Bio Diesel Fuel

[ITMaster]

Are there any of us out there that have used Bio Diesel fuel in your diesel engines?

I have and it seems to run better, smells better, seems to generate more power, seems to get better economy with regard to consumption, seems to run about 10 degrees cooler. I have used it in various blends all the way up to pure "100% juice" with no modifications to the engine.

The C-16 18 Metyl Esters are considered bio degrading and will therefore break down if spilled on/in the water by accident. It is better lubricating and is something that is obviously pure organic.

We have a plant near that makes it out of soy-beans, so it kinda smells like french fries in the exhaust, and when you get it on your hands from coming into contact with it by accident, it doesn't leave that lasting stink with you for hours.

For some reason the other day, I went to buy some and they told me that the state won't allow private sales any more. Just when something comes along to help us out, the government steps in and shuts it down. Wonder what's up with that?

 

[sailingdog]

Be careful, the biodiesel can loosen sludge and such from your fuel tank and clog your fuel filters. It will also void the warranty on most newer marine diesels.

 

[Tim R.]

I clean out my tank every spring so I am considering going to biodiesel. Can anyone comment on the shelf life compared to conventional diesel? I usually put in about 30 gallons in the spring and it lasts me all season. I will add more during my Sep. cruise just so I have extra if needed.

 

[ITMaster]

Yes, I have heard this Dog

From the time I first took ownership of our boat, I have been told the horror stories about the fuel system and the biological organisims associtated with diesel fuel.

As a former private pilot, I was always cognicant of the problems with condensation and how the water in gasoline could freeze up a carb at the higher altitudes where the temps were below freezing.

During the last 3 or 4 years, I have run down my tank and then pulled the access cover and pulled the tank level float out and taken clean lint free rags to clean it out. I also have added bio-ocide treatments, fuel stabilizers and conditioners and "Water Zorb" to hopefully prevent a system failure.

Funny thing, I go and take apart my Racor fuel water separator and clean it out, but I always get the feeling that I am wasting my time, since it always seems to be immaculate. It has even made me wonder if it works.

I don't have diesel fuel supply availiable at my marina, so I always have to go and buy it and transfer it in 5 gallon containers, so again, I am always making sure that I have clean containers, use a funnel with a screen in it and only purchase from one source, since I purchase off road tax exempt fuel and their is only one supplier in my locale.

Maybe if I went to lots of different marinas and paid top dollar for their diesel, I would have more problems and I do consider myself fortunate.

Tim, from what I have heard, the only problem that is worthy of consideration that should be a concern up where you are is the gelling of the fuel. I have had unfortunate experiences in Wyoming with # 1, treated diesel turning into jello, but that was well below zero celsius. When you all are in the water, it is obviously above zero celsius.

I haven't heard of a shelf live stability problem like we experience with the ethanol mixed gas blends. I'll check into that and get back with you Tim.

 

[RichH]

Be very WARY of so-called "bio-diesel" that contains 'reclaim', especially reclaim made from 'cooking oils'. If the 'reclaim %" exceeds 5% it may be quite possible that the seals and other 'rubber' components in your fuel system may soften/fail.

Fuel made from old cooking oil contains potent organic acids (oleic,etc.) that are not compatible with the old Neoprene/Buna rubbers found in most older fuel systems. If the oleic acid content exceeds 5% then one must consider to change to EPDM (ethylenePropyleneDiamineMonomer) rubber for most of the fuel system 'internals' .... fuel filter gaskets, lift pump diaphragm, etc. etc. etc.


As far as changing out 'clean filters' .... the pleated Racors are subject to fatigue failure of the filter media at the outer margin of pleat pack ... several million flex cycles (vector force generated from the lift pump) can do this. Water (free/emulsified) will absorb INTO the filter (which is a resin coated cellusosic media ... 'paper') weakening/softening the filter media structure over time.

 

[sailingseadragon]

Somethoughts

Biodiesel is a class of fuel that is derived from vegetable oils and animal fats and at the very least you should consider the following facts.

