I am constantly amazed at the display of bad tempers on the water. On weekends, (when the workers are out), I hear and see boaters screaming at each other and hear calls to the C-Guard fussing that 'someone pulled in front of me, etc'. When someone makes a mistake, mean people seem to jump to arms to banter the mistakee with little or no regard to help the person committing the 'sin'. I think that this must be related to the popular 'road rage'. Maybe some people operating boats have little or no control over other phases of their lives (jobs/wives) and when the opportunity arrives to critize - they go nuts! Would this account for people screaming, throwing beer cans, etc. My military experience leads me to avoid mean folk either under/over me as they rarely accomplish tasks well and cause more trouble than they are worth. I have a bud that agreed to help me on a new boat I had just bought. Four of us started out on a beautiful day to enjoy the sail and this guy went nuts. He corrected every small action of ours/others and runined the day for us. When I got him back to the marina - I told him that he would have to be less of an a** the next time we headed out. He stomped away mumbling. Am I the only boater that runs in to these maniacs?
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Tom, there is not much detail here.
Tom, I don't know if you are a new boat owner or even an experienced boat owner with no boating education. Was the guy you had on board experienced and educated? Was he just trying to teach those on board? Was he being kind to those on your boat commiting the sin. It may not be that they are mean people, they may just be fed up with uneducated boaters or drivers. I really don't like being on a boat where nav rules or safe boating practices are neglected. I am not saying this was your case but if it were, believe me I would not want to crew with you again. You say small minds big tempers, the ones that tick me off are the big boats with no education. Mistakes are one thing, intentional disregard or ignorance of the rules is another. I think much of what causes "Road Rage" is not just a mistake but the intentional violation of the rule that causes an unsafe act that could endanger someone including the person doing it. Yes, I have encounter ignorant people that scream at yoou because they don't know how to handle a boat. I do agree that I avoid situations and people that would cause the screaming scenario. r.w.landau
Tom, I don't know if you are a new boat owner or even an experienced boat owner with no boating education. Was the guy you had on board experienced and educated? Was he just trying to teach those on board? Was he being kind to those on your boat commiting the sin. It may not be that they are mean people, they may just be fed up with uneducated boaters or drivers. I really don't like being on a boat where nav rules or safe boating practices are neglected. I am not saying this was your case but if it were, believe me I would not want to crew with you again. You say small minds big tempers, the ones that tick me off are the big boats with no education. Mistakes are one thing, intentional disregard or ignorance of the rules is another. I think much of what causes "Road Rage" is not just a mistake but the intentional violation of the rule that causes an unsafe act that could endanger someone including the person doing it. Yes, I have encounter ignorant people that scream at yoou because they don't know how to handle a boat. I do agree that I avoid situations and people that would cause the screaming scenario. r.w.landau
most interesting
Two cases. I had a friend who's father owned a powerboat. His father died. The son (age 45) knew little about boating, but thought he did. When I was on board, we constantly argued about how to do anything to the point of me yelling at him, etc. Example. To dock, he shuts the motor off at the slip. Then he lassoes the nearest post and pulls the 28' in. I told him to start the motor, put it in gear, etc. He said that his way was the correct way to dock a boat, motor off before you get into the slip, facing the current. Finally, I took the helm and showed him how to dock a boat, with the motor running, and in gear. I came withing a few inches at all three points. A perfect docking. I explained that with the motor off, you have no control in the current, and it is far to dangerous. As an aside, everytime he went out, the neighbors across the river would ask when we were returning as they would get their beers and martinis out to watch the event of his docking the boat. Yet, my friend insists that his way is the proper way to dock a boat. You should see how he anchors. You won't believe it. In the second case, I had the Commodore of the boat club on board along with several others. We were heading up river, where there are posted "No Wake" zones and a speed limit of 5 MPH. I heard this long toot, looked back, then hit the throttle on my sailboat full bore and veered off to the port side. We were creating a wake and I was admonished for it by the Big C. I asked him "didn't you see that 125' dinner ship 10 feet behind us, and gaining?" He said "We were in the right, and going 5 MPH. He was wrong". He then said he would never go out on my boat again as I didn't have the slightest idea what the rules of navigation were, and he made a point of telling anyone who would listen, that I was a lousy captain and a danger to anyone who went out with me. This past summer I worked for that boat, met the captain, the same one who almost ran me down. He is a 75 year old coot who disobeys rules like a fat woman eats ice cream. HE told me I was in the wrong, should have gotten out of his way, and should learn the rules about who has right-of-way. (On July 4, he ran over an anchor rode of a new SeaRay. The rode wrapped around the prop sucking the boat into us. Our Captain called the Coast Guard to report that we had been rammed by a boater. And he stuck to the story in his report to the CG insisting he had the right-of-way and that the other boater had no right to anchor where he did. Apparently the other 400 or so boaters anchored in the same area to watch the fireworks were in the wrong spot too.) I suppose it depends on your perspective, but I think I was in the right both times.
