My point was that you can't work—as in make money—while you are here, since you are a foreigner. You can spend money and WORK—as in repair or upgrade your boat—all you want...It really depends on the definition of work. 
Boat to cross Atlantic
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Actually, asking the USCG is really a very good idea. If a state registration won't cause me any trouble in the rest of the world, especially in Europe (where things are not any easier then the US), then I might well buy a pretty Bristol or something similar and after some months of refitting, I can start sailing. Just last week, there was a Bristol 29 for $7k or any serious offer. Another 10 grand on it and there my perfect boat is
But, once I started to learn about the boats in Europe, and actually found some really good looking boats for good price, now I feel I don't need to fly to the states to inspect some boats and if non is good, then get back here empty handed and disappointed. To go there, I should locate more then one boat, close enough to each other so travel costs don't grow... Well, no hurry yet. Learning, thanks to all of you and trying to understand what kind of a boat would suit me better for this kind of voyage. All in theory, but in a short time I have learned a lot compared to me last week
Now I blush! I apologize because I totally misunderstood you. I really was very surprised how that could be. Thank you for making it clear for me to get it rightMy point was that you can't work—as in make money—while you are here, since you are a foreigner. You can spend money and WORK—as in repair or upgrade your boat—all you want...It really depends on the definition of work.
YOU CAN NOT USCG DOCUMENT A BOAT UNLESS IT IS MAJORITY OWNED BY US CITIZENS.
There is no point in asking unless you have at least 51% ownership by a US CITIZEN. That is the law...
There is no point in asking unless you have at least 51% ownership by a US CITIZEN. That is the law...
Then again, there has to be a way to work around this. I wonder if the Poster could use the information on the new boat, a survey, and other items to register or document the boat in their home country. I am sure that this is possible to do. Just because you list one particular port as the home port doesn't mean that a boat is kept there all of the time.
You may not legally work in the US without a work permit or citizenship. But I have known many foreign nationals who found a friend here with deep and generous pockets.
For a wind vane I have never heard negative comments concerning this system:
http://www.capehorn.com/
For a wind vane I have never heard negative comments concerning this system:
http://www.capehorn.com/
That's what I have and I love it, light, simple, and elegantly engineered. The drawback or best feature, depending on your point of view, is that it is designed to be integrated into the boat instead of just bolted on the stern. This makes for a more complex and expensive (if you pay to have it done) installation. However, if you have wheel steering as I do, it's possible to have an installation without any lines in the cockpit. Absolutely no part of the installation is visible on my boat forward of the aft cockpit coaming. The wheel just turns back and forth as if there were an invisible helmsman.
While I learn more about boats and all related to them... I know I can have a boat registered in any US state. Many foreigners do so. In Med, there are many US flagged boats owned by foreigners. Just a corporate in Delaware and it owns the boat... Very legal, very cheap and recognised everywhere. But I don't want this kind of tricks. If I own the boat and if the state registration gives me a headache in EU waters, then I can't buy a boat in US. And, when EU prepared the law about CE certification, their idea was to put an end to boats coming from outside EU. So, big boat builders want us to buy here in EU and pay the money to European boat builders... I would be ready to pay the VAT but CE certification is the PITA. Well, let's see what time will show. If I find an irresistibly good boat for an owfully good price, then an American boat it is no matter what
Right after the boat is found, I'll get a windvane... I didn't like how it's standing behind the boat but after what you tell here, I did some reading and I decided to have one...
Right after the boat is found, I'll get a windvane... I didn't like how it's standing behind the boat but after what you tell here, I did some reading and I decided to have one...
As a non-American who had a boat in the US (Pt Roberts), I can attest...kinda. You yourself CAN work on your own boat, but nobody else can. That was the one thing that would turn you back for sure at the border: saying you were going down to help a friend with his boat (this was pre-911, when crossing the border was No Big Deal).
Oh, and if you think non-Americans have the same rights as Americans, think again. When I was being grilled by the US border guards, I was told I had NO RIGHTS WHATSOEVER (including a right to a lawyer). We did get a chance to challenge them in US court (which we won!), but even that has now been taken away.
As for your original question: I'm not sure what's available in Europe, but a Cal 34 is a GREAT open ocean boat, and can often be had for cheap.
druid
No.... for #$#%$ sake, man, you buy and sell real estate in this country without being a citizen...
Many boatyards have restrictions on do it yourselfer's... but it has nothing to do with your citizenship status.. what, do you think? they're going to ask for proof of citizenship before you buy a gallon of bottom paint. No... many boatyards allow DIY, but hired help must be contracted by the boatyard. It's all about insurance, workmen's comp, liability etc.... They will usually allow a relative to help, like a wife, child, co-owner etc, that you're not paying. Call around to some boatyards and ask them what their policy is on DIY.... if they say you can't do anything because you're an alien, then sue their ass.
