Beneteau First 367 for Cruising

Jalepeno · Dec 11, 2011

You don't need to worry.
http://www.aboutcruising.com/

Ray Bowles · Dec 11, 2011

You can cruise in just about any size boat. It depends on how many comfort items you require, how many people you can stand having aboard and how big the holding tank is. A Beneteau of that size will make a safe coastal cruiser for a couple or small family. It is a proven, safe and easily sailed boat. With proper equipment it is nicely handled by a single sailor.
One of the most important items is safety gear for all those friends. With that many persons aboard it is a good idea to fit them all with lifejackets at the dock and keep them prominantly at hand.
Enjoy the Sound. It is one of the most beautiful areas in the world to sail.
Ray

Ducati · Dec 12, 2011

My 36.7 Cents

We love our 36.7. It's fast, performs great for racing and is good some cruising.

The cockpit is big enough for 6-8 for daysailing however down below I would suggest no more than 4 for overnights. We use the 3rd cabin for luggage etc because we find all of the cabins are tight, especially for bigger/taller crew. The location of the traveler will probably negate the installation of a bimini so if it's raining foulies are a must. We do however have a dodger. The keel depth 7'3" can be an issue and if the weather turns bad you will need a backup plan as to deep harbors or anchorages that you can duck into. We have racing sails and no roller furling or flaking main so sail handling can be an issue with inexperienced crew.

The 36.7 tries to be the best of both worlds and does a pretty good job. It was my first choice for racing but for cruising we find it just ok. The Beneteau 373 might be a better option but it's not as quick.

Tejas · Dec 12, 2011

We have a bimini just aft of the end of the boom on our 36.7. It's small, but surprisingly quite effective. We also have a dodger.

Finding a windlass that would fit in the anchor locker was a hassle, and we ended up with a horizontal Quick Hector D 1000 W. Doing it over, I think I would prefer a Quick vertical windlass.

We also have a selden bow sprite.

http://s742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Tejasdave/

Jackdaw · Dec 12, 2011

While we do actively race her as well, we mostly couple-cruise our First 36.7 in the Apostle Islands on Lake Superior. In lots of ways its a lot like the PNW. Some thoughts:

Swap out the holding tank. The factory 10 gallon unit is way too small, and there is room for a 20G unit in the same location. Crazy move by Beneteau.

Make sure you are comfortable in at least one of the staterooms. We sleep aft-port, but the reality is that all three staterooms are too small.

We have no dodger, but we HAVE thought about it. Bimini is right out. Good foulies, boots, and gloves a must.

Get a below-deck autopilot. The huge wheel is great for racing, but standing behind it for hours can be a drain.

Swap out all the halogen and incandescent bulbs for LEDs.

We have our mainsail in lazy jacks and our headsails on a harken furler. That's really a must for couples cruising. Both can be put a way for racing.

The 140% is nice for light days, but can be overpowered in a blow. The 110 blade is a great sail but suffers in lighter airs. With a foam luff, our Neil Pryde 140% actually rolls into a 110 (its marked) with pretty decent shape.

A great add is an electric halyard winch. Spendy, but a great cruising addition. Takes all the work out of the main.

You will of course want an Espar. Lots of room for that. Ductwork however will be challenge if you want heat all the way forward.

As mentioned deep keel is the way to go but may limit harbor choices. Shallow keel is a fools bargain, the 36.7s are raced OD with NO allowance for the shoal keel, so the racers stay clear. Would really limit your potential resale opportunities.

Boat hunts on anchor like a little terrier on a leash. Anchor sail a good idea if you crowd in a lot.

On the 2006+ models, mounting a chartplotter at the helm is a royal pain. The fiberglass 'pyramid' makes this non-standard and costly, and there is no real good solution. That said, the 2006+ models with the wheel sunk into the cabin sole are the way to go if you can find one.

Plenty of fresh water (80G) tankage but diesel (20G) can be limiting, even more so if you have an Espar heater.

Storage is just OK. We often use the the aft starboard cabin as a closet.

Galley great. Dual sinks nice. Icebox well insulated and top loading. Reefer very efficient.

Plumb bow and short roller means you have to careful with your anchor at the bow to prevent nicks.

Volvo 2030 with saildrive is great. No propwalk and very maneuverable. Turns in her own length, forward or backward.

Boat really rigged for symmetric spins. Asyms can be flown but the bow pulpit overhang gets in the way. Expect to tear off your nav light unless you get a sprit or prod. We are looking at a Selden.

