I'm considering buying a 1986 Macgregor 25'sailboat and I noticed that the below water line hull area has lots of tiny blisters. They are all over the bottom and give a bit when pushed with a fingernail. Should I be concerned? Am I looking at an expensive and time consuming repair job? I want to sail the boat this summer not spend my days with a drill sanding them off. What should I do?
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bottom blisters
Kevin, you have kind of answered your own question in that you want to sail not work on the boat.Blisters should be repaired.The exception to this rule might be that you bougth the boat at such a deal that you can consider it "disposable" and use it a couple of years as is and then junk it when the bottom is shot.
Kevin, you have kind of answered your own question in that you want to sail not work on the boat.Blisters should be repaired.The exception to this rule might be that you bougth the boat at such a deal that you can consider it "disposable" and use it a couple of years as is and then junk it when the bottom is shot.
Walk away from the blisters
Regarding the blisters . . . Should you be concerned? - YES Is it time consuming to repair? - YES Should you buy this boat? - NO. If you did buy it, would you be sailing this summer? - NO Go find a boat that does not have this sort of problem. Regards, Ted
Regarding the blisters . . . Should you be concerned? - YES Is it time consuming to repair? - YES Should you buy this boat? - NO. If you did buy it, would you be sailing this summer? - NO Go find a boat that does not have this sort of problem. Regards, Ted
If you really like the boat,
blisters are not fatal, they can be repaired. Get an expert opinion as to the cost of repair, and deduct that from the asking price. Also, spend money on a survey, there may be other issues. If the current owner wont bend on the price, or the cost of repair is excessive, keep shopping, lots of boats out there!!
blisters are not fatal, they can be repaired. Get an expert opinion as to the cost of repair, and deduct that from the asking price. Also, spend money on a survey, there may be other issues. If the current owner wont bend on the price, or the cost of repair is excessive, keep shopping, lots of boats out there!!
Talk to the folks at Seaview East
Kevin - since you're in Seattle I'd recommend you go talk to the folks at Seaview East, a boatyard in Ballard. They are pretty expert in blister repair. Phil Riise is the owner and he wrote an article called "Osmotic Blister Repair" in Nor’westing Jan 2003 starting on p. 54. Also on-line: http://www.buysell.com/boating/articles/jan03/feature_blisters.asp An '86 Macgregor shouldn't cost that much and my guess is the blister repair will cost nearly as much as they're asking for the boat. Heck, maybe more. Hope this helps. Is the trailer any good?
Kevin - since you're in Seattle I'd recommend you go talk to the folks at Seaview East, a boatyard in Ballard. They are pretty expert in blister repair. Phil Riise is the owner and he wrote an article called "Osmotic Blister Repair" in Nor’westing Jan 2003 starting on p. 54. Also on-line: http://www.buysell.com/boating/articles/jan03/feature_blisters.asp An '86 Macgregor shouldn't cost that much and my guess is the blister repair will cost nearly as much as they're asking for the boat. Heck, maybe more. Hope this helps. Is the trailer any good?
Mac 25
Forget the blisters, but since there are lots of them, I'd look for another boat...Mac's are not great sailors. The Mac is half power boat and half sail boat. As a result, the things that make it a good power boat make it a poor sailboat...the things that make it a good sailboat make it a poor power boat. In other words, it does neither very well. Seems to me you need to decide whether you want to be a sailer or a power boater and buy accordingly...or, as I did for six years, get one of each! Have fun!
Forget the blisters, but since there are lots of them, I'd look for another boat...Mac's are not great sailors. The Mac is half power boat and half sail boat. As a result, the things that make it a good power boat make it a poor sailboat...the things that make it a good sailboat make it a poor power boat. In other words, it does neither very well. Seems to me you need to decide whether you want to be a sailer or a power boater and buy accordingly...or, as I did for six years, get one of each! Have fun!
only two reasons to buy it.
If you have a big love affair going and money is no object, or you have lots of time to do a nasty hard job and get marginal results. then go ahead. other wise run. pass go and save a bunch of bucks!
If you have a big love affair going and money is no object, or you have lots of time to do a nasty hard job and get marginal results. then go ahead. other wise run. pass go and save a bunch of bucks!
At Ease
I could be wrong, but I don't think a 1986 Macgregor 25 could be one of their powersailors. I think it's just a plain ol' sailboat.
I could be wrong, but I don't think a 1986 Macgregor 25 could be one of their powersailors. I think it's just a plain ol' sailboat.
Don't worry about it....
