Another factor is import duty if/when you decide to bring the boat home. Any boat built outside of NAFTA/(whatever the latest version) will be subject to 9.5% duty.
Buying a Boat Outside Canada without a License ??
- Thread starter Prairie Virgin Sailor
- Start date
Excellent, Thanks so much.Now that you believe you are focused on the UK, you can do some serious research.
Here is a summary from a UK site.
How to Buy a Boat: The Boat Buyer’s Guide
Nervous about buying your first boat? This guide is designed to help you every step of the way, so you can start enjoying your new life on the water.www.boatsandoutboards.co.uk
That’s the easy part. You’ll next have to deal with the legal side and pay the VAT tax.
Register a boat
Register or license a boat for use on the UK's inland waterways or at sea - which authority to register with, the UK Ship Register and Small Ships Register, penalties and fineswww.gov.uk
An if you plan to sail back across the Atlantic the Canadian Gov will want a piece of your wallet.
Perhaps once you become a sailor of seas, you just sail towards the sunset and declare your a person of all countries. A man of the sea.
Is there a chance it resembled his wife ?
My wife did that during her beginner MOB training in a Laser 2. The class was 2 people per boat and each person was a live MOB for their crew partner. Perfect mild conditions... First time she stopped short under sail...
Second time she ran me down at slowish speed while I fended off.
3rd time she nailed it.
We joke about it every time we practise.
@Prairie Virgin Sailor are you interested in the boat license or operator license?
@Leeward Rail what did you yell at her after the first pass? That may explain the second passIs there a chance it resembled his wife ?
My wife did that during her beginner MOB training in a Laser 2. The class was 2 people per boat and each person was a live MOB for their crew partner. Perfect mild conditions... First time she stopped short under sail...
Second time she ran me down at slowish speed while I fended off.
3rd time she nailed it.
We joke about it every time we practise.
OK, you shouldn't have need of a license beyond what your country requires as long as you buy and leave. You might also be able to avoid the VAT if you are buying and leaving. But in your original post I believe you said you wanted to sail there for a time - what would that time length be? That could change things...
As others have said, once you bring the boat into Canada, you'll have taxes there to pay. I know of Canadians that have sailboats that are in the US that never take their boats to Canada just to avoid that. So when you sail your boat from the UK over to the US, you may wish to consider going up the Hudson, and stopping on Lake Champlain and leaving the boat there.... Just a thought...
dj
Great input, thanks. My current plan is to buy and leave (eventually). Because I am unable to find any Contessa 32s in Western Canada, I would come to the UK to purchase one. Because of my limited experience, I thought I may hang out in the "UK area" for a few months (allowable time re visitor laws) making myself comfortable with sailing my new boat and then eventually sail southeasterly to France, Spain, Portugal, etc.
I'm not familiar with "VAT". Can you expand on this?
I am indeed aware of the tax issues re returning to Canada. That will just have to be something I deal with in the future. Quite likely, I may never return to Canada with the boat so I will leave that particular "trouble" in tomorrow's basket.
Regarding Lake Champlain ... point taken, thanks.
Do you see any glaring oversights I may not be recognizing in my current plan? Really appreciate the input.
Sounds to me like you will need to gain some specific knowledge both for your new boat's registration and licensing as a sailor. Perhaps a broker where you find the boat you want can lead you down the right path.
It's a harmonized tax in the EU and the UK. Think GST +PST
You MAY not have to pay the U.K. VAT as long as it was already paid by the current owner. But you may end up paying it.
France Spain and Portugal are EU countries. From a VAT standpoint there are ONE place, not 3 difference places.
The UK is no longer part of the EU.
For example, if you use a non-EU (UK, Canada,USA..) boat longer than 18 continuous months in the EU (spain, portugal and france combined to use your example), you then have to pay EU VAT of 20% of the boats value.
To avoid that you would need to leave the EU, then re-renter. Simply leaving France and going to Spain doesn't count since it is all the European Union.
