I hope this in not a stupid question. When you set your anchor-lets say winds out of the north to north east. During the middle of the night winds shift to south south west. Does the anchor hold or does it drag? Thanks Dan M
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Anchor Help - a little bit, maybe.
Personally I have not had a lot of experience on the hook. But it would seem right to me that the anchor would release and them reset if it was suddenly pulled 180 degrees off the direction it was originally set. I think the bottom conditions would be the biggest factor on how the anchor would react. Dan H. aka - wrenchbender Homer NY S/V garinion Hunter 240
Personally I have not had a lot of experience on the hook. But it would seem right to me that the anchor would release and them reset if it was suddenly pulled 180 degrees off the direction it was originally set. I think the bottom conditions would be the biggest factor on how the anchor would react. Dan H. aka - wrenchbender Homer NY S/V garinion Hunter 240
It all depends on the type of anchor
If it's a Danforth, it may not, because of its design. The CQRs and plows and Bruces are designed to reset. There's lots of Anchoring books and website information, plus the ubiquitous West Marine Advisors, please do some more reading on the subject which has been thoroughly covered by many writers. Not a stupid question at all, good on you for asking.
If it's a Danforth, it may not, because of its design. The CQRs and plows and Bruces are designed to reset. There's lots of Anchoring books and website information, plus the ubiquitous West Marine Advisors, please do some more reading on the subject which has been thoroughly covered by many writers. Not a stupid question at all, good on you for asking.
That brings up the question
I currently use a Danforth on My Catalina 30. I haven't had any holding issues, actually the Danforth holds extremely good where I anchor (mainly soft mud bottoms) I am 1/2 the way considering going to a plow type anchor but I don't know if I will get the holding power out of the plow that I get out of my Danforth on the muddy bottoms. Any thoughts? I have had the wind switch numerous times on me with my danforth and I haven't drug yet (knock on wood). That being said, I have learnt from one of my uncles the value of getting a good set. Getting a good set is everything and I always back down, hard, on the anchor. Last thing that I want is to be woken up by coming unhooked!
I currently use a Danforth on My Catalina 30. I haven't had any holding issues, actually the Danforth holds extremely good where I anchor (mainly soft mud bottoms) I am 1/2 the way considering going to a plow type anchor but I don't know if I will get the holding power out of the plow that I get out of my Danforth on the muddy bottoms. Any thoughts? I have had the wind switch numerous times on me with my danforth and I haven't drug yet (knock on wood). That being said, I have learnt from one of my uncles the value of getting a good set. Getting a good set is everything and I always back down, hard, on the anchor. Last thing that I want is to be woken up by coming unhooked!
Anchoring
I always set two anchors when I overnight it. I set the second one of the same size and type at a 45 degree to the first after I back it down. Never had any problem, even when the wind shifts and doubles in strength. I always anchor some distance off the land unless I am inside a breakwater or harbor. Novelman
I always set two anchors when I overnight it. I set the second one of the same size and type at a 45 degree to the first after I back it down. Never had any problem, even when the wind shifts and doubles in strength. I always anchor some distance off the land unless I am inside a breakwater or harbor. Novelman
it will usually drag
Dan A 180 shift will almost inevitably cause any anchor to drag. The issue is whether or not it will reset and if so, how quickly. Some folks have good luck setting two anchors when the weather prediction calls for it but that can become problemmatic since the same 180 deg shift can often result in the rodes fouling, the result being no anchor holding. Best to listen to the weather/wind prediction if possible and plan accordingly and don't plan on getting an uninterrupted sleep.
Dan A 180 shift will almost inevitably cause any anchor to drag. The issue is whether or not it will reset and if so, how quickly. Some folks have good luck setting two anchors when the weather prediction calls for it but that can become problemmatic since the same 180 deg shift can often result in the rodes fouling, the result being no anchor holding. Best to listen to the weather/wind prediction if possible and plan accordingly and don't plan on getting an uninterrupted sleep.