The 36.7 is wicked fast, we just chew up other boats. As the same time, the loads are manageable by a couple in our 40s.

The SA/D ratio is high (above 20) so you have to keep your eyes and mind on the rig. For sure not a set and forget boat. Fractional rig mean main de-powers well with out-haul and backstay. Next, wide traveler allows for luffing the main slightly while maintaining course. Then its reef-time.

Here we are, two-up. Its a great boat for what you are looking to do it you sort it out right.

Tejas · Dec 12, 2011

As for the holding tank, we were able to (just barely) install what I think I recall was a 30 gallon tank.

Ducati · Dec 12, 2011

Bowsprit! Cool

(quote: We also have a selden bow sprite)

What should I budget for one of these Selden bowsprits?

Thanks

Tejas · Dec 13, 2011

Ducati,

Would you please let me know if you would intend installing a Selden bow sprite as a DIY project of work for hire. Our installation was mostly DIY. If DIY, it will take quite a while to track down the information and document the process. The link below has all of the pictures I have.

Briefly, the bow sprite was the largest Selden made, and the reason was the mounting location. The fore and aft stainless steel deck mounting disks, two on deck and two below, and the stainless steel angle stock and aluminum angle stock used to fabricate a template were acquired online.

~$90 -- 4" x 4" x 0.25 x 12 stainless 316 angle and aluminium angle from

http://www.onlinemetals.com/

~$25 -- stainless steel disks from

http://www.wagnercompanies.com/disks_and_plates.aspx

~$200 -- local craftsman for drilling disks, and fabricating bracket and drill guide

Maine Sails how-to was essential

http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/sealing_the_deck

The hardware.jpg shows an un-drilled disk, aluminum template and an initial finished mount that was not satisfactory. The disks were drilled and the finished mounts were cut and drilled by a local craftsman at time and material rates. I also had him make a drill guide so that the holes drilled in the deck were parallel aligned and the holes top-side and under-side disks matched the holes drilled in the deck.

The only thing I can think of that I would differently would be shorted the the sprite by about 1', and I still might do that.

http://s742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Tejasdave/Bow Sprite/

Jackdaw · Dec 13, 2011

Tejas,

wow nice work! Its in our plans for the spring. I was wondering about the attachment on the end of the anchor roller. Do you think it is strong enough to take the extra levered loads from the sprit? On a reach in a blow I'd be afraid that would bend. I've see four other 36.7s with selden sprits, and they all mounted the pole on port with the Selden bow fitting bolted right to the deck. This also keeps the pole more level and the tack lower, like in this picture..

Your's looks great, just wondering about what you thought about the loads.

Tejas · Dec 13, 2011

Jackdaw,

Good question I think. As for the strength of the anchor roller bracket or the bracket we added being able to withstand the loads, the thickness of both seems adequate. I was actually more concerned about the down-ward pressure on the aft end of the sprit on the deck which is cored with balsa wood and the lift on the anchor roller bracket. The aft end load is spread with the stainless steel disk. Also, following Maine Sails directions, the balsa wood around the holes in the deck is cut back and filled with epoxy. The deck under the stainless steel plate just aft of the anchor locker is solid fiberglass.

The original design had the sprit mounted further aft on the anchor roller. In BowSprite3.jpeg, notice the three holes in the anchor roller bracket all the way to the left. In Hardware.jpeg, notice stainless steel bracket in the lower left. However, with this bracket mounted further aft, I was concerned that the lever arm on the sprit would be too great. As it is, sometimes the sprit flexes. When we bought the Selden sprit, Selden claimed it would be suitable for a code-zero. I think I recall they no longer make that claim and state that the sprit is not suitable for a code-zero.

It the spirit of full disclosure, we seldom fly the asymmetrical spinnaker and when we do it is generally in light air. We sail on a lake which is actually a damned river that is long an narrow and variable width depending upon water levels, and the time between tacks is often less than 10 minutes. The implementation might not be suitable for heavier air.

Jackdaw · Dec 14, 2011

Interesting... I was wondering what the discs were for. With 1/2 of the pole behind the fulcrum (50:50) I'd assume the lever loads would be very manageable for the deck. That being said, there is nothing wrong with insurance!

For sure the sprit will bend in a blow... the carbon ones much more than the alu ones. And you are right, the loads on a code 0 would be much more laterally. I think Selden's issue with that application is the LATERAL loads on the fittings, not the vertical ones or the pole itself.

