so far . I would suggest you go to a fairly good sized lake and find the local sailing /club / association / whatever the local sailors are calling them selves and introduced your self . You won't find a group of nicer people who are eager to share their passion . Most sailing clubs have races on weekends and usually short of crew . Offer to crew on a boat . You could spend a summer sailing and not spend a dime other than buying a few barley pops after the races . By getting to know the locals you will learn a lot about different boats and can decide what you like and hopefully avoid spending a lot of money on something that does not suit your needs .Good Luck , Mike
new boat
Thanks for the advice. I think joining the local club is a good idea. I am flexible with the sleeping part. I am an avid backpacker and used to ruffing it. However, I would like to get my wife involved as well. A comfortable boat would be more enjoyable for her. I think I may try the 240 and join the club. Eventually I hope to gain some experience and progress to coastal cruising.
Thanks for the advice. I think joining the local club is a good idea. I am flexible with the sleeping part. I am an avid backpacker and used to ruffing it. However, I would like to get my wife involved as well. A comfortable boat would be more enjoyable for her. I think I may try the 240 and join the club. Eventually I hope to gain some experience and progress to coastal cruising.
A Few thoughts..
the club idea is real good because it also introduces you to the boats that are popular at the club, which can be a great source of information for you. As far as having the wife sleep aboard thats a whole different animal. When my Son's and I go out one sleeps in the rear, one sleeps in the Settee, and I sleep on the V-Berth. When my wife sleeps aboard, I convert the V-berth area into an enclosed head, the aft berth becomes storage of her foot locker, and I convert the Settee benches into a center queen bed for sleeping at night. She is claustrophobic, so sleeping in the back is not an option. With the wife aboard, we enjoy doing the Marina thing more than anchoring out. Just some thoughts, Jack
the club idea is real good because it also introduces you to the boats that are popular at the club, which can be a great source of information for you. As far as having the wife sleep aboard thats a whole different animal. When my Son's and I go out one sleeps in the rear, one sleeps in the Settee, and I sleep on the V-Berth. When my wife sleeps aboard, I convert the V-berth area into an enclosed head, the aft berth becomes storage of her foot locker, and I convert the Settee benches into a center queen bed for sleeping at night. She is claustrophobic, so sleeping in the back is not an option. With the wife aboard, we enjoy doing the Marina thing more than anchoring out. Just some thoughts, Jack
The continuum of boat ownership through life
Tom, you don't mention how old you are, which I think is relevant factor in the equation leading to "Which boat?" The stage of life has a significant impact on which boat will fit your lifestyle... and don't forget, the boat chooses the captain, not the other way around! To make a broad, completely unfair generalization: the older & more upwardly mobile the sailor, the more boat with below-decks amenities he/she needs to be comfortable. To bring it back more specifically to you, if you are not an AAPR-er, I don't think you need to plan on dropping $25k into your first sailboat. (I write this with all due respect to our age-challenged e-fleet members!
) We're in our 40's with 2 pre-teens. Our 23.5 is perfect for us. A pair of couples in their 20's or 30's? As long as you are good friends -- and not averse to roughing it a little, as you have indicated you are -- the 23.5/240 or the 26/260 would be a great boat for taking the plunge. The 23.5 and 26 have the advantage of being essentially the same boat as the newer models available at a significant discount, so if sailing doesn't turn out to be your "thing," you're not stuck with a $25k white elephant in the backyard. By way of illustration, I think our experience is a fairly common one. We started 4 seasons ago with a 1981 Sandpiper 565, a drop keel 18.5' boat designed to Lloyd's standards to sail on the English Channel. The design was subsequently leased to CL Boatworks in Canada, where you can still find many of them. She's a simple, seaworthy boat -- not a greyhound, by any means -- great for an entry-level situation. Moreover, we got a GREAT deal on her & sailed Shortstay for 3 seasons, during which we confirmed that we were a sailing family. Right from the start, however, I had the Hunter 23.5 in the back of mind (for several reasons, not least of which is an emotional tie to the old Hunter 18.5 I sailed with my dad) and had been tracking the resale market. Before last season, we stepped up to the 23.5 because we found Shortstay just wasn't big enough for our growing family and, more importantly, the broader horizons we explored as we felt more confident as sailors, ready to take on longer voyages. So that's how we've evolved. Looking further down the road, we may some day move up to a larger keelboat, but living in the mountains of