Scope is the key
Scope is the great equalizer. Use 7:1 for a standard. If you have listened to weather, make it 10:1. When I anchor, I let out rode, then back down on it. After I MANUALLY feel it dig in, then let out a little more, so I can sleep. Never had an issue. Not quite as easy in a crowded harbor. Dave
Scope is the great equalizer. Use 7:1 for a standard. If you have listened to weather, make it 10:1. When I anchor, I let out rode, then back down on it. After I MANUALLY feel it dig in, then let out a little more, so I can sleep. Never had an issue. Not quite as easy in a crowded harbor. Dave
Good Seamanship
Dan, Good Seamanship requires that I get up and see her through the turn of the tide and also if there is a change in the weather conditions. The problem is how to know about a wind direction change. I use a household alarm clock set to wake me at a given time(s). Otherwise, if there is any likelihood of a problem, it means I keep an anchor watch. Tedious, but it saves me causing damage or risking my boat. Tough but there it is!
Dan, Good Seamanship requires that I get up and see her through the turn of the tide and also if there is a change in the weather conditions. The problem is how to know about a wind direction change. I use a household alarm clock set to wake me at a given time(s). Otherwise, if there is any likelihood of a problem, it means I keep an anchor watch. Tedious, but it saves me causing damage or risking my boat. Tough but there it is!
My CQR will set on the fly if the occassion
calls for it. Pay out enough scope and snub the rode and she will dig in. I have lost control of the boat at rare times and dropped the anchor to keep me out of danger. So far it hasn't failed me.
calls for it. Pay out enough scope and snub the rode and she will dig in. I have lost control of the boat at rare times and dropped the anchor to keep me out of danger. So far it hasn't failed me.
Maine Sail
Great review on the Manson Supreme, I too after years of swearing by my Fortress changed to a Bruce after the Fortress did not set right away after a wind shift and I didn't like the way it deployed from the anchor roller after I installed the windlass because of its very light weight. I carry a Fortress and a CQR as spares and the Bruce is my primary and Franklin's Bulwagga looks interesting too
Great review on the Manson Supreme, I too after years of swearing by my Fortress changed to a Bruce after the Fortress did not set right away after a wind shift and I didn't like the way it deployed from the anchor roller after I installed the windlass because of its very light weight. I carry a Fortress and a CQR as spares and the Bruce is my primary and Franklin's Bulwagga looks interesting too
Don't get me wrong the Fortress....
Still has a place on my boat which is more than I can say for the Bruce, CQR or Delta. I'm not trying to slam the CQR, Delta or Bruce as they are all ok anchors. It's just that the Spade's, Manson Supreme's & Rocna's are excellent anchors and after driving a BMW I could never see going back to a Model T. If you know what I mean.. I can't tell you how many CQR's I dove on, over the years, that were basically being used as a cynder block connected to chain. Probably 60% of the CQR anchors I have witnessed on the bottom, in coves or anchorages, have been sitting on their side with about three inches of the tip barely caught in the bottom. I'm not saying CQR's can't be set, they can I used one for 6 years, they just require more skill and patience to set than the newer designs. From my musings over the years I would have to say that close to 50% of boaters both power and sail but mostly power don't even know how to set an anchor or attempt to! I've witnessed at least 50 catastrophic, vactayion ending, draggings leading to serious hull damage over the years and every one still haunts me. Perhps I take anchoring a little to seriously but the cost of an anchor is small compared to a six figure boat... I use my Fortress as a dedicated stern anchor a job for which this anchor is perfect. It's very light, to set out in the dinghy with, and holds like pit bull in one direction. It can be tough to set on a hard bottom due mostly to its weight but I have never not been able to not get it to set after a few tries. The anchors on my boat are a Fortress (stern), Manson Supreme (primary) and Spade S-80 (backup). The CQR collects dust in my shed, the Bruce is on loan to a friend with a power boat and the Delta I seem to have sold with my power boat without realizing it because I can't find it anywhere....
