Best Pocket Cruiser 23ft or under?

mark_swart · Apr 21, 2009

Henry I think you probably did just fine on that boat. And even if you hate her, you can get your money back out of her I'm sure.
If you ever get bored in your neck of the woods, you should trailer her down to Kentucky Lake. Look me up if you do!

sailingdog · Apr 21, 2009

I would highly recommend going over her with a fine tooth comb and fixing any problems before they become serious. The Boat Inspection Trip Tips thread I started is a good starting point for this inspection.

BobM · Apr 21, 2009

Congratulations! Looks like a great boat to me. I was shopping for a ~23 footer originally, but bought a Lancer 25 without a trailer. I was quite happy with her for the money, but a trailer would have saved me thousands of dollars over the 3-4 years I had her. A few feet makes a big difference in stability and living accomadations.

JerryA · Apr 21, 2009

Re: How this thread turned out...

Great buy Henry! Congratulations on your find.

JerryA

fox islander · Apr 21, 2009

My first boat was a Catalina 22...my second was a hunter 23...lets face it, in boats this size your looking for speed, as none of them will be comfortable. The H23 (w/ wing keel) was much faster. Both were under $5K.
-bueno suerte

John Nantz · Apr 21, 2009

She looks beautiful!

Congratulations Henry, I think you did fine.

This style was made back in the days before all the high-tech racing styles started influencing boat design and she looks like a really nice pocket cruiser.

Reading your post about how you bought her, I'd say the people who rejected your offer on their boat did you a favor!

sailingdog · Apr 22, 2009

henrynlouisville said:
Hello All.

I really went over her today and found a few things.
The person helping me is familiar with this model.

He really looked hard at the box that surrounds the drop rudder.
He said it was solid.

The only problem is softness in the fiberglass at the chain plate and the fastener where the slide attaches for the boom.
It is only soft on the port side.
It is not soft to walk on the deck at all...just if you really press your thumb around where these plates are fastened.
I have decided to just get some stainless backing plates (or wood) and back plate from the interior.
This should reinforce this area just fine for many, many years.

The areas are probably soft due to the core rotting. I would highly recommend opening up the laminate there and recoring the area and then potting it to seal it against future water intrusion. Just adding backing plates is a really bad idea.

Also, what really seems to concern this guy was the fact that it has a four inch dimple (depression) in the mast...about two feet from the top.
I don't see why...doesn't seem like a big deal to me.
Someone totally covered this dimple by wrapping a rope around the mast to tie it down to the stern support.

The reason he's concerned about the dimple is that will become a likely point for the mast to fail at. For example, if the dimple is on the aft side of the mast, and you have the jib pretty heavily loaded in high winds, the fact that there is a dimple there may cause the mast to bend—hinging on the dimple as the forestay pulls on the mast and the backstay resists the pull.

At the least, I'd add a sleeve to the damaged area and pop-rivet it to the existing mast just to reinforce it.

The keel wire looks good.

Looks like the boat should be fine for this area.
I think that the key is to spend as little as possible and just acclimate myself to sailing.

John Nantz · Apr 22, 2009

"Dimple" thing

Henry - Sailingdog's post about the dimple your friend noticed would be a concern.

By any chance could you post a picture of the "dimple" and give a bit of description as to location?

Thanks

mark_swart · Apr 22, 2009

Henry -- you'll want to do some sort of recoring if that soft spot is around the chainplate. The right way is to go in and actually put in new coring (this can be done from the top or bottom, and depending on how the boat is put together shoudl help you decide.)
The quick way is to drill a few small holes around the chainplate. Bend a nail at a 90 degree angle, about 1/2 inch long on the bent part, and put the pointy end in a drill. Snake it into the holes and use it to 'open up' the old rotten coring (where it is soft). Starting with the lowest hole, fill with West system epoxy or equivalent. When it is full, put duck tape over the lowest hole and then move to the next higher one. Proceed until they are alll full.
I did something similar to the bow pulpit of an Oday 23 that I had, the boat had been smashed up in hurricane Hugo and damaged the bow pulpit. Whoever repaired it had forgotten to seal it, and over the years it rotted out and the pulpit was wobbly. It was solid as a rock after that repair, and in the case of the bow pulpit, the bonus was that it will never rot out again because the redrilled holes were through the epoxy.
The problem with this technique is that unless you open it up, you won't know if you have gotten it everywhere or if there are voids in the epoxy, which will keep it from being strong. If it is squishy around the entire chainplate I recommend opening it up. And if I were going to open it up, I'd probably try to do it from the bottom because that will be easier to deal with cosmetically.
The newest issue of Good Old Boat also has a good article on using epoxy to build up a little 'step' around your chainplates, this helps prevent leakage from water on the deck. Thought it was interesting, especially if you will already be playing with epoxy. Or if you decide to open it up from the top, it would give you a way to have a reinforced chainplate, get the bad coring out, and also prevent future leaks.
You should take a pic and let us see, I'm sure you'll get a lot of good input!
-Mark

tommays · Apr 22, 2009

Congrats on the boat

NOW you REALLY need to check the trailer brakes as your at the high limit of the Colarado s towing abilty if not over it

BobM · Apr 22, 2009

Good point...it looks like a Nissan to me, but if you plan to trailer it a lot it might be marginal for a 3600lb boat, plus a 1500 pound trailer and 400lbs of gear. The 6 cyl Frontier says 6300 lbs.