I found an Albin Vega for a very good price. Broker says hull, deck, sails and engine is fine. Needs to be painted and cleaned inside. Any opinions on this one? I could slowly put it into condition and would have sailing experience for a few years...
A friend of mine owned one for a short while but had to sell it due to a new baby. I didn't get to sail it but there is lots of information on the web via Google. They gave quite a cult following.
Here's what I remember from discussions leading up to that purchase.
Great handling boat. They have made circumnavigations.
Small. You'd better either be singlehanding or have one of the more tolerant people on the planet as companion.
Rudder is a weak point.
Prop is close to surface which can be a problem if you are depending on power to get you out of a rough water tight spot.
Engine and systems are very non-standard and parts are expensive, at least on this side of the pond. The weird combination alternator / starter on his boat was toast and he could have about bought a new engine for what it was going to cost to replace it. Standard alternators are often retrofitted but it's a project.
Too ugly for my taste.
If you are looking for boats in that size range. Look around for a Contessa. Same general size and sailing characteristics but beautiful. It's a fiberglass Folkboat.
Here are a list of boats in Europe from Yachtworld.com. It is a descent site for looking for yachts.
http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...-2170579/port-camargue/France&boat_id=2170579
http://www.yachtworld.com/core/list...-2170579/port-camargue/France&boat_id=2170579
You might want to take a look at the book by John Vigor called "Twenty Small Sailboats to Take You Anywhere" You can find the book on the internet used for ~ $10 http://www.amazon.com/Twenty-Small-Sailboats-Take-Anywhere/dp/0939837323
The book was written a little while ago, but its still a good book as a starting point, not so much to tell you which boat to buy, but rather what things to look for in a boat and what qualitiies are desireable. Maybe more importantly he will also describe somethings to look for that might be weaknesses in sailboat designs which would be a liability on the open ocean.
If it was me and I didn't have a lot of money - I would get a "bombproof" older boat like a Person Triton or an Alberg 30 you could get for little money
The book was written a little while ago, but its still a good book as a starting point, not so much to tell you which boat to buy, but rather what things to look for in a boat and what qualitiies are desireable. Maybe more importantly he will also describe somethings to look for that might be weaknesses in sailboat designs which would be a liability on the open ocean.
If it was me and I didn't have a lot of money - I would get a "bombproof" older boat like a Person Triton or an Alberg 30 you could get for little money
I sold my 1977 Cal 34 III to a guy from St Petersburg, Russia for $18,000. He came over, spent two weeks getting the boat ready adding his self steering and sailed accross to the Azores (20 days) and then to Russia. Said the boat handled great. He is a very accomplished sailor with a giant set!
If I could easily locate a boat in good condition and if documentation wouldn't be that big problem, I certainly would want to buy a boat in US. There are so many nicely priced good boats there, I know. But bringing it back to EU waters will be very expensive and too much paper work. So, although buying an Alberg 30 or a Bristol 29 - 32 was the original plan, I guess I now prefer to find a boat that'll do it within the EU borders so VAT, CE certification and all the paper work would be eliminated
The asking price of the Vega is €4500. That made me think I could buy it and sail for some time then if I want I could sell later for about the same price and buy a prettier one If I just could find a She 31...
Sailingdog, thank you for posting link to the list. I've seen that list before and actually all the boats I considered came out of this list. But seems like I should forget all from outside EU so that leaves me quite a few boats to chose from when my price limit comes on that, I almost have nothing well, should I go to see the Albin Vega??? I don't like it much but on the other hand very cheap... darn!
The asking price of the Vega is €4500. That made me think I could buy it and sail for some time then if I want I could sell later for about the same price and buy a prettier one
If I just could find a She 31...Sailingdog, thank you for posting link to the list. I've seen that list before and actually all the boats I considered came out of this list. But seems like I should forget all from outside EU so that leaves me quite a few boats to chose from
when my price limit comes on that, I almost have nothing well, should I go to see the Albin Vega??? I don't like it much but on the other hand very cheap... darn!
The Albin Vega has a great following but it isn't as good as the Contessa 26, which was an English design, though most were built in Canada IIRC. Another good line of boats to look at are the Elizabethan series. They had several very seaworthy boats under 30' LOA. They also have a fairly active owners' association as well. The ones that are in the US were sailed over and they're fairly solid little boats.
Another good solid little boat is the one that Daniel and David Hays used to round Cape Horn, which was written about in their book "My Old Man and the Sea". It was English-built IIRC.
Another good solid little boat is the one that Daniel and David Hays used to round Cape Horn, which was written about in their book "My Old Man and the Sea". It was English-built IIRC.
I found one Elizabethan that looks very clean inside and outside and asking price is €10000. But it's one of the early boats with iron keel instead of later models encapsulated lead...
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