Vermont, trailerability is a key factor. I actually have my eye on (like the wanderlust of an unfaithful husband, you never stop thinking about the "next boat") the Telestar 28, a trailerable trimaran, but there's no way I'm sinking $60k+ into a new boat at this time in my life. I'm hoping by the time we're ready to step up -- if ever -- the resale market will have brought this boat into our price range. Apropos of the other advice, yes, the local club will be a significant asset/resource as you start to climb the learning curve(s). As long as it's not prohibitively expensive, it would be a great investment in your seamanship, safety & enjoyment. Also, there isn't a boatyard in the world that doesn't have more than a few beautiful lonely boats, pining away in dry docks for several seasons, waiting for someone to come love her again. This is relevant not only for finding a "good old boat" at a great price, but also a cautionary tale about jumping in a little too far, too fast, only to find out you don't have the time, money, crew, experience, etc. to actually use her. That said, I'd heartily endorse you go out there & get the keel wet this season! Let us know how it comes out. Kevin Fitzpatrick Brownsville, VT s/v Grasshopper Hunter 23.5
Tom, you don't mention how old you are, which I think is relevant factor in the equation leading to "Which boat?" The stage of life has a significant impact on which boat will fit your lifestyle... and don't forget, the boat chooses the captain, not the other way around! To make a broad, completely unfair generalization: the older & more upwardly mobile the sailor, the more boat with below-decks amenities he/she needs to be comfortable. To bring it back more specifically to you, if you are not an AAPR-er, I don't think you need to plan on dropping $25k into your first sailboat. (I write this with all due respect to our age-challenged e-fleet members!
) We're in our 40's with 2 pre-teens. Our 23.5 is perfect for us. A pair of couples in their 20's or 30's? As long as you are good friends -- and not averse to roughing it a little, as you have indicated you are -- the 23.5/240 or the 26/260 would be a great boat for taking the plunge. The 23.5 and 26 have the advantage of being essentially the same boat as the newer models available at a significant discount, so if sailing doesn't turn out to be your "thing," you're not stuck with a $25k white elephant in the backyard. By way of illustration, I think our experience is a fairly common one. We started 4 seasons ago with a 1981 Sandpiper 565, a drop keel 18.5' boat designed to Lloyd's standards to sail on the English Channel. The design was subsequently leased to CL Boatworks in Canada, where you can still find many of them. She's a simple, seaworthy boat -- not a greyhound, by any means -- great for an entry-level situation. Moreover, we got a GREAT deal on her & sailed Shortstay for 3 seasons, during which we confirmed that we were a sailing family. Right from the start, however, I had the Hunter 23.5 in the back of mind (for several reasons, not least of which is an emotional tie to the old Hunter 18.5 I sailed with my dad) and had been tracking the resale market. Before last season, we stepped up to the 23.5 because we found Shortstay just wasn't big enough for our growing family and, more importantly, the broader horizons we explored as we felt more confident as sailors, ready to take on longer voyages. So that's how we've evolved. Looking further down the road, we may some day move up to a larger keelboat, but living in the mountains of Vermont, trailerability is a key factor. I actually have my eye on (like the wanderlust of an unfaithful husband, you never stop thinking about the "next boat") the Telestar 28, a trailerable trimaran, but there's no way I'm sinking $60k+ into a new boat at this time in my life. I'm hoping by the time we're ready to step up -- if ever -- the resale market will have brought this boat into our price range. Apropos of the other advice, yes, the local club will be a significant asset/resource as you start to climb the learning curve(s). As long as it's not prohibitively expensive, it would be a great investment in your seamanship, safety & enjoyment. Also, there isn't a boatyard in the world that doesn't have more than a few beautiful lonely boats, pining away in dry docks for several seasons, waiting for someone to come love her again. This is relevant not only for finding a "good old boat" at a great price, but also a cautionary tale about jumping in a little too far, too fast, only to find out you don't have the time, money, crew, experience, etc. to actually use her. That said, I'd heartily endorse you go out there & get the keel wet this season! Let us know how it comes out. Kevin Fitzpatrick Brownsville, VT s/v Grasshopper Hunter 23.5Where in Tennessee
Where in Tennessee? I know some folks over in the Knoxville area who might help you. Let me know. Crazy Dave Condon Gotta be at Fort Loudon working on some boats in a week.
Where in Tennessee? I know some folks over in the Knoxville area who might help you. Let me know. Crazy Dave Condon Gotta be at Fort Loudon working on some boats in a week.
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