backstay - part 2

[tlochhaas]

Back again with my backstay replacement problem, a little more desperate
this time and really hoping someone can help me!

In the ideal world I would either get a rigger to do the replacement
entirely (but it's a full day's sail from my downeast Maine mooring to
the nearest rigging shop, plus a day there and a day back--and I just
don't have 3 days in a row to spare right now) or else climb up the mast
myself (I do have removable steps to the top) and measure the backstay
as well as get the exact dimensions of the toggle at the masthead, and
then order a new stay and climb back up again to replace it (using two
halyards and topping lift all to secure the mast aft while the old stay
is removed). My problem is that my mooring is in a tidal channel and the
water and wind are almost always rough--I tried climbing this afternoon
when it seemed calm, was on the boat alone--and chickened out halfway
up, too much scary motion. I decided I'd feel more secure with the boat
tied up motionless to a dock, but even the nearest dock is a long
half-day's sail, and right now I have to get home to Mass. and can't
even do this to get the exact measurements. So I'm hoping my rig is
standard for a Vega and that I can learn the dimensions from one of you,
and then order a new stay and have to make only one trip to a dock to
climb up and put it on.

OK, here's my specific questions.

1. Does my rig sound like the original Vega configuration? The backstay
starts as two wires connected (with clevis pin fittings) to two
chainplates on the stern. They rise up in an inverted V to a fitting
that connects to a turnbuckle, very roughly 6 feet off the deck. From
the top of the turnbuckle, with a clevis pin fitting, the single stay
rises to the mast head. I do recall there is a toggle at the top, but
I've never (I should have!) examined it closely with the mast down, so
I'm unsure how the toggle connects to the mast itself. Does this sound
like the original rigging?

2. Assuming this is the original rig, I'm hoping I can get the exact
dimension of the backstay from the top of the turnbuckle to the toggle.
Does anyone know that, or is it in the Vega manual? If it is in the
manual specs, does that length include the toggle part and the clevis
pin fitting--that is, total length to the top of the turnbuckle? I can
measure it by hoisting a tape measure on a halyard, but that may not be
as exact as I'd like to be. Yet I can use this to confirm that my own
stay is about the same as a known Vega standard length.

3. Can anyone describe for me what that toggle looks like up top--shape,
size, how it connects to the mast, etc.? I'd need to be exact in order
to describe to a rigger exactly what kind of toggle to use in the new
stay. (And when I climb the mast with the new stay I'd like to know what
tools to take to install it!)

Sorry to be persistent and repetitive with these questions. I wish I had
time to figure all this out myself, but I won't be back to the boat for
3 weeks after tomorrow and if I don't have a new stay to bring back with
me, I'll likely have to miss a cruise I've planned for several months
with 3 friends (to Digby, Nova Scotia, for the Digy-Bass Harbor
race)--definitely can't go offshore with a damaged backstay!

Thanks ever so much, anyone who can help!

Tom
1971 Vega Allegro 1240

 

[bbach1949]

Tom: My Vega is also a 1971 (V1071) with a Proctor mast. I rerigged two
years ago and still have the old backstay, so I can measure it for you if you'd
like. It sounds like your rig is the standard one. The toggle at the masthead
is a special Proctor stainless one - you probably won't find a replacement
easily, but I doubt that you need a new one. It has a hollow horizontal clevis
pin (1/2 inch?) through the masthead fitting, and a 5/16 hole through the jaw
portion that takes the upper swaged eye of the stay. It's a pretty hefty
piece. Just leave it in place and replace the backstay.

If you can't get an exact measurement, why not have the rigger swage an eye
on one end of the replacement backstay and then you can field install a Stalok
fitting on the other end? I used Staloks throughout when I rerigged and found
them easy to install. A spare halyard (in good condition!) led aft can
support the mast while you replace the backstay, but make sure you're comfortable
with this.

