This past January I lost my 1982 O'Day 25 to a failed raw water intake bowl, that according to an insurance investigator, froze then cracked. The crack eventually flooded the boat and sank her. According to the insurance they do not pay if the boat sinks because of freeze damage. I am claiming the boat did not sink as a result of freeze damage but instead sank because she flooded as a result of a failed part. freeze damage to me would be interputed as ice forming around the boat and cracking the hull. I would appreciate any comments that may help in my defense. The insurance Company is Farmers, if anyone has had a simular problem with them but a better result please let me know.
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Farmers...Too Bad
I know this is no consolation, but I've always heard that Farmers is known for trying to weasel out of claims payments and giving their clients a hard time. Get yourself a good lawyer and fight it, or you won't see a dime.
I know this is no consolation, but I've always heard that Farmers is known for trying to weasel out of claims payments and giving their clients a hard time. Get yourself a good lawyer and fight it, or you won't see a dime.
Have fun fighting with them.
This has been my point with automobile insurance companies than know nothing about boats. This is exactly why boat owners need to look at true marine insurance companies. I would suggest that you TRY to persuade them to see it your way. If/when that fails, you may want to contact an attorney. Just remember that you will need to cut your losses soon, if you do not have a sure thing with an attorney and you must also be able to get the insurance company to pay the attorney fees too you may end up with a double loss.
This has been my point with automobile insurance companies than know nothing about boats. This is exactly why boat owners need to look at true marine insurance companies. I would suggest that you TRY to persuade them to see it your way. If/when that fails, you may want to contact an attorney. Just remember that you will need to cut your losses soon, if you do not have a sure thing with an attorney and you must also be able to get the insurance company to pay the attorney fees too you may end up with a double loss.
Farmers!
I second John's statement. I haven't ever used Farmer's, and can't speak from personal experience but have known others who have. They have a pretty lousy reputation when it comes down to actually paying a claim.
I second John's statement. I haven't ever used Farmer's, and can't speak from personal experience but have known others who have. They have a pretty lousy reputation when it comes down to actually paying a claim.
Sorry but you won't get far.
I was going to leave my boat in last winter, called to check with my insurer ,State Farm, and my broker said it would be covered. Asked for that in writing and he balked. He did a conference call with State Farm underwriting and they indicated they would not cover damage due to freezing and this meant thru hulls. Before everybody starts jumping on about automobile insurance companies not knowing anything about boats, about a week later I received a flier from Boat US about insurance and the have available a specific rider for leaving boats in the water over the winter. How many of you that leave boats in over the winter have actually checked your policies? I think I would.
I was going to leave my boat in last winter, called to check with my insurer ,State Farm, and my broker said it would be covered. Asked for that in writing and he balked. He did a conference call with State Farm underwriting and they indicated they would not cover damage due to freezing and this meant thru hulls. Before everybody starts jumping on about automobile insurance companies not knowing anything about boats, about a week later I received a flier from Boat US about insurance and the have available a specific rider for leaving boats in the water over the winter. How many of you that leave boats in over the winter have actually checked your policies? I think I would.
Interpretation
"I am claiming the boat did not sink as a result of freeze damage but instead sank because she flooded as a result of a failed part. freeze damage to me would be interputed as ice forming around the boat and cracking the hull." Did the part freeze or not? You want to limit the interpretation of freeze damage to hull damage only. Wishful thinking.
"I am claiming the boat did not sink as a result of freeze damage but instead sank because she flooded as a result of a failed part. freeze damage to me would be interputed as ice forming around the boat and cracking the hull." Did the part freeze or not? You want to limit the interpretation of freeze damage to hull damage only. Wishful thinking.
Chicken or the egg
What happened first? According to what you wrote, the part first FROZE, which caused a crack, then leaked/sank. Sounds like freeze damage. BUT...... If you can prove that the part cracked first, i.e. the part failed, then froze over, etc. then that sounds like a failed part. Perhaps get an independent marine surveyor to look at the part...OR...does the said part have a history of failure besides freezing? Let us know what happens. Good luck!
What happened first? According to what you wrote, the part first FROZE, which caused a crack, then leaked/sank. Sounds like freeze damage. BUT...... If you can prove that the part cracked first, i.e. the part failed, then froze over, etc. then that sounds like a failed part. Perhaps get an independent marine surveyor to look at the part...OR...does the said part have a history of failure besides freezing? Let us know what happens. Good luck!
Get the broker involved...........
I've worked with Insurance Companieds for 38 years. Brokers and or Sales Agenst often have a great deal of clout. Keep pushing, even if you have to annoy him/her. Also, you can appeal to the insurance department in your state. Insurance companies hate having to deal with those type of complaints. If you believe that the through hull fittig cracked (not from freezing) you may have a product liability claim that can be filed against the manufacturer. You may have a claim against the marina if they encourage boaters to keep their boats inthe water. They may have a liability in that they cahrged you but did not store the boat in a safe manner. Bottom line... if the water around the vessel froze and the boat sank, you're probably going to have to eat the loss. Good Luck Hayden
I've worked with Insurance Companieds for 38 years. Brokers and or Sales Agenst often have a great deal of clout. Keep pushing, even if you have to annoy him/her. Also, you can appeal to the insurance department in your state. Insurance companies hate having to deal with those type of complaints. If you believe that the through hull fittig cracked (not from freezing) you may have a product liability claim that can be filed against the manufacturer. You may have a claim against the marina if they encourage boaters to keep their boats inthe water. They may have a liability in that they cahrged you but did not store the boat in a safe manner. Bottom line... if the water around the vessel froze and the boat sank, you're probably going to have to eat the loss. Good Luck Hayden
Is it a greater expense
To make repairs, or pay an attorney,fight in court,only to lose and have added expense? Farmers and all other companies will fight this type of claim.
To make repairs, or pay an attorney,fight in court,only to lose and have added expense? Farmers and all other companies will fight this type of claim.
advocate
Hi Rich, If you argue your case and win, they will probably drop you, but do you realy care at this point? I would also contact the bureau of consumer affairs or look for an advocates group, may be the attorney generals office in your state can advise you of who to contact. There is plenty of aid for you out there with out hiring an attorney. Go after em if you think your right, many large corporations are never taken to task because they make it so time consuming for the consumer to fight. Good Luck. Richard s/v La Vida Feliz
Hi Rich, If you argue your case and win, they will probably drop you, but do you realy care at this point? I would also contact the bureau of consumer affairs or look for an advocates group, may be the attorney generals office in your state can advise you of who to contact. There is plenty of aid for you out there with out hiring an attorney. Go after em if you think your right, many large corporations are never taken to task because they make it so time consuming for the consumer to fight. Good Luck. Richard s/v La Vida Feliz
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