Two cases. I had a friend who's father owned a powerboat. His father died. The son (age 45) knew little about boating, but thought he did. When I was on board, we constantly argued about how to do anything to the point of me yelling at him, etc. Example. To dock, he shuts the motor off at the slip. Then he lassoes the nearest post and pulls the 28' in. I told him to start the motor, put it in gear, etc. He said that his way was the correct way to dock a boat, motor off before you get into the slip, facing the current. Finally, I took the helm and showed him how to dock a boat, with the motor running, and in gear. I came withing a few inches at all three points. A perfect docking. I explained that with the motor off, you have no control in the current, and it is far to dangerous. As an aside, everytime he went out, the neighbors across the river would ask when we were returning as they would get their beers and martinis out to watch the event of his docking the boat. Yet, my friend insists that his way is the proper way to dock a boat. You should see how he anchors. You won't believe it. In the second case, I had the Commodore of the boat club on board along with several others. We were heading up river, where there are posted "No Wake" zones and a speed limit of 5 MPH. I heard this long toot, looked back, then hit the throttle on my sailboat full bore and veered off to the port side. We were creating a wake and I was admonished for it by the Big C. I asked him "didn't you see that 125' dinner ship 10 feet behind us, and gaining?" He said "We were in the right, and going 5 MPH. He was wrong". He then said he would never go out on my boat again as I didn't have the slightest idea what the rules of navigation were, and he made a point of telling anyone who would listen, that I was a lousy captain and a danger to anyone who went out with me. This past summer I worked for that boat, met the captain, the same one who almost ran me down. He is a 75 year old coot who disobeys rules like a fat woman eats ice cream. HE told me I was in the wrong, should have gotten out of his way, and should learn the rules about who has right-of-way. (On July 4, he ran over an anchor rode of a new SeaRay. The rode wrapped around the prop sucking the boat into us. Our Captain called the Coast Guard to report that we had been rammed by a boater. And he stuck to the story in his report to the CG insisting he had the right-of-way and that the other boater had no right to anchor where he did. Apparently the other 400 or so boaters anchored in the same area to watch the fireworks were in the wrong spot too.) I suppose it depends on your perspective, but I think I was in the right both times.
Microcosm of the rest of the world
I've experienced both, though I have seen my share of nutso sailors who are beyond the pale when it comes to their boats and their guest crews. A sailing couple with whom I no longer sail made a fine art of calling each other 'snookums', 'sweetie', 'honey pie', but spoken with such venom ("I meant the MAINsheet, DARLING...") that we knew if they didn't have an audience, they would've been using very different "terms of endearment" with eachother! Captains need to maintain safety above all, but that DOES leave room for relaxation and enjoyment of/with guest crew. It's supposed to be FUN!! Don't treat guests like morons - if you invite non-sailing-savvy folks over, make sure nobody falls in, you don't hit another boat or the ground, and have a good time! But worst by far has to be across boats - esp of course between motorboats and us blameless sailors! Why does sea rage seem worse than road rage? Maybe it's due to the slower speeds - you're in near the other bozo for longer than on the highway (at least the way I drive...) We're doing this for the fun of it, right??
