Battery or Charger Problem?

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Shippy

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Jun 1, 2004
272
Hunter 356 Harve de Grace
First a brief history of events.... Sometime in July (probably mid july) I checked my batteries and topped off the water level. Went out a couple of times, no problem, but last time out, we expected to be back on the boat in less than 5 days, so I didn't bother to plug in shorepower and charge the batteries,. well one thing lead to another and it was a full two weeks before we got back to the boat. When I went to start the motor this past week-end, no juice. GPS's battery reading was repoting only about 12.1 volts in the all position. Hooked up shore power and started the motor. Waited for about 30 minutes, then left the slip under motor, motered for a good 45 minutes or so and cut motor to sail for a couple of hours. When it was time to restart the motor, again the batteries were dead. fortunately I had a portable charger, and started the motor. While motoring back to the slip, I notice on the GPS we still only had about a 12.4 charge on the battery. When back in port, I checked the water level and both were dry. I added water, hooked up shore power and hoped the batteries would come back. (aren't you glad that was the brief version :) ) Well, went back tonight to see if that recharged the battery, and you guessed it, no such luck. The GPS charge read 12.4 and when I disconnected shore power, it quickly fell within a few seconds to 12 then 11.9 etc. I checked the charger, and the needle on the charger showed 0 on the charge rate. It is a dytek marine automatic battery charger and I wouldn't swear to it since it isn't in a convient place to read, but the needed did move higher before. My question is....are my batteries toast and should I just replace? it is my charger that isn't working (remember I motored for a good hour after jump starting the motor and it still only showed a 12.4 from teh alternator)? could it be just a bad fuse on the chrager why the needle is reading 0? are both toast or is it something else? My thought is the batteries are toast, but to go dry in just 2 months seems a bit extreme. They are about 3 years old. Why would the needle on the charger read zero if the batteries are toast? If it is the batteries (2 Seaworthy NC24 batteries from BoatUs that the PO installed), can/should I replace with like batteries, go to gel batteries? Will my existing charger work with these batteries (assuming it is ok)? Only information I could get off of the batteries is that they are Boat US Seaworthy NC24 625 MCA, 120 RC and 75 AH @20 hr rate. I have no idea what all those numbers mean. I appreciate any help I get on this.
 
J

Jay

kaput

usualy when they start to give trouble at this age they are kaput .not worth the trouble.replace them and save yourself a lot of hassle.
 

BobW

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Jul 21, 2005
456
Hunter 31 San Pedro, Ca
Batteries shouldn't just go dry in a month

without being charged. There is some water loss associated with discharge, but mostly it happens at the end of the charging cycle in a process called 'outgassing'. Your voltage readings could be consistent with a shorted cell. This is the ultimate fate of even a perfect battery - during each charge/discharge cycle, some sulfate crystals are formed and when they slough off the plates, they sink to the bottom and build up. Sooner or later, the pile in the bottom touches a plate and that's the end of your battery. I recommend you pull your batteries out, take them to an auto parts store and have them test them. If they are toast, at least you can trade them in - make sure they give you a reasonable amount, because the lead alone is worth over 40 cents per pound and it is completely recyclable. As for your battery markings, let me see if I remember correctly: NC24 is the part number - 24 is the 'group' number, mostly indicating physical size. You would replace a group 24 battery with another group 24 and have some certainty that it will fit in your battery box. 625 MCA is Marine Cranking Amps. Most auto batteries use CCA = Cold Cranking Amps, because in a car it gets cold and the colder it gets the fewer amps are available from a battery. Boats don't get that cold usually. MCA is calculated at 32F and CCA at 0F. 75 AH @ 20hr rate. Tough one. This means that the battery will deliver a total of 75 amp-hours (amps times hours) at a rate of 20 amps per hour. The rate is important because the discharge rate is not linear - a battery will supply a couple of amps for a long time, let's say 1 amp for over 100 hours, but if you pull 20 amps it will last less than 4 hours. Don't worry, if I got any of this wrong due to burnt brain cells, somebody will jump in and correct me. I'm still bothered about the batteries going dry in a month without being charged. Good luck. Cheers, Bob s/v X SAIL R 8
 

Shippy

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Jun 1, 2004
272
Hunter 356 Harve de Grace
What about the charger

Thanks for the replies so far. What about the charger showing 0? This worries me that the charger may be bad in addition to the batteries. In doing some more research, it looks like the gel batteries are out of teh question since this charger woun't charge them.
 