As for me, I'm not looking to create extra projection as I am just trying to get the sail clear of the bow. I was in San Diego for the AmCup and the local Bennie dealer showed me this prod on a 36.7 there. The Dynmeema strop carries most of the load. I might go this route...

FastOlson · Dec 14, 2011

BEN-ifits and some drawbacks

Russf said:
Any thoughts on this boat as a coastal cruiser in the Pac. Northwest. Mostly day sailing but some two or three day cruises with a short crew of two or three but sailing parties for a day with 6 to 8 on board.

Thanks

A few years ago we considered moving to a "larger" boat and looked over both the Ben 367 and Ben 373. We did not want the downgrade in build quality, but were quite willing to at least consider one of them.
The 367 was nearly perfect on deck for sailing. Below decks it was not suited for cruising at all, IMO. Too many small bunks and a head that had room for a person with pants down and one roll of TP, but not both at the same time.

OTOH, the 373 had a great interior layout, but the cockpit was rather awful for sailing.

We asked the salesman if there was not some way to have both features in the same boat, since Ben builds a lot of different permutations for different markets.

We were told that: 1) their 80's models were the last "dual purpose" boats built by Ben, and that 2) the current models were not as good a quality as the older ones, and 3) that Ben has totally gone to two lines - a racing/day sailing line and a cruiser/condo line. It's sad, but that's the way it is. In general he likes Ben. a lot over the years, but would not want to be quoted because the company would be rather unhappy with such candor.

So, with the current offerings, you do have to choose... or cast your net a bit wider.

Ah well, the used market still has some great boats that actually do both and do 'em well. Our O-34 is one such, and a friend of mine loves winning races and cruising his Tartan/Thomas 35. The older Ben. First series would be another decent choice. Also take a look at the 80's/90's Ericson 35 and 38.

Happy Hunting,

LB

Jackdaw · Dec 14, 2011

I find a lot of truth in what LB says.

I mentioned the 3 stateroom effect... A bad layout, created by a need for 'european' style regatta racing, where crews sleep on the boat. On the 36.7 it creates 3 cabins, each smaller than it should be. Not uncomfortable mind you, just smaller. And if you have a need (like having two teenagers) then it helps. But I have NO need for a 35 foot boat to sleep 8.

There was/is a HUGE gap between the First and the 'Beneteau' line. (widest in the xx3 and xx6 Beneteau series, the new ones are a little bit better) The Firsts are very fast and very hands-on craft, and make compromises in that direction that some may not like. Cockpit-wide traveler, everyone? OTOH, the Beneteau line are comfortable, easy to sail, SLOW (yes slow) boats. My honest advice to anyone who wants a newish Beneteau but is caught right in the middle ? Buy a Jeanneau.

http://www.cruisingworld.com/sailboats/boat-reviews/jeanneau-sun-odyssey-36i-french-injection

Tejas · Dec 14, 2011

Jackdaw,

The stainless steel plates perform another function, possibly unique to the Selden sprit. The bearing surface on the deck of the Selden sprit are some kind of nylon or nylon-like pads, and I thought that the non-skid would otherwise quickly abrade these pads.

If I were doing this over, I'd probably go for something more like the picture you posted and a code-zero.

Tejas · Dec 14, 2011

Russ,

My apologies. I'd had the same thought, but ended up responded to questions.

BTW, I usually do not respond to the same post on multiple boards. However, after responding on sailnet, responding on this board was an exception.

Jackdaw · Dec 14, 2011

Russ,

With all due respect, lighten up.

Several of us (36.7 owners) answered your newbie post in great detail, but heard nothing back from you. The thread took on a life of its own after your total non-involvement. Now you come back and give us grief for talking between ourselves. Wow.

PS - As a potential 367 cruising owner, please understand that the sprit question is as relevant to you as the holding tank issues.

Jackdaw · Dec 15, 2011

Now would be fine... ;^)

Sorry if that came across has heavy handed. Not my intent. At the time I thought you came down kinda hard. Anyway. The sprit discussion is totally on-topic, is a big deal if you want to cruise a 36.7. The tackline will totally foul the bowpulpit without one, and mounting a sprit is a game of balancing trade-offs. You could fly a sym of course, but that is a real handful for a couple, no matter what the new First 35 brochure wants you to believe....