anchor testing info

sailingandsuch · Jan 31, 2013

Oh cmon! We want the results! lol

I hope you don't tell me that my expensive little anchor is the bad one in the bunch.

I wouldn't say that EVERY time the boat will be at 90' pulling on the anchor before it gets to 180'. When I was in the Keys the tide would change 180' in the night and sometimes the weather would be calm and the wind wouldn't push my boat to a 90' position from the anchor because my 30' of chain on my 17'er sailboat holds pretty good. Although once the opposite tide gets kicking in the 180' direction then it would pull at 180' before it ever did 90'.

The tide coming around the keys where you typically anchor can get pretty darn swooft.... I was shocked when I would hop into the kayak at the speed it was going, also when you would see seaweed and such float by quickly.

Just my thoughts.

Please don't tell me my Rocna was the bad apple! (just kidding)

thinwater · Jan 31, 2013

jibes138 said:
practical sailor did a test of anchor veering in their current edition. very interesting but I'm wondering if others that read it have any comments related to the test. They did a 90 degree pull out and reset test and a 180 degree pullout and reset test. It seems like to get to 180 degrees the boat would first go through a 90 degree anyway?? It is hard for me to envision a situation where the boat would suddenly be 180 degrees opposed yanking on the anchor and making it pull out and flip over as the test describes? A couple of our highly rated and widely used modern design anchors (I won't mention names) were not recommended as a result of this test. I was very surprised to say the least. It didn't say they were not good anchors just that other anchors were more highly recommended. Anybody else read this and any thoughts?

180 flip? Certainly, behind any barrier island where the tide reverses hard. Been there many times. I have seen a Danforth being pulled 180 from the set, still staying burried. Scary looking, though. In the same locations my Manson and Delta both rotated. In reality, even in a tide flip, the change takes 15 minute and it was sand generally.

Also, the tester made it clear that most handled 150 degree vear well. A perfect 180 would require just the right combination of events.

Come up loaded with clay/mud, unable to reset? Yes, I've seen my Manson do just that. I keep a scraper on the bow just to get the stuff off. My Delta always came up clean. I think I still prefer the Manson because it better in soft mud and some hard bottoms, but the comparison does narrow the gap.

Anchor testing is a bugger, because bottoms vary so much and because size matters. I look at them as food for thought, never as definative.

Gunni · Jan 31, 2013

180 swings are common when you are in a tidal channel, especially if the tidal range is large. You also see it in exposed bluewater anchorages where the wind shifts at night.

The modern design anchors did fine in the tests, some of them just did better and the difference was bottom conditions. They did put a stake in the heart of our trusty CQR, now known as The Lunch Hook. And that fisherman's anchor? ...makes a good lawn ornament at the yacht club.

One of the things they did not address was anchor weight - a significant factor in anchor set. I would like to see the same test done with anchors of various weights

Maine Sail · Jan 31, 2013

This is a very typical cookie trail of anchoring here in Maine. As you can see the wind started at about 180 degrees from where we were in the screen shot and was at 20-25 knots. It then tapered over night as we moved around 360 degrees. About 4:00 am the wind piped up from the opposite direction of the set and again blew 20+ knots.

We do get 180's very often. Are they as quick or abrupt as they tested them? Usually not and one reason why anchor tests do not always emulate the real world..

Flip flops do & can happen. Flip flops can be caused by the anchor remaining deeply set in the opposite direction. When the wind pipes up enough, in the new direction, the anchor either rotates in the bottom to the new orientation or flips and resets. In order to do this as fast as teh testers did you need an abrupt front to move in. It can happen though is pretty rare. Some anchors do not do well with re-setting or un-set quite easily. The CQR is rather notorious for this.

Years ago we nearly lost our boat on the rocks to what I can only assume was a flip-flop of our Fortress. In the early morning a very strong high pressure front moved in with alarming speed. I was up to take a leak when something did not feel right. Instinctively I dove for the engine switch and got us off the lee with inches to spare. The Fortress had held us for two days in winds gusting to 40 knots from the opposite direction but when finally put to the test, from the opposite direction, was when she popped out never re-set... We moved over 1/8 mile and still the anchor never re-set..

