This last Saturday - we participated in the 'Great Race' the last race of the season on Lake Carlyle, where you start at the dam (S.W. portion of the lake) and sail around the lake (total distance ~16 miles). We have a 1994 Hunter 26. On Saturday the south west wind was blowing about 20 - 25 mph with gusts in the 30 to 35 mph range! *yks The start would be a long reach / run to the first mark ... we had a reefed main (single reef - all that my sail has) plus the 110 head sail. We got a pretty decent start - but soon I noticed that the rudder was kicking up. In addition the boat's stern would broach, would move port or starboard - I was able to counter this for a while by use of the rudder. Everyonce in a while we went completely 90 degrees to our course. One time we did this 90 degree boach - the wrong direction and jibed. *pop Needless to say, doing this in a 35 mph wind is NOT fun. Needless to say - we quit the race. We sailed on our own OK in most other tacks - but running before the wind was not an option. We noticed a Hunter 23.5 or 240 ahead of us having the same problems ... but the other boats (Catalina 27's, 30's; J 24, J 105, etc.) did not seem to be having this difficulty. In fact, a lot of these boats were not even reefed. My wife is justifiably concerned about the 'safety' of our boat. Was this behavior due mainly to the rudder not staying down? (I'll ask in another post for suggestions on solving this problem.) Was I overpowering the boat? Should I have doused the Jib? Should I have doused the reefed main on this down wind leg? Is this a characteristic of all water ballasted boats? I appreciate your help. Tom Grass Grasshopper II H-26 #174 Carlyle, Illinois (St. Louis)
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D
Drew
Rudder
Tom: If the rudder gets loose it will float up and you will lose control of the boat. Period. Do what you gotta to keep it down - windspeed has nothing to do with it, either - you might have hit something and it popped up or it wasn't secured to begin with. Other boats don't have rudders designed to come up easy - part of the trade off between easy trailering and "stability," I guess. Thirty to 35 knot guests are alot for a 260, never mind a 240 (I have one). You have to reef the main and douse the jib unless you can roller-furl it in a bit. After that, you're fine. Sounds like a fun day though... Drew
Tom: If the rudder gets loose it will float up and you will lose control of the boat. Period. Do what you gotta to keep it down - windspeed has nothing to do with it, either - you might have hit something and it popped up or it wasn't secured to begin with. Other boats don't have rudders designed to come up easy - part of the trade off between easy trailering and "stability," I guess. Thirty to 35 knot guests are alot for a 260, never mind a 240 (I have one). You have to reef the main and douse the jib unless you can roller-furl it in a bit. After that, you're fine. Sounds like a fun day though... Drew
Alton Lake was great, too!
Tom, we were out on Alton Lake Friday in pretty similar conditions. Also had reefed main and jib up. Rather than run, we headed off on a broad reach with the centerboard up. We actually saw 8 knots on the knotmeter! For the return, we came about (I don't gybe when I have to reef), dropped the centerboard, and beat our way back to harbor. Pinching and the old "fisherman's reef" kept the heel under control. Things only got a little squirrely right before striking the sails. I was playing with the outboard and my wife caught a bit too much wind -- told her to cast everything loose, and while she was, our son grabbed the dog and ended up with a rope burn. The boat, of course, immediately headed into the wind and with a great flapping of sails was quite amenable to rolling up the jib and furling the main.
Tom, we were out on Alton Lake Friday in pretty similar conditions. Also had reefed main and jib up. Rather than run, we headed off on a broad reach with the centerboard up. We actually saw 8 knots on the knotmeter! For the return, we came about (I don't gybe when I have to reef), dropped the centerboard, and beat our way back to harbor. Pinching and the old "fisherman's reef" kept the heel under control. Things only got a little squirrely right before striking the sails. I was playing with the outboard and my wife caught a bit too much wind -- told her to cast everything loose, and while she was, our son grabbed the dog and ended up with a rope burn. The boat, of course, immediately headed into the wind and with a great flapping of sails was quite amenable to rolling up the jib and furling the main.
My experience
My experience with the H26 is similar to the others. If the wind is really strong, I will sail without the jib, and perhaps a reefed main. If you do that, you will generally be ok (within reason of course). I had trouble at first, but then realized that my rudder was not all the way down -- close, but not down. Now that I learned where down is -- it is much smoother.
My experience with the H26 is similar to the others. If the wind is really strong, I will sail without the jib, and perhaps a reefed main. If you do that, you will generally be ok (within reason of course). I had trouble at first, but then realized that my rudder was not all the way down -- close, but not down. Now that I learned where down is -- it is much smoother.
