Battery Charger

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MickP

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Nov 20, 2012
65
Hunter 33 Charleston
Hi there,
Have just about bought our first boat. It has a shore power inlet, but we need to put in an AC panel and whilst there, thought it would be a good idea to wire in a battery charger.

The boat has two banks, 1 x12v wet cell 24 series battery, the second bank has 2 batteries but needs further investigation to find out what they are.
We will be doing mainly day sailing, the occasional overnight and possibly a week long cruise once a year.
There is no refrigerator nor water heater at present, so power consumption is pretty low.

What other info do i need in order to be able to figure out which battery charger i need?
Thanks for your help
Mick
 
Dec 2, 1999
15,184
Hunter Vision-36 Rio Vista, CA.
Mick: I find it strange that this boat does NOT have a battery charger already installed. Was this a new or used boat? If it was used, maybe you should check with the previous owner. If it is new you should check with the dealer.
 

MickP

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Nov 20, 2012
65
Hunter 33 Charleston
Steve,
It is a used boat (1981). I found it rather strange as well, the PO only had the boat a short while. The PPO kept the boat on a mooring and therefore never felt the need. Not sure if i am getting my electrical terms muddled here, there IS a regulator that charges the batteries from the engine, and 2 solar panels to keep them topped up. Nothing that will charge the batteries from the shore power though
Cheers
 

MSter

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Apr 12, 2010
131
Sabre 38' MK II Oriental, NC
Mick P,
This is were Stu would normally chime in with info and a link to a series of " How to and what to do " articles written by Maine Sail.
check out the section " Musing with Maine Sail" under the Featured Contributors section ( see forums above )also check the link below for battery charger info and good luck and welcome aboard.
http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/installing_a_marine_battery_charger
Mster
 
May 24, 2004
7,215
CC 30 South Florida
If there is no AC panel I gather the shore power inlet is just a dead receptacle. Check whatever wiring may be present as in those days the use of rigid copper wires was the norm. Rewiring with tinned flexible copper wire would be advisable. If more than one circuit is contemplated make sure a GFCI outlet is connected in the leading position of each circuit.
 

MickP

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Nov 20, 2012
65
Hunter 33 Charleston
kloudie, Benny
Thanks for the comments. I think the original AC panel got removed by a PO. Currently the shore power connects directly to the sockets (and no, they are not GFCI protected), hence the need to get sorted asap. I believe the wiring was replaced with flexible copper wire but will check.

Other than the panel, switch, charger and GFCI sockets, anything else i should consider while getting the AC side of things sorted?
 
Jun 21, 2007
2,118
Hunter Cherubini 36_80-82 Sausalito / San Francisco Bay
Hi Mick:

Good boat choice -- a Cherubini Hunter. If you haven't discovered already, Sailboat Owners does have a Cherubini specific forum. You can do searches on that forum for historical threads on topics you might have questions about.

Regarding AC chargers, lots of brands/features. The wiring configuration/method is important and can vary. Do a search of Ask All Sailors for discussion.

An observation on the electric systems topic; there is too much to know about wiring and repair and redesign and safety than can possibly be covered comprehensively in only forum responses and internet searches. Expect that you are a DIY type. But since you mention this is your first boat, you might consider a sailboat owner's repair/maintenance bible that contains sections for boat structure, electrical, engine, etc. My favorite is a compilation of Don Casey's individual repair books:

http://www.amazon.com/Caseys-Comple...8-1&keywords=sailboat+repair+manual+don+casey

I also use my 36' Cherubini Hunter almost exclusively as a day sailer. The boat is out a couple of times per week on average. As your boat, I also don't have a water heater or refrigerator. (And five years into ownership no real plans to add.) Similar to your setup, I keep my batteries maintained/charged by solar. (Mine is just a single small 20w panel however). I did install a modern AC charger a couple of years ago to replace the OEM ferro-resonant monster that was with the boat when I bought it. Checked to verify that the new charger worked. Hasn't been turned on since. Because of the solar panels, I never need to disconnect/reconnect the AC cord every time we go out.