I read the test and was not surprised. All the new gen anchors pretty much re-set quickly. They all got a "Very Good" rating for holding while the old gens only got "good" or poor in the case of the Fisherman style...

The test however was not very realistic and they even admit that. Still the new gens performed quite well. Most times the anchor will rotate slowly as the tide, current or wind change directions. In a few instances you can create a scenario for a flip flop and the new gens have this base covered.

Being that I own all the tested anchors except for the Ultra and Sarca, I still know which anchor I choose. I do my own rather exhaustive and punishing personal testing, which is in slight contrast with the PS tests.

Interestingly enough the two "recommended" anchors are;

1- The most expensive anchor you can buy, the Ultra at $1600.00 for a 35 pound anchor.

2- An anchor not commercially available in the US, the Sarca Excel...

The anchor that took "best choice" is one I actually own two of, the Spade, only I consider them a "second choice".....

I have lots of choices.....

Ray Bowles · Jan 31, 2013

Gunni said it best, weight is a very big hitter in keeping an anchor planted. We had both a 45# CQR and a 45 # Bruce type anchors. Both rode on the end of 3/8" chain. In the 2 1/2 years of sailing the Gulf, Keys and Bahamas we experenced many violent air burst storm downdrafts that moved the boat in swings of 90, 120 and 180 degrees and our anchor system never pulled. I always had a scope of at least 7-1 and sometimes 10-1 if expecting a storm. Our scope was from the anchor roller to the sea floor.
After one bad storm where the 2 boats next to us dragged anchor I dove on ours and found that it had moved approx 70 feet of chain our of 100 feet. A very good example of how weight helps. A sentinel or kedge will improve the holding of an anchor where a line rode is used with a limited amount of chain.

Chris Patterson · Jan 31, 2013

It was a very interesting article. But what exactly are they referring to a "fishing anchor"? The "Danforth" type?

(BTW, I'm one of the paranoid people that keeps about 5 anchors, and their associated rodes on the boat. When in doubt, and I've GOT to sleep, everything goes out)..

Maine Sail · Jan 31, 2013

Chris Patterson said:
It was a very interesting article. But what exactly are they referring to a "fishing anchor"? The "Danforth" type?

Chris Patterson · Jan 31, 2013

Oh my Lord. No, I can't say I've got one of those. I DO however keep a "smallish" fluke on the stern rail, just a lunch hook. But even then, there's ALWAYS somebody left on the boat, I'd never leave it uninhabited with that silly thing out.

And while I'm thinking on it, DO those fishing anchors hold ok? I've got zero experience with that.

And sticking with the post, if I stop in the Cape Fear for anything, the wind and tides more often than not seems apposing, so I'll set one fore and aft, so dragging it around 180 don't happen.

David in Sandusky · Jan 31, 2013

Tides and fronts

180's were twice a day in the ties of the San Juans. In the Great Lakes, the come with the sometimes fierce wind shifts associated with the passage of a front.

Our most spectacular 180 was a case where thin mud on a rocky bottom precluded a reset in a shift from 20 knots SW to 35 knots from the NE at an anchorage in the North Channel. We went about 100 feet before the anchor reset. But all is well that ends well!

Charlie Jones s/v Tehani · Feb 1, 2013

At anchor on one occasion, when a squall moved through from astern. We were instantly blown straight over the anchor and it popped out as the boat hit the end of the rode. Then the Bruce reset within 20 feet.

So yeah, very, very fast 180 degree shifts can occur.

Solstice · Feb 1, 2013

I thought they did a nice job with this review. They did point out the weight factor and stated that when they test larger anchors later this year, they will also be testing their theory that the anchors should extrapolate to the larger versions. They were upfront about the fact that the speed of the swing doesn't necessarily reflect reality, and tried to use the catamaran to account for this. They also pointed out that the cqr's and Bruce anchors tend to do better when oversized.
My biggest take away was the issue with mud in the the crown of the Manson Supreme. I can attest to it's incredible holding power, but it does bring half of the bottom up with it. It can be very challenging to get it unstuck.
Bottom line is I think they were fair in pointing out that anchor tests are very hard to do, and our own experiences are the real test.

