There seems to be some confusion regarding an article in Practical Sailor which stated that they thought that Hunter made a "serious" error in not putting backing plates under equipment such as winches, stanchions, etc. I had thought that this was confirmed to be an error, and that there are backing plates. Now someone has stated that they used to put them in but they don't do it with the new boats. My boat is too far away to investigate first hand. Does anyone have first hand information about this, and if so, what exactly are they doing under stanchions and winches??? Richard Owen
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Last trip I made to the plant
...they were embedding a backing plate in the glass, then mounting hardware with tapping screws (which don't require washers and nuts). It is absolutely a backing plate, but this method saves on installation labor. Without a backing plate under winches you'd tear up the glass in no time. I doubt if there is any serious production boat built that doesn't use backing plates under all deck hardware. I thought that comment in PS revealed more about the inexperience of the writer than it did about the boat.
...they were embedding a backing plate in the glass, then mounting hardware with tapping screws (which don't require washers and nuts). It is absolutely a backing plate, but this method saves on installation labor. Without a backing plate under winches you'd tear up the glass in no time. I doubt if there is any serious production boat built that doesn't use backing plates under all deck hardware. I thought that comment in PS revealed more about the inexperience of the writer than it did about the boat.
No backing...........
I can tell you that the stern cleats on my 1983 34' had no backing of any kind. This was discovered during a raft up after the cleat pulled out. Nothing on the back except a small washer and nut.
I can tell you that the stern cleats on my 1983 34' had no backing of any kind. This was discovered during a raft up after the cleat pulled out. Nothing on the back except a small washer and nut.
backing plates
I have no experience with deck cleats, but this summer I installed a line clutch on the cabin top on my '88 33.5. When i drilled the holes, I went through an aluminium plate that I tapped into. The advantages of this method are no holes through the deck to leak, and a cleaner look inside the cabin. Whether or not this is the strongest method, I don't know. But I've never had a failure on either of the two Hunters I've owned.
I have no experience with deck cleats, but this summer I installed a line clutch on the cabin top on my '88 33.5. When i drilled the holes, I went through an aluminium plate that I tapped into. The advantages of this method are no holes through the deck to leak, and a cleaner look inside the cabin. Whether or not this is the strongest method, I don't know. But I've never had a failure on either of the two Hunters I've owned.
Built differently 15 yrs ago
It seems to me that boats were built to different standards 15-20 years ago. I'm not sure if the problem was ignorance, indifference, or a lack of experience in where and how to cut corners, but there are certainly more stories from that era of missing components. I don't know, but QC was clearly different. Of course, the question on a 15 year old boat is modifications. Could a prior owner have changed out that cleat and not backed it properly? At any rate, my comments pertained to boats built within the past few years.
It seems to me that boats were built to different standards 15-20 years ago. I'm not sure if the problem was ignorance, indifference, or a lack of experience in where and how to cut corners, but there are certainly more stories from that era of missing components. I don't know, but QC was clearly different. Of course, the question on a 15 year old boat is modifications. Could a prior owner have changed out that cleat and not backed it properly? At any rate, my comments pertained to boats built within the past few years.
Cleat backing plates
I have a 1991 P42, and there were no backing plates on the cleats or under the bow roller. I spoke to Hunter about that, and they opined that backing plates were unnecessary since the bolts went through the aluminum toerail. However, that didn't stop the nuts and fender washers from digging into the fiberglass under the toerail. I also questioned the strength of the cleats under a very large load. It was a very simple matter to buy some 3/16" thick stainless steel bars and put them under the aluminum toerails for backing plates (including the midship cleats I added by grinding down the vertical portion of the toerail and drilling through the aluminum). I also had a machine shop make me a trapezoidal piece to backplate the bow roller. Never had any problems, and I have had huge loads on the bow roller and the bow cleats. The stanchions, which are screwed into plates glassed into the deck, are very strong. I once had to pull up to a commercial dock to clear foreign customs, and pulled up to those huge 6' diameter black horizontal "fenders" made for freighters. Large swells forced my lifelines and stanchions under the "fender", and the force bent the stanchions. None of the stanchions pulled out of their deck attachments, and those connection points continue to be stong. (Although I had to cut off the top of one stanchion and drill a new hole for the lifeline.
I have a 1991 P42, and there were no backing plates on the cleats or under the bow roller. I spoke to Hunter about that, and they opined that backing plates were unnecessary since the bolts went through the aluminum toerail. However, that didn't stop the nuts and fender washers from digging into the fiberglass under the toerail. I also questioned the strength of the cleats under a very large load. It was a very simple matter to buy some 3/16" thick stainless steel bars and put them under the aluminum toerails for backing plates (including the midship cleats I added by grinding down the vertical portion of the toerail and drilling through the aluminum). I also had a machine shop make me a trapezoidal piece to backplate the bow roller. Never had any problems, and I have had huge loads on the bow roller and the bow cleats. The stanchions, which are screwed into plates glassed into the deck, are very strong. I once had to pull up to a commercial dock to clear foreign customs, and pulled up to those huge 6' diameter black horizontal "fenders" made for freighters. Large swells forced my lifelines and stanchions under the "fender", and the force bent the stanchions. None of the stanchions pulled out of their deck attachments, and those connection points continue to be stong. (Although I had to cut off the top of one stanchion and drill a new hole for the lifeline.
Plates
If you can get underneath on a sunny day you can usually "see" through the glass enough to tell whether there is anything in the layup. Usually it is aluminium but maybe plywood on some builders. Often there is a local thickening visible from underneath.
If you can get underneath on a sunny day you can usually "see" through the glass enough to tell whether there is anything in the layup. Usually it is aluminium but maybe plywood on some builders. Often there is a local thickening visible from underneath.
Backing Plates
Richard; Our 1984 H31 has all glassed in backing plates and we have never had any problem. Come by and have a look. Mac Lindsay "Kitkatla"
Richard; Our 1984 H31 has all glassed in backing plates and we have never had any problem. Come by and have a look. Mac Lindsay "Kitkatla"
H-35 '88 Has Backing Plates
On our '88 H-35 we've added larger primary winches, secondary winches, additional sheet stoppers, and larger turning blocks on the coach roof and there were aluminum backing plates in each instance. Also, I'd like to point out that aluminum cutting oil for tapping is different that that used for steel. Cuttihng oil used for steel will gum up the tap.
On our '88 H-35 we've added larger primary winches, secondary winches, additional sheet stoppers, and larger turning blocks on the coach roof and there were aluminum backing plates in each instance. Also, I'd like to point out that aluminum cutting oil for tapping is different that that used for steel. Cuttihng oil used for steel will gum up the tap.
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