Well, our new (to us) 1991 H23 just had her first dip in the water yesterday, and it was an interesting experience. My Dad and I bought the boat a few weeks ago, and the the seller helped us take down the mast and put it on the trailer. A few weeks later (spent putting on new trailer brakes and finding a slip) and we're ready to put it in. The mast stepping went quite smoothly, although like everything, it took longer than we would have hoped. Upon seeing the boat ramp for the first time, I had some serious doubts: the concrete pad seemed to end right at the water's edge, and I could see some pretty big rocks (rick rack) in the shallow part of the ramp before the water got too murky. I checked with the marina, and they said Yes, we put bigger boats than yours in all the time. The guy said he filled in with rick rack regularly to level it out. Well, Ok... So my Dad backs in, and I get up on the boat from the little stub of a dock which is next to the ramp. I go back to the stern. We seem to be floating, and then I notice that the stern has swung over to one side quite a bit. Then we notice that the trailer is cocked to about a 20 degree angle, side to side. We were pretty worried, but figured maybe we can still float off. After removing the winch hook, I try to motor off in reverse. No luck. Can't go back any more. Can't float off (maybe the wing keel is caught). Have to go forward. Dad pulls it up about 4 feet with the Suburban (big 4wd), and all looks well until the bow comes out of the rubber V bumpers and goes 1 foot to the side. Yes, we hadn't put the winch hook back on. Not good. At this point, the previous user of the ramp comes by to help, and he says he thinks we can push the boat off if I'm in the stern. To make a long story short, this actually works. We had rigged a line to the bow eye, so now I'm in the boat with motor running. We decide that it's too risky to come in to a nearby slip for my Dad to get on, since this is a shallow draft area (3ft) and our confidence is shot. So my Dad releases the line, and I'm off by myself to make the trip to our new, deeper slip. Oh, did I mention that I have no sailing or outboard experience? Other than a few trips on friend's boats. And here I am trying to bring a 2500 lb. boat into a slip with no one on board to help out. Anyway, that worked too, although it was less than graceful and I aged a few more years. Thankfully, our new neighbors gave us plenty of help tying up properly. Until we notice that we're in the wrong slip. Then they helped us tie up again in the right slip. So far, this boating thing has been a humbling experience. But the people are nice. Well, I suppose I should turn this into a question: what went wrong on the boat ramp? My best guess is that the ramp is very steep (the under-water part) and we floated the boat and lifted the trailer up when the wing keel caught on the 2 guide boards above the wings. This pulled the trailer askew. The other possibility is that our wheel went into a hole, with the same net effect. How do you judge how far back to go with the trailer? I hope we don't have the same problem when we pull the boat this fall. Think we'll try a different ramp, though. By the way: I plan on sailing lessons before taking our boat out... Jay
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Tom Wootton
Growing pains
Jay, Your story sounds similar to my first trip out back in June (see "inauspicious beginning" in the archive.) I feel (hope) I've learned a little since then. My boat (H26) doesn't have a fixed keel, but I've had a few ramp problems myself. One of the things I've learned: my trailer has a telescoping neck! You might check and see if yours does, too. Another thing, for what it's worth: I have found that most experienced trailersailors (at least the ones who've given me advice) don't use the boat's motor for launching and retrieving. They say 2 people with lines, along with the trailer's guideposts and winch, should be able to do what's needed to position the boat, with less chance of damaging something. That has turned out to be true in my case. It sounds like you're leaning toward the best solution: keep the boat in the water! Good luck Tom
Jay, Your story sounds similar to my first trip out back in June (see "inauspicious beginning" in the archive.) I feel (hope) I've learned a little since then. My boat (H26) doesn't have a fixed keel, but I've had a few ramp problems myself. One of the things I've learned: my trailer has a telescoping neck! You might check and see if yours does, too. Another thing, for what it's worth: I have found that most experienced trailersailors (at least the ones who've given me advice) don't use the boat's motor for launching and retrieving. They say 2 people with lines, along with the trailer's guideposts and winch, should be able to do what's needed to position the boat, with less chance of damaging something. That has turned out to be true in my case. It sounds like you're leaning toward the best solution: keep the boat in the water! Good luck Tom
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Ward Niffenegger
Welcome To SAILING
Jay, For-what-its-worth, Everyone that I know has embarassing, stupid, and unlucky things happen to us as we learn to boat/sail. Hang in there and go slow... slow... slow..... Thinking through your problems will usually solve them with less damage to the boat and your ego. Don't be afraid to ask dumb questions. This site is a wealth of information. Plus almost all sailers that I have met around the docks are willing to help. My opinion for your launch procedures is as follows: The tongue on the the trailer must be extended to allow the trailer to gain enough depth to float the boat. The board that the keel sits on must be completely under water. How far under depends on the steepness of the ramp. I stop backing as soon as I see any part of the boat floating. This usually means I am deep enough to get the boat off. I always make sure the ramp goes back in the water far enough to not back off of it. If your trailer wheels were on rocks instead of concrete, it may explain why the trailer tilted. I use my boat hook and probe the ramp as have someone back the trailer in if I need to. Running a wheel off the ramp is not a good thing. I unhook the winch hook before backing into the water. I tie a line to the bow eye so I can control the boat if it floats off the trailer. Hope this helps a little Ward
