Am I Making the Right Call?

[jsut210]

I'm currently looking to upgrade my sailboat from a 23' Oday to something in the 27-30ft range. Mostly in order to share my boat with more friends, and go farther and faster on the water more comfortably. I recently came across a Tartan 3000 for sale for $5k. On paper it looked like a great deal and checked all my boxes: inboard diesel in good shape, decent condition main, genny, jib, and spinnaker, autopilot, and recent bottom paint. When I went to see the boat in person by enthusiasm faded...

#1 on my list of concerns, soft decks. Walking around on top the first thing I noticed was a slight creaking noise when shifting my weight around. I didn't notice severe deflection anywhere, but when I bounced my weight on my heels I could see maybe 1/8" of deflection in a few areas around the chainplates. To my untrained ear, when tapping around I think I heard a lot a variation in these areas from a solid knock to a more hollow reverberation.

#2 a few port windows were leaking. Potentially an easy fix but I'm guessing this would support the soft deck theory.

#3 the gelcoat was quite oxidized. It was a rainy day when I visited, but dragging my finger along the raw gelcoat left a white chalk. Im sure if I sat down on the exterior of the boat it would stain my pants. I'm trying to convince myself that all it needs is a wetsand and polish but this might be a whole lot more boat than I can handle.

#4 the boat is being sold by a broker. A bit before I showed up to see the boat I was told that the boat was unlocked and I could go onboard and check it out alone. I did not feel comfortable testing the electronics or running the engine so that functionality was not verified. I had also planned to ask more questions in person but obviously was unable to. I'm sure I could set up another more guided tour but the whole situation was a bit of a turn off.

My gut is telling me to just walk away from this one and spend my money elsewhere. I'd be better off with a different boat in better condition, even if it's a slower design with less goodies, right? Another part of me can't ignore how sweet this Tartan would be with a season of work. Maybe I'm being too cautious about the issues (I think) I've found? The obvious answer would be to get a proper survey but I'm having a hard time justifying that A, because of the already low cost, and B because it feels like I'm paying someone to tell me what I already think I should do, walk away. Am I expecting too much from older boats in this price range?

Hoping that someone out there might have some words of wisdom for me. Thanks for giving this a read.

 

[MikeHoncho]

The same broker that told you the engine is solid didn't tell you the decks were soft. You know the answer to this.......Look up comparable Tartans in good shape and see what they are asking for them. I find it interesting that a broker would take on a $5000 headache.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

My gut is telling me to just walk away from this one and spend my money elsewhere. I'd be better off with a different boat in better condition, even if it's a slower design with less goodies, right?

100% correct. Don't just walk away from this boat, run like your very life depended on it. From all the problems you've identified, this boat was owned by some slob who didn't give a rat's a$$ what happened to it. You don't even want to think what condition the engine is in.

For all the additional money it will cost you to keep this thing floating, spend that money now on a better boat.

$5K is not much to pay for a boat but maybe it just means it just doesn't have any equipment on it. It doesn't have to mean it's been destroyed because of neglect.

 

[Captain Larry-DH]

Sounds like a good choice if you want ro spend endless time and money fixing it. Listen to @MikeHoncho . The negotiation should be about “how much are they willing to pay you to take it“?

 

[Ken13559]

Sounds like a good deal.........for the scrapyard

 

[garymalmgren]

#1 Walking around on top the first thing I noticed was a slight creaking noise when shifting my weight around. I didn't notice severe deflection anywhere,
#2 a few port windows were leaking.
#3 the gelcoat was quite oxidized.

These three items add up to the boat only being viable for the scrapyard.
Or From all the problems you've identified, this boat was owned by some slob who didn't give a rat's a$$ what happened to it.

Hey, the boat is old.
We all get old, leak a bit, creak a bit and end up a little oxidized.
That doesn't mean the scrapyard.

The photo that Ralph posted is not the engine in the boat in question.
Just like this is not a photo of me

gary

 

[dlochner]

Here's a link to the listing:

1983 Tartan 3000 Racer/Cruiser for sale - YachtWorld

Find more information and images about the boat and contact the seller or search more boats for sale on YachtWorld.

www.yachtworld.com

The oxidation is not a big deal, it will just take a lot of elbow grease, wet sanding and buffing.

Leaky ports can be an issue. The ports are plastic, probably Beckson or Boomer. Removing them may be a snap or the plastic may snap.

The running rigging will need replacing.

Soft decks are an issue. however we are talking about a 40 year old boat.

The boat is priced about $10K below other models and it definitely needs some work. All of the 3000 have had a recent price drop including this boat. I'd like to know why the owner is selling the boat. Did the owner buy a newer larger boat? Is this an estate sale? After paying the commission, the owner won't receive much. He's probably looking to get rid of it before winter so he doesn't have to pay winter storage.

The big question involves time, money, and skill. Do you have the time, the money, and the skill to refurbish the boat?

 

[Will Gilmore]

She's a beauty, for sure.
She looks like a great flip, if you have the time. Buy her for $5000, clean her up, refinish the bright work, replace the sun damaged plastic fittings, get her a decent anchor, sell her for $12k+.

I'd buy her for the engine alone, and the fact that she has obviously been owned by someone who took sailing seriously. However, she is an old boat. 1983 was forty years ago.

I'm not telling you NOT to walk away. That boat will take money and work, but I don't see a scrap yard in her near future.

