Anchor Questions

Rich Stidger · May 13, 2012

Brian,

I have a 40.5 with a 45# Manson Supreme with all 5/16 G4 chain. I used the anchor last year for the first year and I am very impressed with the performance.

A friend at my marina has a 44 and just bought a 60# Manson Supreme and he has all chain- I think it is the same G4 5/16 for his windlass. I think his previous anchor was a 45# Delta.

I think your only potential problem is to make sure that the MS anchor fits well on your bow roller and is secure in a seaway. My friend had to drill a 1/2 hole in the anchor to accept a locking pin.

Stu Jackson · May 13, 2012

Here's an anchor SYSTEM sizing table:

http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,4990.msg30400.html#msg30400

As Rich said, you need to size your chain for your windlass, as well as making sure the chain is adequate for your boat in the conditions you intend to experience. Oversizing the system or any component of it makes little sense.

A friend also wrote this: "The Rocna. All 20kg of it with 100ft of chain. The rest of the world can debate all they like. When I pull into a place like Bodega Bay at midnight and the fog is so thick I can't see the jetty 50 feet away to make an entrance, I drop my hook in the rolling ocean swells with the surf crashing (Foster says it's like staying in a cheap Best Western beside the highway), and I sleep. And in the morning I have a windlass to pull the beast up and I wouldn't trade it for anything. (I also wouldn't add more chain - this works perfectly in 25 to 30 feet of water - you let all the chain out and you tie off nylon at the preferred scope and don't bother with snubbers and chain hooks and all that stuff...) This was our best upgrade.

This was for a Catalina 34, but the concept and ideas do apply, especially for all chain rode for you to consider.

Don Lucas · May 14, 2012

I have a 60# MS and all 5/16" chain on my 410. Fits on the roller OK but you need to tie it down after to let up the windlass tension. I do have to give it some help to make the turn from vertical to coming up onto the roller.

Scott B · May 14, 2012

Further to Stu's comments, IMHO ( and this is my opinion only ), once you get past a certain wind speed all that is holding you in place is the surface of the anchor. We've experienced gusts up to 52 knots and at that point the anchor rode was full out and pulling directly on the anchor. ( Rocna & 50 ft. chain and did not budge )

Upsizing the anchor will give you a little more surface area, but the additional weight and additional weight of chain will not hold you in place any better.

Nodak7 · May 14, 2012

Scott B said:
Further to Stu's comments, IMHO ( and this is my opinion only ), once you get past a certain wind speed all that is holding you in place is the surface of the anchor. We've experienced gusts up to 52 knots and at that point the anchor rode was full out and pulling directly on the anchor. ( Rocna & 50 ft. chain and did not budge )

Upsizing the anchor will give you a little more surface area, but the additional weight and additional weight of chain will not hold you in place any better.

Scott, I would think that the additional weight of the chain up forward would not help the performance of the boat would it? Or does that not make any difference? I upgraded our anchor to a 44# Bullwaga and added an additional 20' of 5/16" chain since this boat has so much windage.

Scott B · May 14, 2012

Nodak7 said:
Scott, I would think that the additional weight of the chain up forward would not help the performance of the boat would it? Or does that not make any difference? I upgraded our anchor to a 44# Bullwaga and added an additional 20' of 5/16" chain since this boat has so much windage.

That could also be true. At a pound per foot, you would quickly add a lot of weight on the nose with more chain.

Mind you with 50 gallons of water in the vee birth, 25 gals. of deisel aft, a half-full holding tank, cooler full of beer and ice, fridge and cupboards full of groceries, gear stuffed everywhere, I wouldn't want extra weight if I could help.......

Monty VM · May 14, 2012

so this is just what I do. It may or may not be right. I have a 430. I had a 44# delta and a 50# bruce. The delta was stolen and I replaced it with a 60# CQR. I liked the delta but it felt undersized at times. The CQR shaft is big enough that it doesn't come all the way to the base of the flukes on the roller. but it fits in very snugly. I have always tied the anchors off with rope on a passage. only one side of my roller has a place for a pin but it was low enough that it wouldn't pin any anchor i have had on board. I use 30 feet of chain and 300 feet of rope. This set up feels sturdy. I have never noticed an adverse weight effect and much prefer to have a little more anchor than a little less.

Don Lucas · May 14, 2012

Nodak7 said:
Scott, I would think that the additional weight of the chain up forward would not help the performance of the boat would it? Or does that not make any difference? I upgraded our anchor to a 44# Bullwaga and added an additional 20' of 5/16" chain since this boat has so much windage.

I have 350' of 5/16" G4 chain and a 60# Manson Surpreme and haven't noticed any change in performance. Was doing upper 7 knots the other day with a reef in the main at 15-20 knots wind. I think the weight in the bow made it sit around 1" lower which is still 6" from the design waterline (and once my fat ass in in the cockpit the bow just goes back up

).