Kevin - I wouldn't worry too much about it. We used to have a 1988 McGregor which had the little blisters on the bottom. They never got any worse, so we left them alone, and they left us alone. If you are planning on keeping the boat in the water full time, you will probably see the blisters get worse. But since this is a trailerable, you will have it in and out of the water and you won't see much change in them over time. Even if you leave it in the water during the summer, and remove it during the winter, things should be fine. (For the record, this is the old style McGregor, not the 1/2 sailboat, 1/2 powerboat. It is a much better sailer than the later models - we had one of those too.) Good luck. McGregors make great camping boats, and who can complain about sailing at 55 mph up to Desolation Sound or the San Juans! W
Kevin - I wouldn't worry too much about it. We used to have a 1988 McGregor which had the little blisters on the bottom. They never got any worse, so we left them alone, and they left us alone. If you are planning on keeping the boat in the water full time, you will probably see the blisters get worse. But since this is a trailerable, you will have it in and out of the water and you won't see much change in them over time. Even if you leave it in the water during the summer, and remove it during the winter, things should be fine. (For the record, this is the old style McGregor, not the 1/2 sailboat, 1/2 powerboat. It is a much better sailer than the later models - we had one of those too.) Good luck. McGregors make great camping boats, and who can complain about sailing at 55 mph up to Desolation Sound or the San Juans! W
BIG blisters are a problem.
Small blisters that are under the gelcoat, a 'bit' into the underlayment matting layer .... are no problem. Simply open them wash them out and fill with a fairing conmpound. On the other hand if the blisters are large and have penetrated into the 'structural' layers ... cloth or roving, then destruction of the hull is beginning. RUN dont walk away from a boat that has blisters penetrating into the structural layers .... and you will save a lot of heartache. Take a penknife and pop the largest blister you can see, if the backside of the blister has roving or cloth attached and there are MANY of these large blisters that have penetrated into the structural layer (size of 25¢ oc,) -- RUN away or be prepared to spend lots of $$$ and sweat-time restoring !!!!!! go to www.yachtsurvey.com for a full discussion of osmotic blisters. hope this helps.
Small blisters that are under the gelcoat, a 'bit' into the underlayment matting layer .... are no problem. Simply open them wash them out and fill with a fairing conmpound. On the other hand if the blisters are large and have penetrated into the 'structural' layers ... cloth or roving, then destruction of the hull is beginning. RUN dont walk away from a boat that has blisters penetrating into the structural layers .... and you will save a lot of heartache. Take a penknife and pop the largest blister you can see, if the backside of the blister has roving or cloth attached and there are MANY of these large blisters that have penetrated into the structural layer (size of 25¢ oc,) -- RUN away or be prepared to spend lots of $$$ and sweat-time restoring !!!!!! go to www.yachtsurvey.com for a full discussion of osmotic blisters. hope this helps.
Blisters
Found this article re blisters on a brokerage site, you might find it interesting. http://www.yachtworld.com/offshoreatlantic/offshoreatlantic_7.html
Found this article re blisters on a brokerage site, you might find it interesting. http://www.yachtworld.com/offshoreatlantic/offshoreatlantic_7.html
1986 Mac 25
Is a 1986 Mac 25 worth the effort to repair the blisters or would it be better to look elsewhere?
Is a 1986 Mac 25 worth the effort to repair the blisters or would it be better to look elsewhere?
Mac 25/26
I stand corrected it's the Mac 26 that is half sail and half power, not the 25...big numbers always confuse me!
I stand corrected it's the Mac 26 that is half sail and half power, not the 25...big numbers always confuse me!
Change of Mind
I may be remembering wrong, but it seems like earlier string said that blisters were not a problem. In this string several have said they are a problem. I have owned four boats out of the 70s. All of them had blisters to one degree or another. They were all below an outer layer of fiberglass. On three of them I sanded down the blisters so that they leak the water. I cut the edges of the fiberglass with a utility knife. I blow out the water and let them dry for a few days. I filled the cavity with fiberglass matt and then covered them with fiberglass cloth. I covered the bottom with a barrier coat and bottom paint. There has been no reoccurrance for my MAC 23 after about four years. The other two I can't comment on, since I only kept them for a year or so after that. The MAC 23 probably had two or three dozen blisters about an inch in diameter. The fourth boat is a little 18' trailerable which has a few small ones. Since it spends little time in the water, I will not do anything about it. It is a messy job which probably took me most of a week to fix.