From sailboatdata.com

-Will

 

[BarryL]

Hi,

My $.02

Nothing you listed would make we walk (or run) away from that boat. The soft deck MAY be a deal breaker, but it doesn't have too. My suggestions:
Go back and see the boat again.
Have the BROKER start the engine. See how it runs. Any smoke? Decent amount of cooling water being expelled? Put the boat in forward. Do you feel it tug on the dock lines? After it warms up run it at 50% power for a few minutes. Any signs of overheating or anything else? Then do the same in reverse. If the engine runs in gear for 10 minutes and doesn't have any problems it PROBABLY is Ok but I would still want my surveyor to pay close attention to it.
Do some research on soft decks. What will happen if you ignore it (for a few years anyway?). If you think you must fix it now, who will do it and guestimate the cost.

If the engine is in good condition, and you can live with the soft decks, then you might have a pretty good deal. Worst case, you buy the boat, put little into it, sail it for a few years and then throw it away. Five years of sailing for $5000 is a bargain for the fun and education you will get.

Some observations from the listing:
No roller furler for the headsail. No stove or oven. Traveler on bridgedeck. Nice looking backstay adjuster. Tiller steered. Speakers in cockpit are shot. Will they allow water through and into the boat? Looks like headliner, wall coverings are coming down, probably not a big deal.

Good luck,
Barry

 

[plenny7]

Here's a link to the listing:

1983 Tartan 3000 Racer/Cruiser for sale - YachtWorld

Find more information and images about the boat and contact the seller or search more boats for sale on YachtWorld.

www.yachtworld.com

Whoa, new zincs!!

So little information in the description and that's one of the few things they focus on, LOL. Then again, the commission on a $5k boat doesn't lend itself to much more effort than that. The owner must be a good friend of the broker

 

[jssailem]

Boats are valued in the eyes of the viewer.

No reference is made to age, but we can guess it is mature. If you have time to work on the boat and money to put into this hobby the Tartan was a nice boat in its prime. If you think you can DIY the repairs and do not care if you get to go sailing for several months. Then why not… There are worse things to spend money on.

If sailing now is your goal then keep looking. You are moving into the buyers market time in Baltimore. It is when sailing and boat activity slow down. Folks are putting the boats up on the hard and covering them before the first snow. You may find a good deal out there.

WET decks with damaged core are a time consumer. They require a lot of nasty work to fix. Think old car with rusted frame. You got to want to fix that boat.

 

[Apex]

at $10k below other offerings, the price seems to reflect condition of soft decks.
copy what @jssailem said: Except I believe best timing is just before spring bills are due. Winter harnesses dreams of what will get done, while spring is realization of what hasn't yet before paying for another season in-slip or on-hard.

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

Just like this is not a photo of me

Hey, what's the big idea of posting that photo of me ? ? ?

 

[Will Gilmore]

Hey, what's the big idea of posting that photo of me ? ? ?

You mean this one?

-Will

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

You mean this one?

Hardly. I don't have THAT much rust on me.

 

[jsut210]

I forgot to mention - the cherry on top of the visit was when I noticed the broken windex on top of the mast. It's been a while since I've climbed up that high...

In all seriousness thank you everyone for the input. I'm capable and willing to put some real elbow grease into the gelcoat / seal the windows, probably re-bed a lot of other hardware, and do other cosmetic stuff. What gets me is the rot - I'm confident that I could get the job done, but I don't know if I've got the skills or patience to make the end product look nice again. The other question in my mind is how soft is too soft? I wonder if I could have some fun on the water for the rest of the season and then cut into her once its warm enough in the spring. I'm guessing only a proper survey would be able to answer this.

Right now I think the plan is to shop around a bit. I've got my eye on a Ranger 30, Hunter 30, and maybe a Cat 27. If any of those have solid decks, I'd probably rather put my money into adding the bells and whistles / other more cosmetic repairs that seem inevitable at this price range but are more aligned with my skills and level of effort. On paper the Ranger and maybe the Hunter seem like they'd have the potential to perform just as well as the Tartan. Curious if anyone has comments about these models.

If I have to circle back to the Tartan, AND the engine checks out, AND no one else scoops it up, maybe it'll end up in my slip...

 

[jibes138]

There is a very large difference between a 27 and a 30. Rotten core at chain plates means corroded chain plates that might be unsafe to use. That would be my first priority, pull the chain plates out. If I was you I’d look for a Catalina 30, very roomy boat, huge number to choose from, has a much larger boat feel for comfort and features.

 

[jibes138]

Here’s a Catalina 30 for comparison. You didn’t mention the condition of sails or canvas on the Tartan. These could cost a lot. For ten grand more you’d probably get a boat in much better shape you could use right away and you’ll spend ten grand in no time on the repairs to the Tartan.

Used 1983 Catalina 30, 21037 Edgewater - Boat Trader

Check out this Used 1983 Catalina 30 for sale in Edgewater, MD 21037. View this Cruisers and other Sail boats on boattrader.com

www.boattrader.com

 

[Ralph Johnstone]

I've got my eye on a Ranger 30, Hunter 30, and maybe a Cat 27.

You won't regret it if they turn out to be free of rotten decks.

 

[capta]

You mean this one?
View attachment 219825

-Will

That engine wouldn't scare me off, were I young enough to clean it up and get it running. If there was ever an engine designed to meet the criteria of the KISS principle, that's got to be it.