Hello Below · Feb 1, 2013

I found this to be a fairly helpful test review when I replaced the stock anchor that came with my new boat.

http://www.mysailing.com.au/news/testing-the-new-generation-of-anchors

Also if you go to the Mansion site there are a number of pdf files for independent tests of anchors including the Mansion Supreme. Given it's their website it is not surprising that the Supreme did fairly well in the tests; however, they normally did not come 1st.

Select an anchor, or two, that will best meets the need for your boat and for the bottom that you will be anchoring in.

Gunni · Feb 1, 2013

Chris Patterson said:
It was a very interesting article. But what exactly are they referring to a "fishing anchor"? The "Danforth" type?

Fisherman's anchor, properly deployed...on the lawn.

Charlie Jones s/v Tehani · Feb 1, 2013

jibes138 said:
You have to wonder why Lewmar makes a 2.2 pound claw anchor. Maybe for a kayak? Otherwise it might be a good paperweight or keychain :>).

I used one quite successfully as a dinghy anchor, all along the coast. Mainly as a hold off, off the stern, when the dink was tied to a dock.

Chris Patterson · Feb 1, 2013

TSBB 2 said:
I used one quite successfully as a dinghy anchor, all along the coast. Mainly as a hold off, off the stern, when the dink was tied to a dock.

Was it as big as that one above? Helluva dink. The mother ship must be HUGE!

Crazy Dave Condon · Feb 2, 2013

T;here is an old saying I learned when I was new in the marine environment many years ago. For the best advice, seek out the "old salty seadogs" in the area where you are at and ask for their advice versus the "weekend warriors" which proved to be a tremendous statement in my early years. Here is an example.

North Carolina sometimes takes the brunt of hurricanes besides Florida. Early on I asked one of those"old salty seadogs" from the area as I had boats to be moved out of harms way as the docks were not floating plus the big cove had so many boats moored out that many would get away during the storm. Here is what I was taught.
1. What is the best anchoring hole to go to?
2. Purchase heavy duty line for two lines at least 150 feet long for each line, two heavy anchors more than what is called for, 50 feet of chain for two lines or a total of 100 feet of chain and chafe gear.
3. Go to the hurricane hole, throw out the anchor to the east and dig it in by backing up the boat with the engine at full throttle. When done, throw it to the south and back up again as well using the two heavy anchors dug in. Make sure the circle that the boat will swing in will not hit any other boats. Use chafe protection on the line coming over the boat which is very important.
4. When the boat is out of harms way, take the two anchors, line and chain with chafe gear, clean it up and store it away for the next storm.

I never lost a boat moored out in the middle of the Pamlico River at Blunt's Bay near Washington, NC. IF a soft sand bottom, use the appropiate anchor with more weight. Weight of an anchor during a storm is very important. In fact, I have ridden out a hurrican or two on board which I set for storms. Just be careful as the rain is like ice hitting you and keep a hand held vhf radio with weather, sharp pocket knife with bolen spike, flashlight, etc. with you.

Thought you would like to know.

crazy dave condon

Ken Cross · Feb 2, 2013

2.2 lb Lewmar

You have to wonder why Lewmar makes a 2.2 pound claw anchor. Maybe for a kayak? Otherwise it might be a good paperweight or keychain :>).

I have one for my float tube (belly Boat) It will also work for fishing from a small boat on a calm lake. It's tiny and easy to pack.

Bill Roosa · Feb 2, 2013

I have 2. Use them to stop Bardi Sea sailing on anchor. The 40.5 has massive problems with sailing on its anchor. just throw one over the stern when she reaches the extreme port swing and pay out the line, throw out the other when on the starboard extreme of the swing the even up the rodes so the windex is pointing forward.