Apparent wind and my A-Ha! moment

[Todd Smith]

I do, but I'm not making the connection.

The question might come from your description of how you are sailing to windward. You talked about using the mast head wind vane to set your course. This is not how to best sail to windward. You do that by sailing to your jib tell tales with the jib trimmed for close hauled.

 

[COOL]

You can also hit that true wind button on the wind instrument.

Not very likely on an ODay22.

 

[Bill Roosa]

I can't believe it

A 22' Oday sailboat with out an electronic wind and GPS!!!!!
What is the world coming to. How do you know which way the wind is blowing???
You know that faster boats can point higher in lesser winds right?
And longer (aka bigger) boats are faster right?
makes a case for buying a bigger boat.

 

[kpgraci]

The question might come from your description of how you are sailing to windward. You talked about using the mast head wind vane to set your course. This is not how to best sail to windward. You do that by sailing to your jib tell tales with the jib trimmed for close hauled.

Yes, I can see how that would be better. My goal on the next trip is 90* tacks.

...and no, I have a chartplotter on my laptop, but no fancy buttons to push. I'm trying truing to learn how to sail, I sure don't need to have to memorize a 200 page GPS manual.

 

[Joe]

You can also hit that true wind button on the wind instrument.

I thought he was using a windvane... or windex.. not an electronic wind instrument.

KP when sailing close hauled... cleat the sheets and steer by the tell tales. When sailing a compass course adjust you sheets to the tell tales while steering the course. The windex can help you with lifts and headers... but it's better to keep your eyes ahead, on the lower set of telltales.

 

[henkmeuzelaar]

making a COG test tack

......... I’ve always assumed I could therefore tack 90 degrees to hit a mark, but in reality, according to the GPS track, time and time again it’s more like 100-110-120 degrees or worse.

........ On more than one occasion I've waited for the harbor to be 90* abeam to tack only to find I could not steer to the point I wanted, requiring additional tacks.

Don't feel too bad about that. Even after decades of sailing I regularly missed the optimum tacking point, especially when having battled high waves and winds for many hours and finally managing to lay the harbor entrance abeam. Under these conditions, it is easy to become over-eager to tack into the protection of the harbor (only ending up having to choose between getting darn close to the ubiquitous fringing reefs or turning tail).

Altough it may sound pretty straightforward to calculate where to tack, as longs as one knows one's vessel well enough and can make the necessary corrections for set and drift, the reality is often a bit different. Squally conditions, together with the unpredictable currents and waves close to many harbor entrances, have a way of making a mockery of even the most elaborate plots and calculations.....

For that reason, we always used our GPS's COG (course over ground) track , whether from the previous tacks en-route or from a special short test tack, to show us where exactly to make our final tack into the harbor and what to expect once we did.

In highly complex situations, I have always trusted hard-won empirical evidence over soft models and calculations.

Fair winds,

Flying Dutchman

 

[All U Get]

So does this sound right or do I need to go back to high school?

I agree with all these posts. The dynamics of wind, wave, current and boat style make it different for each of us. I looked at your pictures and have to ask if the sails are getting tired? I have to trim mine tight and they still don't let me point that well in light air. I also have a friend that trailers a 22 footer. Everytime he steps his mast it is leaning forward causing some trouble coming about. He's happy so I don't say anything.
All U Get

 

[COOL]

I also have a friend that trailers a 22 footer. Everytime he steps his mast it is leaning forward causing some trouble coming about.

That is a good point to bring up. Even incrementally small
adjustments in forestay length can have a dramatic effect
on helm balance and pointing ability. If the boat has
Lee Helm it will be very difficult to keep it 'on the wind'.

 

[Alan]

Lee helm caused by too little mast rake is a serious issue. It can be down right dangerous. You owe it to your friend to let him know the peril he is putting his boat in. Explain that a correct mast rake of 1% or 2% will give him a small weather helm which is the most desirable thing. Once the desired mast rake is found the headstay length should not be changed.

 

[LloydB]

as I may misunderstand it : you are sailing windward 45* from true direct upwind,say a starboard close reach(right terminolgy?) Then you make a port tack and the best port windward reach is ~110* from the previous tack angle(which would give you a 65* to port reach from direct upwind). Or do you mean when on a 45* starboard close reach that the tack goes well past a 90* tack angle before you can bring it back to a 45* port close reach,track? you also talk about GPS track and an apparent wind calculator. I've always thought to sail to highest point then look to 90* off beam to get next tack aim direction, then tack and sail to highest point to wind on new tack. is that your same plan? (newest aim point now forgotten)

 

[kpgraci]

as I may misunderstand it : you are sailing windward 45* from true direct upwind,say a starboard close reach(right terminolgy?) Then you make a port tack and the best port windward reach is ~110* from the previous tack angle(which would give you a 65* to port reach from direct upwind).

Yes. My problem seems to have come from the fact that I was using the windex to steer on a close haul, so as I speed up the apparent wind changes and I follow it around, changing my heading - as I'm not ever too worried about actual compass heading. This technique resulted in larger tack angles than I expected - again in a relative sense while at speed and changing COG to accommodate the windex.

I think I've got if figured out now and will try using the telltales next time out. (this weekend?) That makes a lot of sense to me, the sail is the thing, after all.

As far as tired sails - you bet. As far as I can tell they are original equipment (that's 37 years old!) but alas, I must recover from the xmas bills before I can fork out $1000+ for new sails.

Thanks for all the input.

 

[SailingCal21]

KP, enjoy the sail while we in the northern climes dream of warmer days.