Amateur Radio

[Rick D]

...no I don't mean idiots on Marine VHF. I'm taking my Teckie exam next week, going for a General later. Looking at my Marine SSB, it doesn't have much use for me in HAM bands. It seems a dual band mobile 50 watt dedicated transceiver would be better. So, what do you guys use for antennas and do you need a tuner for a dual band?

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

I assume you are referring to a dual band VHF/UHF transceiver when you say "mobile 50 watt transceiver"? Don't think there is any such thing as a dual band 50 w HF rig.

If I infer correctly, the type and quality of low loss coax you select is more important than which antenna you use. There is a wide variety of decent antennas from which to select. None will require a tuner.

If I misunderstand and you are talking about an HF rig and antenna, that's another story.

 

[Rick D]

I assume you are referring to a dual band VHF/UHF transceiver when you say "mobile 50 watt transceiver"? Don't think there is any such thing as a dual band 50 w HF rig.

If I infer correctly, the type and quality of low loss coax you select is more important than which antenna you use. There is a wide variety of decent antennas from which to select. None will require a tuner.

If I misunderstand and you are talking about an HF rig and antenna, that's another story.

That Is exactly what I was referring to. Two meter and 440. Coax RG8. I looked but didn't find anything that looked marine. You know like a fiberglass that wouldn't require grounding.

 

[Ken Cross]

I'm not a ham, but I always thought with a decent coupler you should be able to use your rigging for an antenna. In the aviation (HF) radio world we got by with simple notch or slot antennas built into the structure of the tail (10 feet or so long) and could talk around the globe if conditions were right. Having said that it would also require installing insulators to keep the high voltage rf off the standing rigging.

It seems like a fun project anyway.
Ken

 

[windward54]

Rick, on the boat I just use a handheld. I tie the radio to a dual band mag mount antenna (no tuner needed) which I place on a pie pan. The pan makes for a level mount that I can move around the boat until I find a good spot and the pan also gives me the counterpoise needed. I had my handheld modified with a free range modification so I could use it on the marine band in an emergency. Marine VHF is right next to the 2 meter band.

Most repeaters in this area can be hit with a handheld.

 

[MrUnix]

Pretty sure you could use a standard antenna designed for automobiles... just modify the mount to suit your situation. Never tried it myself, but I don't see why it wouldn't work.

Also, many 2M rigs can be modified to transmit out of band, so you could probably get away with using it for both VHF and 2M on the same antenna. Both my Yaesu's have been modified to they can transmit/receive on the marine VHF frequencies, and I have the common marine channels programmed in for monitoring. I don't think the SWR would be too bad since the frequencies are close enough. Not sure if you could get away without a tuner on 440 though.

As a side note, I purchased a Kenwood TS-440AT HF rig from a guy who used to use it on his sailboat. Not sure how he rigged an antenna for that though. Here at the house, I'm using a homemade G5RV antenna which is roughly 102 feet long and 50 feet up in the air.; not really all that practical for sailboat use

73's

Brad

 

[Brian D]

I too use a handheld. From Oceanside, I can hit Catalina, San Clemente/Dana Point, Palomar Mt, and Keller Peak. All on 5 watts. So first question, do you really need 50 watts?

Your VHF antenna is close enough to 2 meters that it it should work. I would throw an antenna switch between the radios and the antenna. For 440, you can put up a dual band maybe on one of the spreaders. You really do not need much height with all these repeaters around.

Now if you want to go big rig, I use a Yeasu FT857D that has HF, VHF (6m and 2m), and 440. The output is 100 watts on 160m ~ 6m, 50 watts on 2m, and 20 watts on 440.

With your boat, you can put up an alternate backstay HF antenna with a good tuner and work 14300 Maritime Mobile Service Net.

The possibilities are endless. Good luck on the exam!

 

[Ron20324]

... roughly 102 feet long and 50 feet up in the air.; not really all that practical for sailboat use ...

To repeat that famous quote, "You're gonna need a bigger boat".

 

[Don S/V ILLusion]

That Is exactly what I was referring to. Two meter and 440. Coax RG8. I looked but didn't find anything that looked marine. You know like a fiberglass that wouldn't require grounding.

You know why manufacturers label some things "marine" so don't be concerned with that.

My opinion on splitters isn't good. I've seen too many fail and that's the last thing you want when it comes to your marine radio.

Re: grounding - they are all grounded by virtue of the outer braid on the coax. I thinkyou mean counterpoise which can be accomplished by mounting it at the masthead or spreader.

Re: coax- not all RG8 is quality low loss cable. As attenuation can significantly lower the powergettingto the antenna at VHF and UHF frequencies, try to find LMR 400 or its equiv. not as thick (and heavy) as RG8 but lower loss.

 

[Brian D]

LMR240 is better for weight control aloft. It is superior to any of the RG type cables. Agree with Don on the LMR400, but either LMR400 (1.5 dB @ 150MHz/2.5 dB @ 450MHz per 100') or LMR240 (3 dB @ 150MHz/5.3 dB @ 450MHz per 100') will work and both are considered low loss.

For HF, one can use a halyard to raise a halfwave dipole for 20 meters. That is usually the band of choice. Or as I mentioned, an alternate backstay (approx. 43') with a tuner will give one all HF bands.

Do a search for Bill, WA6CCA. He has done a lot of work on shipboard HF and has solutions for multiple HF bands. Your boat is big enough for an antenna farm. LOL

 

[Rick D]

Thanks, Guys!

Good stuff here. I had no idea the handhelds would be that versatile. I have a Yeasu dual band handheld but have not transmitted on it for obvious reasons. I'll see if I even need a mobile. I think my ICOM marine SSB which is unlocked would serve for HF HAM after I get my General.

BTW, I was rushing to get my license so I could use in in an post-race Mexican trip. However, I have found that getting a Mexican Recip is a real PITA and time-consuming, and I wouldn't want my handheld aboard without a permit, so that's not happening.

 

[tango_51]

Nice i'm using a Using a 5GRV in a inverted V configuration, using my spinnaker halyard as a means to hoist the antennae when I want to play, I have a Yaesu FT-857D with auto tuner for the boat. KF5JJH just make sure you have a good copper ground..

 

[Brian D]

If one runs a dipole, one need not go overboard with a copper ground. The purpose of the 100sqft of copper is to act as a counterpoise. With a dipole that counterpoise is not required.

I run an experimental antenna at home. Random wire of about 33' with a 25' counterpoise. At the feed is a 4:1 UNUN and 1:1 current balun to kill stray RF, feed with coax and using an MFJ auto tuner. This antenna would be an exact duplicate of what I would use on my boat if and when I install one. No issues on high bands, but low bands (below 5 MHz) will not tune. Have no issues other than typical propagation.

What SSB and tuner do you have Rick?

 

[Rick D]

My SSB Rig

What SSB and tuner do you have Rick?

I have an older ICOM M700 with an AT120 tuner, isolated backstay antenna and KISS counterpoise.

 

[windward54]

I have an older ICOM M700 with an AT120 tuner, isolated backstay antenna and KISS counterpoise.

Time to run out and pick up an Icom M802. Consider it a graduation gift for getting your general!