Fuel Tanks, lines, and seals:

High density polyethylene is compatible but PVC is slowly degraded. Polystyrenes are melted on contact with biodiesel. Biodiesel has an effect on copper-based materials (i.e. brass), and it also effects zinc, tin, lead, and cast iron. Stainless steels (316 and 304) and aluminum are unaffected.

Biodiesel also affects types of natural rubbers found in some older engine components.

Winter and Off-season Storage:

It has low storage stability, is prone to supporting bacterial growth.

Know what you are buying:

Standards are not uniform for biodiesel production and quality varies between producers.

Most marine manufacturers will only approve the use diesel blend of fuel that contains less than five percent biodiesel (B95). Conversion of the engine is required to use unblended biodiesel fuel.

And finally biodiesel provides less energy for combustion resulting increased fuel consumption.

Take care,
Garner

 

[MoonSailer]

Biodiesel is a detergent and lubricant. But I would hesitate to run pure biodiesel. Properly my diesel. But maybe 5%-10% might be helpful with ultra low sulfur diesel. A really big plus with ULSD is that as they remove suldur they also remove nitrogen and phosphorus which are needed for stuff to grow. I suspect ULSD will be far less prone to slime growth. http://www.gc3.com/techdb/manual/mbiotext.htm

 

[Steve Dion]

Here is an older article on Biodiesel. While things have changed since this article has been written, most of the facts are still the same.

There is an issue with older hoses in the system. If you are going to run this stuff on a regular basis, consider changing the hoses before problem arise.

http://www.cytoculture.com/Biodiese...ed Blending Ratios for Biodiesel in Boat Fuel

 

[Barnacle Bill]

In cars

I have a friend who collects waste oils from restaurants and makes his own biodiesel with great success. He filters it and adds 10% gasoline and runs it in his Mercedes. But, he lives in a cold climate in winter and so does not use it because of gelling problems. He saves tons of money using it during summer months. The only problem is his exhaust smells like french fries (which really isn't a problem). But, I would never suggest you use it in your boat engine because I wouldn't want to be responsible for any consequences. It is a risk you can take on your own.

 

[unsinkable62]

Not worth the risk... maybe in a car, you get stuck with bad fuel, no big deal, but not in my boat.

 

[fishheadmafia]

I drive a semi truck for a organic produce company . Naturaly they want to burn bio in the 22 wheelers , to reduce the footprint on the planet . We run Kenworths , big trucks , (88,000#) , and bio is the rule , for the fleet of 24 trucks . With bio we see about a mile LESS pr gallon than with pump diesel (6.5 is good mpg per D.O.T.) We get 6.5 with bio , BUT we can hit 7.5 to 8 with pump fuel . Filters clog 2-3 times as fast , wax builds up in the fuel lines , it dont cost any less per gallon , given the fact we burn 4500 to 5000 gallons we still dont get a break , but if we did , the road service calls and the continous maintenance needed would eat up any savings . BUT we are saving the planet ! ! The gell factor and hose and seal issues drive our maintenance guy friggin nutts ! ! Take it from a guy that burns it daily , deals with it daily , gets paid by the hour and benifits greatly from sitting on the side of the road , I would NEVER put bio in a boat , or go out with anyone who did . My life is worth more than a few pennies a gollon ,you may save . It will cost you in the long (short) run . Did I mention the noticeable loss of power and mpgs ? Dont do it no matter how good it may sound . Sittin on the side of the road gettin paid anit nuthin , stranded in open water ?

 

[Ross]

I bought 5.5 gallons of Diesel fuel this spring and burned 4 of them. So at about 3 dollars per gallon I can't justify going out of my way to find something that may or may not be better. Can we run bio-diesel in our home heating furnace? One objection that I would have with soya oil is that it is a drying oil and with minor chemical modifications is a prime ingredient in oil base alkyd paints.

 

[John]

As far as bio diesel saving the planet (as Fish's employer seems to think they are doing): Thousands of acres of rain forest are being cut down to grow oil palm trees to produce bio diesel.