I would suggest that if you are not planning to ever go to big demand on the DC side (i.e. will be using an ice chest and won't be powering a TV etc) and the solar panels are of significant size, then your AC charger choice doesn't need to be all out since it's purpose will be mostly for recovering from a mistake.

Presumably your boat does have an electrical panel for the DC? Does it look like the one in the link that Kloudie1 included? Or more-or-less like my panel as pictured below? If so, you've got the AC panel fitted by Hunter. I'm on the low humidity West Coast, so my original breaker switches were/still are good for the service. But I did renew some of the wiring, and on the back side of the panel replaced crimp terminals on the wires that were still bright clean copper. As mentioned by Benny, don't stay with rigid copper wire if any is found. (My 1980 Hunter was wired with stranded as original.) And if the copper stranded wire is tarnished under the insulation, then it must be replaced.
 

Attachments

Jun 21, 2007
2,118
Hunter Cherubini 36_80-82 Sausalito / San Francisco Bay
Mick:

I see that you gave some more info while I was writing my response. So most of my post is no longer topical.

Except that because you are missing some really important components, a good primer/overview of sailboat electrical systems will prove useful.
 
Jun 21, 2007
2,118
Hunter Cherubini 36_80-82 Sausalito / San Francisco Bay
kloudie, Benny

... Other than the panel, switch, charger and GFCI sockets, anything else i should consider while getting the AC side of things sorted?
Might be good to pull out each AC receptacle from it's fitting. Carefully inspect everything, particularly the wire condition and attachment to the socket terminals. Corrosion can cause resistance = heat.

If you haven't found it yet, here is a link to the original Hunter drawings for the Cherubini 30 and 33's It contains wiring diagrams/routings for both AC and DC. Might be helpful.

http://sbo.sailboatowners.com/downloads/Hunter_33_77-83_90315630.pdf
 

MickP

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Nov 20, 2012
65
Hunter 33 Charleston
rardi,
Thanks for your posts and help, some very useful information there. I'm probably going to get someone else to do most of the electrical stuff, but i like to have a reasonable idea of what is going on when i talk to them and the inspecting is something i can do. Thanks for the book recommendation as well, boat ownership doesn't seem quite so daunting having such helpful people on the forum
 
Feb 26, 2004
23,353
Catalina 34 224 Maple Bay, BC, Canada
Congratulations on your new boat.

While I'm "late to this dance", here's a link that you can wander through when you have the time, may start to answer a lot of your potentially forthcoming questions. Keep comin' back here, lots of helpful skippers.

Electrical Systems 101 http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,5977.0.html
 

MickP

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Nov 20, 2012
65
Hunter 33 Charleston
Stu,
Thanks for the link. I have been wading through the links for the last few days and now know a lot more than i used to. I think i need to do a wiring diagram to find out exactly what i have got and how it is connected first, and then start to think about what i need to add/change. Depending on what i have, the AC battery charger might have to wait (i assume it is easy enough to add one later) and spend the money on a better solar cell regulator as per MaineSails recent post.

Thanks again for your help
 
Jun 9, 2008
1,850
- -- -Bayfield
You need an AC panel and one good source is Blue Seas. I'm not going to give you a link, I'm going to tell you what you need to do. The battery charger needs to be large enough to accommodate your batteries. So, if one of them is a deep cycle battery, you need at least a 10 amp charger. The bigger the better (charges quicker), but bigger means more money, so shop for the biggest you can afford and make sure it is auto, meaning it will regulate the condition of the battery charge and slow the charge down instead of just over-charging it. You have two types of chargers. One has a 3-prong plug in to go into an inlet and another is hard wired into the AC system. I like the latter, but the choice is yours as they both work fine. If you go with the plug, then you need to wire in an outlet from your AC panel. (A duplex outlet located near the charger so the cord can reach). If you hard wire the charger in, you need to get a charger with enough banks to accommodate the number of batteries you have. Pick out your AC panel to accommodate all the things you intend to run from it (you need a breaker for each load). The breakers must be marine types (don't use household Square D boxes, for example and use stranded wire 12-ga/3 conductor (white, black and green) and not solid core like they use in houses). The main breaker is a double breaker meaning it breaks both the hot and neutral wires. This is where the wires from your inlet (shorepower cord) come from. Then you will have another breaker for your outlets (maybe two for port and starboard if you have a bunch) and another one for your battery charger so you can turn it off from inside the boat. If you are ever going to install refrigeration, an inverter, or any other thing that uses AC, then you want a breaker for each purpose or load. The breaker you use is one that is the correct capacity for whatever you are installing. The sheet that comes with the unit usually tells you this info.
So, if the only thing you are going to have is your shorepower and a battery charger, you need the one panel with the double breaker and a spot to add a breaker for your battery charger. The panel should come with labels for you to affix. If you are going to run a battery charger and some outlets, then you would have the AC main breaker and two spots to add a breaker for the charger and another for the outlets. From the charger, you would wire to the breaker panel. The green goes on the green screw, the white goes on the silver screw and the black goes on the gold screw (this should be detailed in the instructions with the panel). Of course the shore power is not plugged into the inlet on the boat while you work. All juice should be off.
This should get you going. I can't think of anything else at the moment. Ask if you have questions.
 

