Broken Seacock Handle

[Eleven]

Well, pictured below is the waste through hull seacock of my new to me sailboat. It is a Groco IBV-1250 in line bronze seacock. It was difficult to move out of the open position so I kept moving the handle a bit to both sides but apparently put more force than should and the handle broke off. The boat is currently on the water so replacing the whole seacock isn't possible.
Looking at the exploded view of another Groco 1 1/4 valve, it seems I can remove the handle shaft and install a new one. Have ordered a whole new seacock to get that piece since it was cheaper.
Question: Do you see any issues with my proposed repair solution?
I plan to install the zerk fitting which I assume will leak a bit of water during the removal of the current plug and installation of the zerk and then put some grease to try to unlock the ball.
Understand seacocks need to be exercised frequently but the boat is new to me and this is how I got it.
Appreciate any and all help.
Thanks

 

[Justin_NSA]

I can't envision replacing the handle is do-able in the water. I hope I'm wrong. Good lesson for us all though. Exercise and grease those ball valves

 

[rgranger]

Have some corks ready...

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

Two options -
remove the shaft (if not integral with the ball) and replace. Any reasonably sized bilge pump can manage the water which will leak in, or
2. Go for a swim and plug the thruhull from the water side and replace the whole seacock. It should attach directly to the thruhull anyway so get rid of that elbow.

 

[Justin_NSA]

I vote for option 2. It sounded like the OP ordered the whole valve " Have ordered a whole new seacock to get that piece since it was cheaper. "

 

[dlochner]

This is not a job that I would do in the water. If things go wrong, they will go very wrong.

I have a similar one in the basement and it appears the axle for the handle is screwed into the ball. The ball will rotate 360° only the stops on the body of the valve limit the rotation. In order to remove the axle it will be necessary to keep the ball from rotating. If the valve was closed, this might be accomplished by removing the zerc and inserting a screwdriver and then unscrewing the axle. In your case, though, the valve is open, so it would be necessary to remove the hose and insert something to prevent the ball from moving. Because there is an angled fitting on the bottom of the valve, it won't be possible to work from the bottom up.

Have you contacted Groco? They have good tech support and let you know if what you propose will work.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

You'll find that @Don S/V ILLusion 's suggestion is the only one that won't sink your boat.

Even if you can replace the shaft and ball of your existing valve, the valve must be dis-assembled at its union fitting to remove the ball. You would then be wide open to the sea.

Plugging the thru hull from the outside is not a big deal. Just make sure the tapered plug is firmly tamped in from the outside. You'd hate to lose it half way through the job.

Any reason for not doing the job properly with a haul-out ?

 

[Eleven]

Here is the exploded view of a similar Groco seacock. If I understand this correctly, I could replace part # 10 since it doesn't go through the ball #5.
Answering some of the questions, yes I ordered a full new seacock. I'm hoping to avoid a haul out, but yes, have plugs handy and the haul out of the marina is just a few feet away from the current dock in case things go really bad.

 

[dlochner]

If your marina can haul out without taking the mast down, why not just pay for a short haul. Have them haul late in the day and put the boat back in the water the next day. A few hundred bucks could save a lot grief and panic. With a haul out you could replace the whole valve and be done with it. Probably only take an hour or two.

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

If you are not inclined to DIY in the water by simply plugging the thruhull, it’s likely the marina will do so for a lot less money than a short haul. Doesn’t hurt to ask...

 

[Justin_NSA]

If it were me, I'd replace the whole valve, do away with the elbow if possible like Don mentioned to eliminate those connections. and replace the old discharge hose. That's just me. Your boat, your money.

 

[Tally Ho]

Well, pictured below is the waste through hull seacock of my new to me sailboat. It is a Groco IBV-1250 in line bronze seacock. It was difficult to move out of the open position so I kept moving the handle a bit to both sides but apparently put more force than should and the handle broke off. The boat is currently on the water so replacing the whole seacock isn't possible.
Looking at the exploded view of another Groco 1 1/4 valve, it seems I can remove the handle shaft and install a new one. Have ordered a whole new seacock to get that piece since it was cheaper.
Question: Do you see any issues with my proposed repair solution?
I plan to install the zerk fitting which I assume will leak a bit of water during the removal of the current plug and installation of the zerk and then put some grease to try to unlock the ball.
Understand seacocks need to be exercised frequently but the boat is new to me and this is how I got it.
Appreciate any and all help.
Thanks

View attachment 190417

I am not sure that replacing the handle shaft solves the problem....the valve is still frozen right?

I am not sure that you will be able to close it even if you install a new shaft and handle (if it is even possible to replace them), that it will allow you to close the valve.