Still has a place on my boat which is more than I can say for the Bruce, CQR or Delta. I'm not trying to slam the CQR, Delta or Bruce as they are all ok anchors. It's just that the Spade's, Manson Supreme's & Rocna's are excellent anchors and after driving a BMW I could never see going back to a Model T. If you know what I mean.. I can't tell you how many CQR's I dove on, over the years, that were basically being used as a cynder block connected to chain. Probably 60% of the CQR anchors I have witnessed on the bottom, in coves or anchorages, have been sitting on their side with about three inches of the tip barely caught in the bottom. I'm not saying CQR's can't be set, they can I used one for 6 years, they just require more skill and patience to set than the newer designs. From my musings over the years I would have to say that close to 50% of boaters both power and sail but mostly power don't even know how to set an anchor or attempt to! I've witnessed at least 50 catastrophic, vactayion ending, draggings leading to serious hull damage over the years and every one still haunts me. Perhps I take anchoring a little to seriously but the cost of an anchor is small compared to a six figure boat... I use my Fortress as a dedicated stern anchor a job for which this anchor is perfect. It's very light, to set out in the dinghy with, and holds like pit bull in one direction. It can be tough to set on a hard bottom due mostly to its weight but I have never not been able to not get it to set after a few tries. The anchors on my boat are a Fortress (stern), Manson Supreme (primary) and Spade S-80 (backup). The CQR collects dust in my shed, the Bruce is on loan to a friend with a power boat and the Delta I seem to have sold with my power boat without realizing it because I can't find it anywhere....
My Fortess is my backup
because of its light weight and is ready to deploy in a split seacond if need be,in the area where we anchor a lot the bottom is very soft mud and silt and at another area its sandy and I found the Fortress not getting a good bite in the silt and mud even with 35 fet of chain on the bottom and sleeping with one eye open in a close anchorage can be restless. I've set my Fortress as a second anchor if weather calls for high winds overnight and I always put up my riding sail on my backstay to keep the boat from moving side to side. I see the price of the Bulwagga and the Manson Supreme are the same price for a 32 ft boat with the Manson Supreme @35 lbs and the Bulwagga @27 lbs and both boast resetting quickly.
because of its light weight and is ready to deploy in a split seacond if need be,in the area where we anchor a lot the bottom is very soft mud and silt and at another area its sandy and I found the Fortress not getting a good bite in the silt and mud even with 35 fet of chain on the bottom and sleeping with one eye open in a close anchorage can be restless. I've set my Fortress as a second anchor if weather calls for high winds overnight and I always put up my riding sail on my backstay to keep the boat from moving side to side. I see the price of the Bulwagga and the Manson Supreme are the same price for a 32 ft boat with the Manson Supreme @35 lbs and the Bulwagga @27 lbs and both boast resetting quickly.
When I looked at the chart
at the Manson site under anchoring it shows a 35lb for a 10M boat,is there a diferent chart for the Manson Supreme cause I agree with you as far as size compared to a spade also I have a 33lb Bruce which is one size large than I need from the chart at the Bruce site,the only reason I have this size Bruce was a great deal on EBay a couple of years ago.
at the Manson site under anchoring it shows a 35lb for a 10M boat,is there a diferent chart for the Manson Supreme cause I agree with you as far as size compared to a spade also I have a 33lb Bruce which is one size large than I need from the chart at the Bruce site,the only reason I have this size Bruce was a great deal on EBay a couple of years ago.
180 pull
is the normal situation here in Puget Sound if you are anchored in a snug inlet or bay. The tidal change will fill the bay and then drain it causing a slow 180 degree switch. How the anchor behaves in this situation is therefore very important--perhaps even more important than how easy it is to set or even straight line holding power. In the tests I have read anchors either tend to break out (Bruce) and reset or they tend to corkscrew into the mud (Danforth and Fortress). Best to really understand the type of bottom you will encounter in your usual cruising grounds and read some anchor tests to see which ones would suit you the best. Also walk around the marina and see what anchors are on the bows of boats similar to yours--talk to the owners. The reprints from Practical Sailor are pretty good. Here is a test that helped me a lot as I live in Puget Sound: http://www.ussailing.org/safety/Anchor/anchor_study.htm#INDEX Most sailors would be well off to carry two different types of anchor; for example a fortress and a plow to be prepared for different bottom types or for double anchoring when the wind is high.