Mar 1, 2004
351
Catalina 387 Cedar Mills-Lake Texhoma
Buy new batteries and then

monitor the voltage from your battery charger as it operates. When batteries go dry that fast, I would be suspicious of the charger. Sometime the control circuits fail in the charger. I had a charger that worked for years in charging my tractor battery and my plane battery. Then it went crazy and started boiling everything. Threw it away and bought a new charger. Also motoring is a very slow way to charge batteries. Most alternators on boat engines are worthless.
 

BobW

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Jul 21, 2005
456
Hunter 31 San Pedro, Ca
Get the batteries tested and replace if bad

You wrote: battery reading was repoting only about 12.1 volts in the all position. Hooked up shore power and started the motor. What I don't understand: You hooked up shore power, which energized your charger (which is presumably a 'trickle' charger as opposed to a 'jump-start' one) and then you started your engine. Unless you have a charger with the ability to start your engine, then the current came from the batteries. So I confess confusion and can only recommend that you take the batteries to an auto-parts store and get them tested - replace if they are. I also concur with Jim: Watch your battery charger closely. You don't want to keep blowing hundreds of dollars on batteries if it's the charger that's causing the problems. Cheers, Bob s/v X SAIL R 8
 

Shippy

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Jun 1, 2004
272
Hunter 356 Harve de Grace
Good Point

The chrager is the original charger for this 1995 hunter, so it isn't anything special. But once hooked up to shorepower, it provided enough to start the motor, but not connected to shorepower hitting the starter did nothing. I'm trying to see if the marina service deptartment can at least test the output from the charger to make sure it is working properly. I've been looking at batteries on-line....like I said, with this charger, it looks like I need to stay away from the Gel Cell and AGM batteries and the 4D's are too large for the existing compartment.
 

BobW

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Jul 21, 2005
456
Hunter 31 San Pedro, Ca
Gel batteries require different voltages

so if you can't adjust the output voltages on your charger, you shouldn't buy gel batteries. AGM need different voltages, but CAN be charged using lead-acid settings. I'm having a rueful chuckle.... I've been discoursing on batteries for several days now and realized that I haven't paid any attention to my own batteries since I bought my boat 5 months ago..... If you have to buy new batteries, and your charger is questionable at best, you might consider a clean sweep and buy one of the 'smart' chargers - that would let you buy gel cells and have confidence in your charger. Cheers, Bob s/v X SAIL R 8
 
Feb 26, 2004
23,328
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
The charger

is killing your batteries. An automtovie charger? Come on now. Read and download the Ample Power primer, www.amplepower.com. You need to learn this stuff. Stu
 

Shippy

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Jun 1, 2004
272
Hunter 356 Harve de Grace
Who said Automotive???

I said it read Automatic. I agree, the Dytek charger isn't a smart charger and is causing the problem. I'll be looking at replacing the charger with either the Charles Marine 5000SP or Xantrek TC2. Plus I was thinking of going with two new AGM group 24.
 
Dec 2, 2003
4,245
- - Seabeck WA
Shippy, how big is your '95 Hunter?

It's really tempting for guys like me to recommend larger batteries. You don't have to put them in the same place Hunter used. (in most cases)
 

BobW

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Jul 21, 2005
456
Hunter 31 San Pedro, Ca
Don't forget wire size...

when you replace the charger. If you had a 10 amp charger and replace it with a larger one, you will probably have to upgrade the wiring to the batteries. And if you're going to replace the charger, why not go all the way to the gel batteries? Stu, that's a great link. Thanks. Cheers, Bob s/v X SAIL R 8
 
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