Let me know if you want me to measure the old backstay. No guarantee that
they are identical, however. Good luck, Bill Bach

 

[tlochhaas]

Thanks, Bill. Let me just make sure I've got this right, if you don't
mind one more reply! I guess I assumed that the masthead toggle is
directly fixed to the wire in some way, but you're saying there's just a
regular swaged eye in the wire end that is easily dismounted from the
toggle? I'm not precisely sure I understand how the 5/16 hole "takes"
the upper swaged eye? a second clevis pin? Or it will be obvious when I
get up there with a new one? I'm a little fuzzy also about the swaged
eye--I thought that an eye in wire was weaker than a direct terminus
into a fitting? (But if that's standard Vega, it's good enough for
me--whatever worked the first 30+ years is good enough for me now!)

Thanks for the Stalok suggestion field installed--that will eliminate
the need for a precise measurement in advance. Just out of curiosity,
how did you cut the wire when you rerigged? Did you increase the size of
the stay or stay with the original diameter?
Thanks again,
Tom

BBach1949@... wrote:

 

[mocap1]

Tom,

My (1969) Vega mast is down, lying on a trailer next to the boat, and I can make whatever measurements you need. However, at the moment we are rushing around, getting ready to leave to participate in a regatta in San Carlos, Mexico with one of our other boats, and can't make the measurements until we return Monday. However, I am in full agreement with BBachs message below. Have the rigger make up the backstay assembly with the legs a little long. Install the backstay at the masthead. Cut the legs to exact length, and install Norseman or Stay-loc fittings. I believe the fittings are available through the West Marine catalog. I used this proceedure to replace a damaged forestay on a cruising ketch, and had no difficulty whatever. I used a bolt cutter to cut the rigging wire. You can buy one at Home Depot, Loews, or probably even your local hardware store. Spend a little extra and get a larger size; it makes the job easier, and doesn't mess up the end of the wire. I have also cut rigging wire using an abrasive cut-off blade on a 4" grinder, but a good size bolt cutter is a bit easier to use. If you do use a grinder, don't overheat the wire anymore than absolutely necessary.

You might consider making up the whole assembly yourself and forgetting about the rigger.

Mort

 

[bbach1949]

Tom: OK, here goes:

1. The original wire size is correct - 3/16 . No reason to go bigger.

2. The toggle at the masthead consists of a stainless forging that has an
eye on one end (attaches to the masthead) and a clevis on the other that takes
an eye (swaged or mechanical) on the backstay wire. This is designed to allow
for side to side movement without cracking or stressing the wire or fittings.

3. An easy cheap and low tech way to cut the wire is to drill a 3/16 hole
through a block of wood, push the wire into the hole, and hacksaw through both
wood and wire. Subsequent cuts use the same slot. This keeps the wire from
unraveling while you cut.

Good luck and happy holiday. Bill

 

[vega1860]

Hi Tom, quite a pickle. Bill and Mort have given you the right scoop on the rigging so I won't add anything except to say, by way of encouragement, that I re-rigged my boat, first time ever atempting such a project, and I figure if I can do it anyone can. I used the wood block and hack saw method Bill describes to cut the wire. You may need to clean up the wire ends a bit with a grinder before installing the Sta Lok fittings. I was advised by the rigger at the boatyard to fill the Sat Lok fittings with clear silicon before assembly to prevent corrosion.

Measure twice, cut once. If you find that you have goofed and cut a bit too short, add another toggle at the bottom or at the joint where the split lower attaches to the upper single wire. If you cut too long, take the sta lok off (You may have to replace the cone), re-cut and re-install.

Its easier than it sounds. Like I said, I did it - anyone can.

Aloha,

ChuckTom Lochhaas toml@... wrote:

 

[tlochhaas]

Many thanks to Bill, Mort, Chuck, Christine, and Frank. I'm all set to
go replace the backstay myself with your information and helpful tips. I
don't know how I'd get by without this e-mail group!
Tom
Vega 1240 Allegro