MickP

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Nov 20, 2012
65
Hunter 33 Charleston
BBill,
Very helpful and straight to the point. Thanks for your help. Get ready for numpty questions once i get started...
Cheers
Mick
 
Apr 19, 1999
1,670
Pearson Wanderer Titusville, Florida
Mick,

I didn't see this mentioned in the thread (maybe I missed it) but if you're going to be hooked up to shore power for long periods, a galvanic isolator is a good investment. Its purpose is to maintain a good AC ground for your boat to protect against electrical shock while isolating your DC ground.

In most boats, the AC ground and DC ground are connected together at the engine block. The AC circuits in marina docks are all grounded together, which means the engine blocks of all the boats connected to shore power are electrically connected together through the dock wiring circuit. Each block is connected to its own driveshaft, propeller and sacrificial zinc anodes, all of which are in contact with salt water - an electrolyte. Small differences in DC voltage between boats can lead to stray DC currents in the water which can accelerate the corrosion of your zincs or weaken your drive shaft or prop.

The galvanic isolator protects your underwater metals by blocking DC current. Most are about the size of a large paperback novel and are easy to install. With a little planning, it can be done in about half an hour.

If your boat is already wired with AC outlets, make sure they are all three-prong, otherwise replace them. Make sure a GFCI is the first outlet in each AC circuit with outlets. Most battery chargers now come with three-prong plugs so installation is very simple. Mount to a secure location, connect DC terminals to batteries and plug the AC cord into a GFCI outlet. Good luck and be safe.
 

MickP

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Nov 20, 2012
65
Hunter 33 Charleston
Peter,
You are right, i hadn't got as far as this with my thinking. Thanks for the tip.
Boat is wired with 2 prong non-GFCI outlets, so was going to replace all of these as part of the electrical overhaul.
Cheers
Mick
 
Apr 19, 1999
1,670
Pearson Wanderer Titusville, Florida
Peter,
You are right, i hadn't got as far as this with my thinking. Thanks for the tip.
Boat is wired with 2 prong non-GFCI outlets, so was going to replace all of these as part of the electrical overhaul.
Cheers
Mick
Mick,

Hang in there. My outlets were three-conductor but wired with solid copper (house) wire. It was a real pain to remove the old wire because there was very little slack and the outlets weren't in accessible locations.

Here's a tip. Tape the end of the new wire securely to the old wire before you pull it out. Wrap with tape to prevent snags. As you pull the old wire out it will pull the new wire into place behind it. Just like replacing halyards...
 

splax

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Nov 12, 2012
694
Hunter 34 Portsmouth
Hello Mick,
Like you, I was stunned to find no battery charger present on my boat when I got it last month. Like you, I had the torture of selecting an appropriate charger and getting bang for the buck. Two considerations I have not seen mentioned in this thread are:
1.) The charger must have capacity to support your "docked" loads and charge the batteries. This means while docked you are running all kinds of lights and equipment, your charger will be able to support all DC loads and get you ready to go with a full charge on your batteries. A charger that balances the charge between banks is a good investment.
2.) While connected to shore power electrolysis is accelerated. Disconnect the shore power cable, even the ground has electric potential, if leaving the boat for an extended period.
 
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