The decision to upgrade anchor and chain length is not about performance anyway its' about sleeping!

captron · May 14, 2012

Manson & 40.5

Hey Rich,

Quick question, I have just purchased a Manson Supreme 45 lb. and plan on mounting it this weekend, but in looking at the current set up I'm concerned that there may not be enough clearance from the roller thru/ under the bail, meaning will the thickness of the shank, clear ok?, or did you have to change the roller or modify the bail?

Thanks much,
Capt. Ron

Rich Stidger said:
Brian,

I have a 40.5 with a 45# Manson Supreme with all 5/16 G4 chain. I used the anchor last year for the first year and I am very impressed with the performance.

A friend at my marina has a 44 and just bought a 60# Manson Supreme and he has all chain- I think it is the same G4 5/16 for his windlass. I think his previous anchor was a 45# Delta.

I think your only potential problem is to make sure that the MS anchor fits well on your bow roller and is secure in a seaway. My friend had to drill a 1/2 hole in the anchor to accept a locking pin.

seadaddler · May 15, 2012

WM

Go to WM and cut a sample link of chain to match to what you have.
Nick

Rich Stidger · May 15, 2012

captron said:
Hey Rich,

Quick question, I have just purchased a Manson Supreme 45 lb. and plan on mounting it this weekend, but in looking at the current set up I'm concerned that there may not be enough clearance from the roller thru/ under the bail, meaning will the thickness of the shank, clear ok?, or did you have to change the roller or modify the bail?

Thanks much,
Capt. Ron

Your concern is valid. The MS45 will not fit nicely on the original h40.5 anchor roller. The shank does in fact hit the underside of the bail and the end of the stock does not reach the roller at the back of the anchor roller.

What I did was to move the back roller toward the front so that the shank will sit on the roller. I drilled the anchor roller with some difficulty. My final solution was to have the shank contact the underside of the bail and also rest on top of the rear roller that I moved forward.

Initially I wasn't happy with the fit, but after using it for a year I find that it works fine. With the anchor contacting the bail, it cannot jump around in a seaway and I pull the anchor back with a line spliced to a hook in the anchor slot. I tie this line to the cleat in the locker.

I can measure the new roller location precisely and post it for you if you like.

Don Lucas · May 16, 2012

BWagner said:
I have measured the chain to determine what size it is and I still can't determine what size it is, I guess I need calipers to do it right. Does anyone know how I can determine what model gypsy I have? I have looked at it with the chain in it and I don't see any markings. According to the SL manual on the windlass, the chain size will depend on which gypsy I have.

I don't want top order up 300 plus pounds of chain only to have to return it. Anybody got any ideas?

I doesn't really matter what chain it is, what you need is the gypsy number so you can look up which sizes it works with (like you said) You have to take the windlass apart to find, which is a good time to do your yearly cleaning and greasing of the unit. It isnt hard and I would guess you have never done it based on your post, which means you are past due.

Rich Stidger · May 16, 2012

Captron,

I measured the position of the rear roller for you. It is located 11.75" from the back of the rear bail and 3/4" down from the top edge.

captron · May 16, 2012

Anchor fit

Rich,

Thanks much for the info, suspicions confirmed, I assume you drilled out the roller on the smaller roller to accomodate the larger bolt??, the roller on the stb'd side is the same width but is deeper, so I'm going to try switching rollers and see what kind of clearance I get with the Mason, I also thought about getting a SS welder to come to the boat and modify the bail so the shank on the Manson would clear, thank you for the pictures that helps should I go with your solution

Rich Stidger said:
Your concern is valid. The MS45 will not fit nicely on the original h40.5 anchor roller. The shank does in fact hit the underside of the bail and the end of the stock does not reach the roller at the back of the anchor roller.

What I did was to move the back roller toward the front so that the shank will sit on the roller. I drilled the anchor roller with some difficulty. My final solution was to have the shank contact the underside of the bail and also rest on top of the rear roller that I moved forward.

Initially I wasn't happy with the fit, but after using it for a year I find that it works fine. With the anchor contacting the bail, it cannot jump around in a seaway and I pull the anchor back with a line spliced to a hook in the anchor slot. I tie this line to the cleat in the locker.

I can measure the new roller location precisely and post it for you if you like.

Rich Stidger · May 16, 2012

The rear roller uses a 3/8" pin and the front roller uses a 3/4" pin. I think I just drilled a 3/8" hole to move the rear roller forward.

Please let me know if switching the port and stbd rollers is beneficial.

captron · May 17, 2012

Anchor fit

Ok, hope to see if it works this weekend, will let you know, and thanks for the measurements,

Ron

Rich Stidger said:
The rear roller uses a 3/8" pin and the front roller uses a 3/4" pin. I think I just drilled a 3/8" hole to move the rear roller forward.

Please let me know if switching the port and stbd rollers is beneficial.

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