is the normal situation here in Puget Sound if you are anchored in a snug inlet or bay. The tidal change will fill the bay and then drain it causing a slow 180 degree switch. How the anchor behaves in this situation is therefore very important--perhaps even more important than how easy it is to set or even straight line holding power. In the tests I have read anchors either tend to break out (Bruce) and reset or they tend to corkscrew into the mud (Danforth and Fortress). Best to really understand the type of bottom you will encounter in your usual cruising grounds and read some anchor tests to see which ones would suit you the best. Also walk around the marina and see what anchors are on the bows of boats similar to yours--talk to the owners. The reprints from Practical Sailor are pretty good. Here is a test that helped me a lot as I live in Puget Sound: http://www.ussailing.org/safety/Anchor/anchor_study.htm#INDEX Most sailors would be well off to carry two different types of anchor; for example a fortress and a plow to be prepared for different bottom types or for double anchoring when the wind is high.
It depends.
Depends on the anchor, the scope, the bottom, the boat and the strength of the wind among other things. A 180 degree wind shift is a common ocurrence that should be considered when anchoring. Different anchors have different ability to hold and to reset in different types of bottoms. The purpose of chain in a rode is to add weight to try an insure a horizontal pull on the anchor; a large scope (7:1) will also try to insure a horizontal pull causing the anchor to dig in. Under a wind shift the anchor will rotate or release; a poorly dug in anchor will most likely release. Depending on the type of anchor and bottom is the ability to reset that will make the difference between holding or dragging. So to answer your question if you have the proper anchor for the type of bottom that you intend to anchor in and you properly set the anchor with enough chain and rode to provide adequate scope you will most likely hold up to a significant wind shift; on the other hand if your anchor is to small and you don't allow enough scope chances are you will most likely grag. Right equipment and proper technique make the difference.
Depends on the anchor, the scope, the bottom, the boat and the strength of the wind among other things. A 180 degree wind shift is a common ocurrence that should be considered when anchoring. Different anchors have different ability to hold and to reset in different types of bottoms. The purpose of chain in a rode is to add weight to try an insure a horizontal pull on the anchor; a large scope (7:1) will also try to insure a horizontal pull causing the anchor to dig in. Under a wind shift the anchor will rotate or release; a poorly dug in anchor will most likely release. Depending on the type of anchor and bottom is the ability to reset that will make the difference between holding or dragging. So to answer your question if you have the proper anchor for the type of bottom that you intend to anchor in and you properly set the anchor with enough chain and rode to provide adequate scope you will most likely hold up to a significant wind shift; on the other hand if your anchor is to small and you don't allow enough scope chances are you will most likely grag. Right equipment and proper technique make the difference.
Kellet...
Set a kellet and an anchor alarm if you're worried. Also, if the wind is called for to shift 180 degrees overnight- set a second anchor that general direction. Anchors are like opinions, in my opinion. Find one that works in your area and know the bottom before you stick one in. B
Set a kellet and an anchor alarm if you're worried. Also, if the wind is called for to shift 180 degrees overnight- set a second anchor that general direction. Anchors are like opinions, in my opinion. Find one that works in your area and know the bottom before you stick one in. B
CQR
35 yrs of anchoring a Bristol 40 with a 35 lbs. CQR, 8 feet of chain on nylon rode. Cruising from Bermuda to Nova Scotia. Never dragged once...
35 yrs of anchoring a Bristol 40 with a 35 lbs. CQR, 8 feet of chain on nylon rode. Cruising from Bermuda to Nova Scotia. Never dragged once...
Will it drag
Whether or not the anchor will drag with a wind veer depends on if it's set properly in the first place, and certainly what type of anchor you are using. Many anchors are good for only straight-line pulls. This is what you want to happen: www.rocna.com/distributable/rocna_anchors_veer_test.pdf A kellet will not help, neither will scope, etc - the problem isn't getting the anchor to set in the first place, it is trusting that it will reset automatically, perhaps while you're asleep.
Whether or not the anchor will drag with a wind veer depends on if it's set properly in the first place, and certainly what type of anchor you are using. Many anchors are good for only straight-line pulls. This is what you want to happen: www.rocna.com/distributable/rocna_anchors_veer_test.pdf A kellet will not help, neither will scope, etc - the problem isn't getting the anchor to set in the first place, it is trusting that it will reset automatically, perhaps while you're asleep.
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