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HOLDFAST
Rudder not down
Tom, based on my experience, I would say your rudder was not down all the way. I had the exact same thing happen to me a few weeks ago. Once I put the rudder down, I had control. Ken
Tom, based on my experience, I would say your rudder was not down all the way. I had the exact same thing happen to me a few weeks ago. Once I put the rudder down, I had control. Ken
Similar Situation
Had a similar situation in an H23 recently. 25 knot winds, full main, no jib. Experienced insane amounts of weather helm and was virtually unable to tack (which as I was heading towards some rocks was not fun). After about 20 minutes I realized the rudder wasn't fully down, dropped the sail and motored in. Went out the next day in slightly lower (~20kn) winds with the rudder fully down and it was a night and day difference.
Had a similar situation in an H23 recently. 25 knot winds, full main, no jib. Experienced insane amounts of weather helm and was virtually unable to tack (which as I was heading towards some rocks was not fun). After about 20 minutes I realized the rudder wasn't fully down, dropped the sail and motored in. Went out the next day in slightly lower (~20kn) winds with the rudder fully down and it was a night and day difference.
M
mike
me too
I thought I had a brainy idea once while racing downwind. I'd pop up my rudder to reduce drag, akin to lifting the centerboard on downwind legs. Bad idea..........I rounded up real quick and had to pull the rudder back down.
I thought I had a brainy idea once while racing downwind. I'd pop up my rudder to reduce drag, akin to lifting the centerboard on downwind legs. Bad idea..........I rounded up real quick and had to pull the rudder back down.
A
alan
Lots of wind for the boat but doable.
Hi Tom, I have sailed my '94 h26 for five seasons now. The most I have taken the boat out was in 25 to 30 knots sustained. That's a bit much for this boat. With the relatively high water ballast it is tender. You probably should have pulled the jib in and tried with just a reefed main. The rudder system on the 26 is a weak point. I solved the problem of rudder creep by using a hollow plastic dowel as a shear pin (papermate pen without the innards). Drill through the aluminum plates into the top of the rudder. With the shear pin in place, the rudder will still pop up if you hit bottom. Wouldn't use metal for obvious reasons. When the rudder creeps up you loose control and round up. If you are overpowered you may round up too. You will find that going to windward under those conditions difficult as the hull begines to compete with the reduced sail area to drive the boat. alan
Hi Tom, I have sailed my '94 h26 for five seasons now. The most I have taken the boat out was in 25 to 30 knots sustained. That's a bit much for this boat. With the relatively high water ballast it is tender. You probably should have pulled the jib in and tried with just a reefed main. The rudder system on the 26 is a weak point. I solved the problem of rudder creep by using a hollow plastic dowel as a shear pin (papermate pen without the innards). Drill through the aluminum plates into the top of the rudder. With the shear pin in place, the rudder will still pop up if you hit bottom. Wouldn't use metal for obvious reasons. When the rudder creeps up you loose control and round up. If you are overpowered you may round up too. You will find that going to windward under those conditions difficult as the hull begines to compete with the reduced sail area to drive the boat. alan
D
Dan Connelly
Similar conditions
I raced on the Delaware River in the tail of Ivan. My H260 handled quite well once we found the right sail balance. The first fifteen minutes of the race was finding that balance. Balance was a partially reefed 100% roller furling jib and the main single reefed. We used the jib as the main source of power. One crew member depowered the main as needed and was kept uncleated. We sailed down wind on broad reaches, jibing as needed. Upwind the main was depowered much of the time. We were able to point well and maintain speed on the tacks. We started dead last and finished fourth. I did have 3 strong crew members. If I were caught alone in those conditions, I would sail with only the jib, probably reefed to 50%. PS the H260 has the break away pin to hold the rudder down.
I raced on the Delaware River in the tail of Ivan. My H260 handled quite well once we found the right sail balance. The first fifteen minutes of the race was finding that balance. Balance was a partially reefed 100% roller furling jib and the main single reefed. We used the jib as the main source of power. One crew member depowered the main as needed and was kept uncleated. We sailed down wind on broad reaches, jibing as needed. Upwind the main was depowered much of the time. We were able to point well and maintain speed on the tacks. We started dead last and finished fourth. I did have 3 strong crew members. If I were caught alone in those conditions, I would sail with only the jib, probably reefed to 50%. PS the H260 has the break away pin to hold the rudder down.
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