I've experienced both, though I have seen my share of nutso sailors who are beyond the pale when it comes to their boats and their guest crews. A sailing couple with whom I no longer sail made a fine art of calling each other 'snookums', 'sweetie', 'honey pie', but spoken with such venom ("I meant the MAINsheet, DARLING...") that we knew if they didn't have an audience, they would've been using very different "terms of endearment" with eachother! Captains need to maintain safety above all, but that DOES leave room for relaxation and enjoyment of/with guest crew. It's supposed to be FUN!! Don't treat guests like morons - if you invite non-sailing-savvy folks over, make sure nobody falls in, you don't hit another boat or the ground, and have a good time! But worst by far has to be across boats - esp of course between motorboats and us blameless sailors! Why does sea rage seem worse than road rage? Maybe it's due to the slower speeds - you're in near the other bozo for longer than on the highway (at least the way I drive...) We're doing this for the fun of it, right??
If this had happened to me...
If I was with a friend who didn’t know how to dock, I would never get to the point of yelling at him. After all, it is his boat. If he was arrogant enough to think he knew all about boating, I doubt if he would listen to anyone. The best thing to do would be to let him make his own mistakes. Sometimes the best teacher is their own mistakes. If he didn’t know how to anchor, well, let him drag a few times. He will eventually learn. Just hope he doesn’t do too much damage, to himself and others, while learning. As for the 75 years old captain, I assume you didn’t mean he was a certified captain, but you really meant he was the owner of the boat. If he was really a captain, like he has his 6-packs, then report him to the coast guard. However, on second thought, since it was a dinner boat, hmmmm………. Best have enough photos and witnesses. Sometimes, it is just not worth the effort to argue with someone. They already have their minds made up, and they are not going to listen to any body. Arguing with them just makes everything worse. The best thing to do is just stop going out with them. Often, that is exactly how road rage gets started. Fair winds.
If I was with a friend who didn’t know how to dock, I would never get to the point of yelling at him. After all, it is his boat. If he was arrogant enough to think he knew all about boating, I doubt if he would listen to anyone. The best thing to do would be to let him make his own mistakes. Sometimes the best teacher is their own mistakes. If he didn’t know how to anchor, well, let him drag a few times. He will eventually learn. Just hope he doesn’t do too much damage, to himself and others, while learning. As for the 75 years old captain, I assume you didn’t mean he was a certified captain, but you really meant he was the owner of the boat. If he was really a captain, like he has his 6-packs, then report him to the coast guard. However, on second thought, since it was a dinner boat, hmmmm………. Best have enough photos and witnesses. Sometimes, it is just not worth the effort to argue with someone. They already have their minds made up, and they are not going to listen to any body. Arguing with them just makes everything worse. The best thing to do is just stop going out with them. Often, that is exactly how road rage gets started. Fair winds.
We've had our issues on Lake Erie, and
ususally it involves some fishing charter yahoo who has "issues" with sailboats (note: not ALL charter guys are this way...some actually know what they are doing). I have noticed, however, that some of these guys are not just a little reckless, but a bit touched in the head. One guy cut me off at the entrance to our marina, and endangered my guests (including my 9 year old niece), plus the guests of the two boats exiting the marine. Long story short...we yelled and gestured while the idiots on the boat sucked their beer down and smiled. We took down the reg numbers and were prepared to call the CG or Sheriff, then a thought came to us...if these guys are this nuts, and they know who the complaint came from...what would they do to our boat when we were away? That's really what this response is all about.
ususally it involves some fishing charter yahoo who has "issues" with sailboats (note: not ALL charter guys are this way...some actually know what they are doing). I have noticed, however, that some of these guys are not just a little reckless, but a bit touched in the head. One guy cut me off at the entrance to our marina, and endangered my guests (including my 9 year old niece), plus the guests of the two boats exiting the marine. Long story short...we yelled and gestured while the idiots on the boat sucked their beer down and smiled. We took down the reg numbers and were prepared to call the CG or Sheriff, then a thought came to us...if these guys are this nuts, and they know who the complaint came from...what would they do to our boat when we were away? That's really what this response is all about.