Whether or not Kentucky requires brakes was a little tough to figure out, so I'll leave it to you, but above 3000 lbs GVW seems a good point to consider them or the tail might wag the dog. Horsepower seems adequate if its a 6 cyl, but you probably have a good idea now how well it tows. Pulling it out of the water will also be a good test.

sailingdog · Apr 22, 2009

BTW, there's a great article in one of the current sailing magazines about a Balboa 26 and sailing in heavy weather in her...

IIRC, might be Cruising World.

Bad Obsession · Apr 23, 2009

Nice boat. I agree with the others....Re-core the deck and then rebed the chain plates. It is the correct way to repair this. It will also save you from a possible demasting.

We all plan to sail in nice weather, but everyone, and I mean everyone, gets caught out in nasty stuff once in a while and you want to be able to hold together. A little sweat now will save you in the long run in money and possible dangers. Being demasted is dangerous.

Make sure that the boat is repaired far enough to be safe for you and yours. One that is done check the rigging on it and figure out what makes it easiest for you to single hand. I had a Hunter 22 and because I did some single handing I put a tiller pilot on it. It makes life simpler.

Good luck and keep us posted!

TimCup · Apr 25, 2009

Henry, first and foremost, congrats! And welcome

to the world of sailing. That boat is a fine boat. I like the large companionway- easy to get in and out. That boat will do well in skinny water, although IIRC, the rudder isn't hinged, so you need to watch it in the shallows.

An issue you may find with that design is the small cockpit. Yes, that gives you a huge (for a 26 footer) cabin, but my guess is you won't spend all that much time inside. The cockpit is tight, and with the outboard well taking more room there, it may be tight swinging the tiller.

NO MATTER WHAT BOAT YOU HAD BOUGHT- there was work that was gonna be needed to be done. The soft core around the chainplates is common, and easy to fix. Don't be afraid even if you've never worked with epoxy and glass before- the worst thing that can happen is you screw it up, and a good grinding and sanding will erase that mistake! Just make sure you get to solid wood before filling. There are alot of posts in the archives that describe it well, even with pics.

Putting a sleeve over the dent in the mast is not an option- it is an absolute necessity. It won't be expensive, unless you don't do it. replacing a failed mast IS costly, and that's before we talk about damage to the rest of the boat and it's occupants!

I agree with the post that said the C22 rejection of your offer was good news. It's a fine boat, but no better than what you got, and it's true no matter how we want to deny it- size matters!

You'll never lose money on the boat? Well, you'll certainly get back what you paid for it, or close. But you'll soon find out why boats are a hole, surrounded by water, that we throw money into.. that's half the fun!:dance:

enjoy-

cup

MrBee · Apr 25, 2009

Broke Sailor said:
Pacific Seacraft Flika or a Lyle Hess Falmouth Cutter. The best small boats made.

Let me know if you find one of these for that price....I want it !!!

He said $10,000... not $40,000.

Prime Time · May 3, 2009

I feel your pain..

I had rot on my bulkheads, and needed to replace them. I have a description if the process on my webpage.

John · May 4, 2009

bulkhead replacement

henrynlouisville said:
Today I went down and really cleaned the boat's interior. It looks pretty Then I heard a POP. A couple of area sailboaters were talking to me at the time and said "what the hell was that"? Well as you can see in the photos, the wood that the shrouds are attached to were so rotted that it gave away. Darn!

So I went down there and took photos and ripped out all the wood today...then cleaned the whole interior. The forward shrouds that attach to wood between the head and front birth are solid and file. The wood that gave away separates the cabin from the head. The wood is just teak veneered 5-ply plywood...which is a super easy fix.

.... As you can see in the photos, I have plenty of room to work down there.
The third photo shows the bar that the boom attaches to...and the port inner shroud right next to the rotted wood panel.
The fourth photo shows the part that gave away on the port side (outer shroud).
The last photo is the other side that gave away...from the head perspective.
The fifth photo is softness right above the last photo in the port head area.

Thanks Alot!
henrynlouisville

I replaced a similar bulkhead on my boat a few months back. Here (http://c36ia.com/node/1327) is how I did it. My case is different from yours as it is a different boat, including the fact that it's a keel stepped mast, but some of the issues would be the same. This includes prepping the new bulkhead.

Have fun!

Best Pocket Cruiser 23ft or under?

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