Is the valve you bought “identical” to the broken one? I ask because you are using an exploded view of “another Groco 1 1/4” Valve”. If it is not identical, the parts may not be interchangeable. That would be a “worst case” situation...tear the valve apart, have some water coming into the boat, and finding out that the new parts don’t fit.

I would haul the boat, replace the entire valve and any other issues you find.

Short of that, I would plug from the outside and replace the valve...but not for the feint of heart.
I once broke the retaining collar holding a speed transducer in my hull. The bedding was old and leaky, and when I tried to tighten the plastic collar, it broke. Talk about anxiety (I was a new boat owner). despite my replacement of the broken collar, I didn’t sleep well until the season was over and I hauled the boat to rebed the fitting correctly....

Greg

 

[rgranger]

... despite my replacement of the broken collar, I didn’t sleep well until the season was over and I hauled the boat to rebed the fitting correctly....
Greg

speaking of clench moments....
I used to have an old Coronado 25 and the cockpit had two very small drains that would fill with leave and flood... the drains were led to the transom with a long narrow hose that would also get fouled....it made me nervous in the fall when leaves were coming down so I decided to retro-fit larger drains that would not as easily get covered over with leaves and I created new through hulls just above the water line on the port and starboard hulls. Well.... here is where things went wrong. I determined where the hole needed to be in the hull (you know, the one that was just above the water line) by carfully measuring the distance from the deck-hull joint to the water line... then I crawled back under the cockpit and started drilling with a hole cutting bit....

I'm a big guy... and you know... I can displace some water.... so with me in the crawlspace under the cockpit that hole was no longer just ABOVE the water line... It was all okay in the end since once I crawled out to put the through hull teet in the hole... the hole came above the water line.. but when that hole cutting bit broke through and a pipe of water hit me in the face... I clenched.

 

[Eleven]

Thank you all, appreciate all comments. It seems the consensus is to haul out and do a proper seacock replacement when the new one arrives since there are too many ways to go wrong with the boat in the water.

Separate question. Does anyone know why there is so much oxidation on the valve? Could it be a leak from the hose above it? Or would this be expected on a seawater boat?
This is under the sink in the head and once I got the boat the sink drain was broken so perhaps water leaked from there.

Thanks

 

[Justin_NSA]

"Rabbit is good, Rabbit is wise. "
I think that your patina is normal. Bilges can be damp places. My below waterline bronze has a little too.

 

[JamesG161]

Does anyone know why there is so much oxidation on the valve?

That oxidation is a good thing. Why? It is a protective coating.
However, it does appear on the picture, some water may have dripped on the face.
All drips should be stopped.
______
If you do take your boat out of the water...

Replace all of the thru hulls

Jim...

 

[dlochner]

Bronze oxidizes pretty easily. The oxidation pattern looks like it could be from a drip. It appears to run down the side of the valve from the top down.

 

[smokey73]

What is that white sealant on the threads? Hope it is not the "devil's glue" 5200!

 

[JamesG161]

My boat is on the Hard for other reasons, but I am changing all of my thru Hull valves to this newest type material.

Marelon Plumbing Overview

There have been many good recommendations on this type seacock.
It is NOT a plastic valve.

Forespar trade name for Dupont Zytel 70G13L – BK 13% glass-filled carbon blacked 6/6 nylon (that’s not carbon fiber)

I did the research and found this Marelon valve is perhaps a once in a boat's life type.



Jim...

 

[Eleven]

So I was told all the thru hulls of this boat were replaced early last year. The survey done a couple of months ago didn't flag them as a problem but I'm new to all of this so consider any and all advice.

Below is the Groco technical service reply to my earlier question about replacing parts of the old valve FYI

Unfortunately there are no replacement parts for the IBV series valve. I would not suggest trying to pull the new driver from the new valve since that will destroy the seals of the new valve and the seals of the old one. Your only recourse is to wait until the boat is hauled out to replace it with the new one. The reason the handles freeze is because sediment and sea creatures build homes in the area where the ball resides. There is some open area in there. When the ball is moved, this sediment and calcium deposits from barnacles gets scraped towards the seal and it cant pass it. What results is the driver breaks off with the handle. If you take the old valve apart, you will see all the sediment and have an idea of what im referring to.

Lubricating the valve using a zerk fitting will fill that void where the sea creatures build their homes and the sediment can congregate. You will have to have the valve completely open then close it about 20% otherwise injecting grease will rupture the seals since the water wont have anywhere to go. Just don’t over do it. You can grease the valve prior to installation but it depends on how frequently you open the valve as to how many times a year you grease it. A valve that is opened once a month should be greased every 6 months or so. A valve opened and closed every day, once a month. These are just general guidelines. It may be more, it may be less. Temperature, distance from water line and size all play a part. We recommend Ulube grease that we make and you can find that through our distributors. The zerk grease fitting is part number Zerk-1.