2nd tereza ...
Someone I studied in college far too long ago said that one of the signs of a decaying society was a loss of basic grace and courtesy. All the stuff I experience on my sailboat I also experience in the woods hiking, on the rivers canoeing, in the store shopping, in the camppground camping, etc. Used to get bent about it. Now, I just do my best to give everyone room, and try to keep my blood pressure down when that doesn't work. When I get angry at an inconsiderate (or worse) boater and blow my top, it doesn't change them. They just hoist another beer, and the original poster noted. For me, the anger ruins the reason I'm out there. So they win, if I let them. My advice ... keep a close weather eye and don't let them ruin your day. Tom Monroe Carlyle Lake
Someone I studied in college far too long ago said that one of the signs of a decaying society was a loss of basic grace and courtesy. All the stuff I experience on my sailboat I also experience in the woods hiking, on the rivers canoeing, in the store shopping, in the camppground camping, etc. Used to get bent about it. Now, I just do my best to give everyone room, and try to keep my blood pressure down when that doesn't work. When I get angry at an inconsiderate (or worse) boater and blow my top, it doesn't change them. They just hoist another beer, and the original poster noted. For me, the anger ruins the reason I'm out there. So they win, if I let them. My advice ... keep a close weather eye and don't let them ruin your day. Tom Monroe Carlyle Lake
Yep, Good advice.
It's the alcohol though, not society in general. I can't remember the last rude person that I've conversed with. But I avoid alcohol related situations with people I don't know. Had to do it too many times in police work.
It's the alcohol though, not society in general. I can't remember the last rude person that I've conversed with. But I avoid alcohol related situations with people I don't know. Had to do it too many times in police work.
Peace and quiet
Fred, Tereza, and others are all correct. Mean, obnoxious people can be the nastiest of drunks, as Fred's experience tells. At least most don't have ready access to weapons (Fred: 560th MP, RVN Class of '67, School of Hard Knocks). I go sailing for the peace and quiet it brings as a relief from the intensity of the corporate world. Loud, rude people are avoided like the plague, especially when I don't have to work with them. Drunken ones I flee from. Life's too short, sailings too important to waste time on riff-raff! S/V Intrepid '83 H34 #113
Fred, Tereza, and others are all correct. Mean, obnoxious people can be the nastiest of drunks, as Fred's experience tells. At least most don't have ready access to weapons (Fred: 560th MP, RVN Class of '67, School of Hard Knocks). I go sailing for the peace and quiet it brings as a relief from the intensity of the corporate world. Loud, rude people are avoided like the plague, especially when I don't have to work with them. Drunken ones I flee from. Life's too short, sailings too important to waste time on riff-raff! S/V Intrepid '83 H34 #113
Comon courtesey
Common courtesey seems to be a lost art. I believe that a majority of these people that cause the problem just don't know any better. I believe that as children they were either not taught to be polite or had no one to teach them and never learned otherwise. Wether its on land or sea, they go about there business completely oblivious to anyone else, after all, nobody matters except them. Remember, "ignorance can be fixed, stupid is forever". Those that think they know it all really piss off those of us that do! Safe boating to all
Common courtesey seems to be a lost art. I believe that a majority of these people that cause the problem just don't know any better. I believe that as children they were either not taught to be polite or had no one to teach them and never learned otherwise. Wether its on land or sea, they go about there business completely oblivious to anyone else, after all, nobody matters except them. Remember, "ignorance can be fixed, stupid is forever". Those that think they know it all really piss off those of us that do! Safe boating to all
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