Jay, For-what-its-worth, Everyone that I know has embarassing, stupid, and unlucky things happen to us as we learn to boat/sail. Hang in there and go slow... slow... slow..... Thinking through your problems will usually solve them with less damage to the boat and your ego. Don't be afraid to ask dumb questions. This site is a wealth of information. Plus almost all sailers that I have met around the docks are willing to help. My opinion for your launch procedures is as follows: The tongue on the the trailer must be extended to allow the trailer to gain enough depth to float the boat. The board that the keel sits on must be completely under water. How far under depends on the steepness of the ramp. I stop backing as soon as I see any part of the boat floating. This usually means I am deep enough to get the boat off. I always make sure the ramp goes back in the water far enough to not back off of it. If your trailer wheels were on rocks instead of concrete, it may explain why the trailer tilted. I use my boat hook and probe the ramp as have someone back the trailer in if I need to. Running a wheel off the ramp is not a good thing. I unhook the winch hook before backing into the water. I tie a line to the bow eye so I can control the boat if it floats off the trailer. Hope this helps a little Ward
Hang in there Jay
You may be off to a less than stellar start but it's a start nonetheless. As mentioned earlier, the motor will not do much good for getting on and off the trailer. Powerboaters can do it because they have more power. Back the trailer into the water just far enough to float the boat. On some ramps, you may have to remove the rudder or tie the blade up to do this. Lines to the bow and stern are all you need to move the boat around once it's afloat. As boats go, 2500 lb is pretty light and you can maneuver the boat by pushing and pulling better than your outboard ever could. Just make sure your lines are big enough (I like 1/2-inch nylon myself) and long enough (at least as long as the boat). Good luck and happy sailing. Peter H23 "Raven"
You may be off to a less than stellar start but it's a start nonetheless. As mentioned earlier, the motor will not do much good for getting on and off the trailer. Powerboaters can do it because they have more power. Back the trailer into the water just far enough to float the boat. On some ramps, you may have to remove the rudder or tie the blade up to do this. Lines to the bow and stern are all you need to move the boat around once it's afloat. As boats go, 2500 lb is pretty light and you can maneuver the boat by pushing and pulling better than your outboard ever could. Just make sure your lines are big enough (I like 1/2-inch nylon myself) and long enough (at least as long as the boat). Good luck and happy sailing. Peter H23 "Raven"
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Michael Stuart
Walk it
This is in addition to the other good suggestions previously posted. I noted that you are in MD, so leaving the boat in the water forever is probably not an option during the winter months. So you will eventually have to drag it out, and probably you will do it when it is much colder than now, both air temperature and water temperature. I suggest picking your ramp right *now* and looking it over while the water and air are still warm. Get into your bathing suit and walk down the ramp as far as you can without swimming. Your feet will tell you what is and is not down there so you will be prepared for that fateful day. If you do this now, you won't freeze in the waters or winds of October. If the ramp is just not right for a sailboat, check out other ramps. A gradual slope ramp is no good for sailboats but fine for motorboats. Saiboats (especially with their keels) require more water depth. A little inventigation now will save a lot of grief later.
This is in addition to the other good suggestions previously posted. I noted that you are in MD, so leaving the boat in the water forever is probably not an option during the winter months. So you will eventually have to drag it out, and probably you will do it when it is much colder than now, both air temperature and water temperature. I suggest picking your ramp right *now* and looking it over while the water and air are still warm. Get into your bathing suit and walk down the ramp as far as you can without swimming. Your feet will tell you what is and is not down there so you will be prepared for that fateful day. If you do this now, you won't freeze in the waters or winds of October. If the ramp is just not right for a sailboat, check out other ramps. A gradual slope ramp is no good for sailboats but fine for motorboats. Saiboats (especially with their keels) require more water depth. A little inventigation now will save a lot of grief later.
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Harvey Small
Hip Waders
Two more thoughts for that eventual unlaunching: You might want to invest in a pair of hip waders. They range from about $30 to $60 for serviceable ones that will let you work in colder water. Then again, if you only go on and off the trailer once a year, maybe you should check into how much it costs to have the local travelift do it for you. This may be your best option with the wing keel.