AFAIK, if a UK VAT Paid boat was physically in the EU when the Brexit change happened... the EU VAT is considered paid already. If that boat leaves the EU for more than 3 *years, you then need to pay the EU VAT when it goes back to the EU for longer than 18 months.
Ever wonder why people have to leave a country and then re-enter after a variable waiting period ? It's not just for the people on-board. it also avoids having to import the boat (pay taxes) into the countries you stop at.
As has been mentioned, the tax, and registration issue can be complex and a broker in the UK will be able to fill you in on the details for a specific boat for sale in the UK.
*Edit: corrected typo from months to years
Talk to a UK professional to get the exact CURRENT rules. Not some random people in a web forum who may not have done it recently.
(For example, I looked into it when the EU was formed and have only vaguely been keeping up on the new rules. So my comments may be out of date)
As for any formal training or certification for the sailors... I would get them, with a personal preference for the RYA Yachtmaster curriculum or similar. The Canadian Yachting Assocation (now Sail Canada) classes were really lacking decades ago, compared to RYA or the ISPA courses I took. That may have changed but, the RYA ia really the gold standard IMO.
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there were a few Contessa 32s sold recently in BC.
Here is one in Ontario:
Bayshore Yacht Sales - New Boat Sales and Yacht Brokerage
Your trusted destination for new boat sales and yacht brokerage. Authorized dealers for premier brands like Cobalt, MasterCraft, Grady-White, and more.
www.bayshoreyachts.com
They tend to be overpriced in North America. we have a couple on Lake Winnipeg, that have been sold for very reasonable prices. One is reportedly being shipped to the east coast, due to the inflated North American prices.
I would seriously look at buying in the EU. there are a few Contessa 32s for sale in the Netherlands. That also avoids the EU VAT issue, if the EU tax has been already paid. It is much easier to to leave the UK temporarily, than it is with the EU, since the EU is such a large area.
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Excellent overview. Thanks so much. I am really hoping I can find what I am looking for in Canada (eventually) but it appears to be more likely I will need to go to the UK. I will be using a broker where ever I buy the boat so that will make things a little easier but still I should have a FULL understanding of what you just outlined. Re formal training and certification, I actually do have a Personal Water Craft license in Canada, but as you mentioned this is incredibly low grade and to be quite honest, a monkey can pass it, but either way, it is a very basic knowledge of rules and regs. I found sailing to be the best teacher. You know, just do it! Again, thanks your comments are incredibly helpful.
So, based on your comments, there are obviously Contessa 32s in Canada, just not many of them for sale at this moment. I saw the one in Ontario but its a little out of my price range ($60,000 - $70,000). I have sold the bulk of my "stuff" but am currently on the final leg of selling my property. With that said, it will be spring (at the soonest) before I am officially a 'BUYER". Hopefully between now and then some more Contessa 32s will surface in the Canadian market. Thanks for your comments.there were a few Contessa 32s sold recently in BC.
Here is one in Ontario:
Bayshore Yacht Sales - New Boat Sales and Yacht Brokerage
Your trusted destination for new boat sales and yacht brokerage. Authorized dealers for premier brands like Cobalt, MasterCraft, Grady-White, and more.
They tend to be overpriced in North America. we have a couple on Lake Winnipeg, that have been sold for very reasonable prices. One is reportedly being shipped to the east coast, due to the inflated North American prices.
I would seriously look at buying in the EU. there are a few Contessa 32s for sale in the Netherlands. That also avoids the EU VAT issue, if the EU tax has been already paid. It is much easier to to leave the UK temporarily, than it is with the EU, since the EU is such a large area.
In Canada - if the sailboat has a motor (which I assume it does) a Pleasure Craft Operator Card is required to operate the sail boat. It doesn't matter the size of the motor or if its gas or electric. The PCOC is required.
There is a Trade Treaty (CETA) exempting boats built in Europe from this duty as long as they come direct here from Europe, For example a French built boat would be exempt if being imported directly into Canada but not if it is being imported from another country. I am not certain what the situation is with used boats or the standing with England if Brexit has any bearing.