I may be remembering wrong, but it seems like earlier string said that blisters were not a problem. In this string several have said they are a problem. I have owned four boats out of the 70s. All of them had blisters to one degree or another. They were all below an outer layer of fiberglass. On three of them I sanded down the blisters so that they leak the water. I cut the edges of the fiberglass with a utility knife. I blow out the water and let them dry for a few days. I filled the cavity with fiberglass matt and then covered them with fiberglass cloth. I covered the bottom with a barrier coat and bottom paint. There has been no reoccurrance for my MAC 23 after about four years. The other two I can't comment on, since I only kept them for a year or so after that. The MAC 23 probably had two or three dozen blisters about an inch in diameter. The fourth boat is a little 18' trailerable which has a few small ones. Since it spends little time in the water, I will not do anything about it. It is a messy job which probably took me most of a week to fix.
Blisters
Kevin: I owner a 85 25 Mac about six years ago that was kept in the water at long beach Ca. when I took it out to be a "Trailer Sailor" the boat had a whole bunch of blisters that were about the size of pencil eraser. I brought it to my home in the High Desert and it set on the trailer for about two weeks. I went to use it and the "Fairy God Mother" must have stopped by as all the blisters where gone and as long as I owned it, it was always used as a trailer sailor and the blisters never came back. So IMHO don't wory about them unless they get to be about the size of a quarter then you have to do something about them. I will quote you a statement from a very good marine surveyor friend. "There are boats with "blisters" and there are boats that will get them" Hope this helps "MIC" in so.Ca.
Kevin: I owner a 85 25 Mac about six years ago that was kept in the water at long beach Ca. when I took it out to be a "Trailer Sailor" the boat had a whole bunch of blisters that were about the size of pencil eraser. I brought it to my home in the High Desert and it set on the trailer for about two weeks. I went to use it and the "Fairy God Mother" must have stopped by as all the blisters where gone and as long as I owned it, it was always used as a trailer sailor and the blisters never came back. So IMHO don't wory about them unless they get to be about the size of a quarter then you have to do something about them. I will quote you a statement from a very good marine surveyor friend. "There are boats with "blisters" and there are boats that will get them" Hope this helps "MIC" in so.Ca.
blister repair
look at sailnet.com the articles by bill casey on blisters, or fiberglass repair. west system also has some good guides to repair. the 25 mac has a lead keel. no water balast, not a power sailer. the 26 87-89 were daggerboard waterbalast sail boats, the 90-94.5 were centerboard sailboats. the then on they were powersailers. myguess is a 25 should sell be about 5k, with trl and ob. blisters repair will take weeks or months to dry out. before the repairs begin. once the blisters are cut, dry and filled a barrier coat will be needed. materials alone will run about a $400 (west, barrier coat and bottom paint.) plus about 80hr labor (guess). I did this to my 88 26d. but sanded off all the gelcote then applied 8 coats of epoxy and then 2 barrier coats and then 2 coats of alabative paint. -I'd look elsewhere or offer 2k less, (offer 3k). fwiw: the 26's have much more room than the 25. but the 25 is more stable initially. imho...
look at sailnet.com the articles by bill casey on blisters, or fiberglass repair. west system also has some good guides to repair. the 25 mac has a lead keel. no water balast, not a power sailer. the 26 87-89 were daggerboard waterbalast sail boats, the 90-94.5 were centerboard sailboats. the then on they were powersailers. myguess is a 25 should sell be about 5k, with trl and ob. blisters repair will take weeks or months to dry out. before the repairs begin. once the blisters are cut, dry and filled a barrier coat will be needed. materials alone will run about a $400 (west, barrier coat and bottom paint.) plus about 80hr labor (guess). I did this to my 88 26d. but sanded off all the gelcote then applied 8 coats of epoxy and then 2 barrier coats and then 2 coats of alabative paint. -I'd look elsewhere or offer 2k less, (offer 3k). fwiw: the 26's have much more room than the 25. but the 25 is more stable initially. imho...
Why Not
The price should reflex this condition. The price of the repair is about $2000. I would not pay more than $3500 for the boat. You don't even have to get the boat fixed.The boat will last for years with the blisters. All and all it is not worth it to repair the boat unless you do it yourself.
The price should reflex this condition. The price of the repair is about $2000. I would not pay more than $3500 for the boat. You don't even have to get the boat fixed.The boat will last for years with the blisters. All and all it is not worth it to repair the boat unless you do it yourself.
Blister mania
A guy I know who works in a boatyard laughs at the concern most folks have over finding blisters - in his words, "blisters don't sink boats." He was speaking, of course, of the smaller ones. Lots of folks have sailed lots of miles with bottoms that look like a bag of marbles.
A guy I know who works in a boatyard laughs at the concern most folks have over finding blisters - in his words, "blisters don't sink boats." He was speaking, of course, of the smaller ones. Lots of folks have sailed lots of miles with bottoms that look like a bag of marbles.
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