Two more thoughts for that eventual unlaunching: You might want to invest in a pair of hip waders. They range from about $30 to $60 for serviceable ones that will let you work in colder water. Then again, if you only go on and off the trailer once a year, maybe you should check into how much it costs to have the local travelift do it for you. This may be your best option with the wing keel.
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BART FORD
Having fun yet?
I have 240 on a trailer and for the first year trailered it every weekend to various lakes. After stepping and unstepping the mast in 95 deg. heat, I quickly decided there had to be a better way. So I finally bit the bullet and put it in the water for the remainder of the summer and have done so the last 2 years. Having a water ballasted boat, it has to come out in the fall. I always wait until the last minute, taking advantage of the pretty fall weather to haul it out and cuss the whole time. The water is cold, very cold. Last year, I waited until November and it snowed the next day. Find your ramp now. Don't wait to haul until late, because you'll freeze. You are lucky to have help. I do all this alone.
I have 240 on a trailer and for the first year trailered it every weekend to various lakes. After stepping and unstepping the mast in 95 deg. heat, I quickly decided there had to be a better way. So I finally bit the bullet and put it in the water for the remainder of the summer and have done so the last 2 years. Having a water ballasted boat, it has to come out in the fall. I always wait until the last minute, taking advantage of the pretty fall weather to haul it out and cuss the whole time. The water is cold, very cold. Last year, I waited until November and it snowed the next day. Find your ramp now. Don't wait to haul until late, because you'll freeze. You are lucky to have help. I do all this alone.
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Jay
Thanks...
for all the suggestions. We did have the trailer tongue extended all the way. Our problem was probably the opposite: I think we went too far in and floated the trailer, because we weren't watching for the point when the boat just started to float (as mentioned in a couple of replies). Checking out a new boat ramp in warm weather seems like a good suggestion, as well as the waders for late October cold. By the way, the mast stepping probably went well at least in part because of an earlier tip I read on this forum: taping the shrouds up to the lifelines to avoid bending the turnbuckle bolts. We also made a mast crutch out of a 5/4" x 6" x 6' board. This made it easy to put the pin into the mast step. You start pushing from a higher point, and are well rested when you start. I'll continue to search for more tips: this forum seems like a great resource. Thanks again, Jay
for all the suggestions. We did have the trailer tongue extended all the way. Our problem was probably the opposite: I think we went too far in and floated the trailer, because we weren't watching for the point when the boat just started to float (as mentioned in a couple of replies). Checking out a new boat ramp in warm weather seems like a good suggestion, as well as the waders for late October cold. By the way, the mast stepping probably went well at least in part because of an earlier tip I read on this forum: taping the shrouds up to the lifelines to avoid bending the turnbuckle bolts. We also made a mast crutch out of a 5/4" x 6" x 6' board. This made it easy to put the pin into the mast step. You start pushing from a higher point, and are well rested when you start. I'll continue to search for more tips: this forum seems like a great resource. Thanks again, Jay
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Jerry
Loading a H23 is More Difficult
Jay, In my experience with my H23, loading is more difficult than launching. Unless the ramp gets deep fast, most of the trailor will be underwater. Its difficult to get the boat centered on the trailor. Its almost impossible if the one side of the trilor is lower than the other side. I usually have the marina lift the boat out, pressure wash the bottom and put it on my trailor in the fall. I launch it in the spring. I need to add a tongue extender and poles to center the boat on the trailor if I'm going to load it myself. R Jerry
Jay, In my experience with my H23, loading is more difficult than launching. Unless the ramp gets deep fast, most of the trailor will be underwater. Its difficult to get the boat centered on the trailor. Its almost impossible if the one side of the trilor is lower than the other side. I usually have the marina lift the boat out, pressure wash the bottom and put it on my trailor in the fall. I launch it in the spring. I need to add a tongue extender and poles to center the boat on the trailor if I'm going to load it myself. R Jerry
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Wingkeel
Loading
Loading the boat back onto the trailer is a piece of cake if you do one thing! Buy an 8' redwood 4"4"...Cut it in half...cut a 45 degree angle on one end of both pieces...bolt it to the trailer on either side of the wingkeel's silouette on the trailer with about one inch of play; ensure that the cut angle is to the inside. The timbers will guide your boat onto the trailer and center it Once the boat is centered, continue backing the trailer in till the boat is snug against the front bumper...Walla. Hope this helps... Wingkeel@aol.com
Loading the boat back onto the trailer is a piece of cake if you do one thing! Buy an 8' redwood 4"4"...Cut it in half...cut a 45 degree angle on one end of both pieces...bolt it to the trailer on either side of the wingkeel's silouette on the trailer with about one inch of play; ensure that the cut angle is to the inside. The timbers will guide your boat onto the trailer and center it Once the boat is centered, continue backing the trailer in till the boat is snug against the front bumper...Walla. Hope this helps... Wingkeel@aol.com
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