Alternative Windlass Use

[Neil McDonald]

The two heaviest tasks for this senior citizen on my 35 ft cruising sailboat are lifting the anchor and deploying/recovering the dinghy from its foredeck storage location.

Fortunately I have a windlass fitted with a combination chain/rode gypsy/wildcat. The rope rode is 5/8 inch three strand and the setup works very well. I am now researching using the power windlass to lift the dinghy with a suitable combination of dedicated line and pulley blocks. Has anyone here already done this? Using a 5/8 inch three strand rope is clearly overkill for the dinghy and would require large expensive blocks.

Short of trial and error has anyone any ideas of how I can find out which smaller rope would work in the combination gypsy/wildcat?

 

[AXEL]

Lifting the dinghy where, on deck, davits?

 

[Neil McDonald]

The dinghy is 9'-6" RIB stored upside down on the foredeck.

 

[Rich Stidger]

I can't help you with suggestions for using the windlass to lift your dinghy, but it should be fairly easy. What I will offer is an alternative.

For years we did the same as you and stored the dinghy on the foredeck. FINALLY I added davits and the advantages are so great I can't understand why I didn't add them years ago.

Not only has the lifting of the dinghy been eliminated, but I can now leave the outboard in place instead of removing it and storing it in a locker. I no longer have lines tied across the dinghy to the toe-rails hence eliminating a tripping hazard. The headsail sheets no longer get caught around the dinghy and I don't need line guards to prevent that issue. I can now open forward hatches without first moving the dinghy, and finally my forward visibility is greatly improved.

Now deployment/storage of the dinghy is a one-person operation and it is much faster that foredeck storage.

So my suggestion is that before you invest in some special hardware to use the windlass for lifting the dinghy, why don't you consider adding davits?

 

[woodster]

if you have a windless on board you can rig up a snatch block or two leading to a gen pole mounted to the front of the mast that will reach over the side to hoist the dinghy on board ...but don't let it knock you overboard in doing so it can be done but it is called work where i come from and if you are not into work then get the davits you will be much happier

 

[Neil McDonald]

Although the convenience of stern davits is appealing, I'm not to keen on going down this road for several reasons. Firstly we have a walk through transom and my wife likes swimming in the sea off the anchored boat, secondly I already have a lot of stuff mounted on the stern rail which would be impacted and lastly I don't really want to spend the money!

Have been thinking some more and now starting to contemplate using a much lighter weight line wrapped on the windlass drums instead of a heavy line on the gypsy. This would require using one hand to keep line tension on the drum but I already have the line and blocks (including one with a jamb cleat) for this setup. What I would probably need for this approach is to buy one of those remote windlass control systems available on E Bay for less than $50.

 

[Stu Jackson]

You may be surprised, Neil, at how well just a simple halyard tackle can work. And if that's not enough, you can rig a vang (4:1 or even 3:1) to the end of a halyard and use it, instead of the "straight" halyard to haul. You may not need a windlass or winch at all.

Here's an idea I "recorded" from John Nantz of this very forum years ago.

If you look closely, you'll see the vang. The other idea in this photo is how to rig the lifting lines without drilling holes in the transom of the dinghy.

Thanks again, John, I knew it would come in handy!!!

 

[All U Get]

Same as Stu but I use two of those yellow lifting straps that are about 2" wide. We keep our dinghy on davits, but for some maintenance we swing it aboard. Once we used the 4:1 on the end of the boom with the dinghy filled with water to tip the boat so we could make it under a fixed bridge.

All U Get

 

[Gunni]

What Stu shows work well, and can be reasonably done singlehand. Especially if you use a ratchet block or combo block / cam cleat. Clip the 4:1 tackle to a spare halyard, hoist to your preferred height, cleat off the halyard, attach tackle shackle to the dinghy lifting bridle; hoist clear of the stanchions; lock off the lifting tackle; swing on deck; lower into stowage position. Doing this with a 1:1 halyard tackle is hard work and would require a winch or windlass, and a second mate.

 

[Marc14857]

We use a spare halyard to haul our dinghy onto the foredeck.No special harness either. We use the tow rope which is attached to D rings on each side of the dinghy, We connect the halyard to ring where these two lines attach just forward of the float. The other end of the halyard goes to our power winch in the cockpit but any winch will do. Its worked well for us for many years.

 

[John Nantz]

Used a Schaefer Boom Vang Kit

Stu - I’m impressed. You, Sir, have a VERY GOOD memory!

You may be surprised, Neil, at how well just a simple halyard tackle can work. And if that's not enough, you can rig a vang (4:1 or even 3:1) to the end of a halyard and use it, instead of the "straight" halyard to haul. You may not need a windlass or winch at all.

Hi Neil, …. totally agree. Launching and retriving a dingy stowed on deck can be an ordeal, and it doesen’t seem to get any better with time. Towing one definitely has it’s problems and hazards, for example, north of the Sisters in the afternoon, for one example.

Our dink is an Avon 3.15 Roll-Up and it weighs somewhere around 115 to 120 pounds, a lot to man-handle; however, once it’s in the water it is really nice. We stow it deflated on the coachroof aft of the mast because there is enough ground tackle forward already.

The Boom Vang Kit we got many years ago and I think it’s this one: http://hardware.schaefermarine.com/...d=3510&zenid=c6914c91795af2830f09bb55f506664c Schaefer 35-13. Got this for the overall line length plus the line diameter. As it has turned out, it’s just perfect in the length and the mechanical advantage categories. Seems the price has gone up though.

Deploy: Use the main halyard with just enough of the vang stretched out to raise the dinghy over the lifelines and then lower it using either the vang or the main halyard.

Retrieve: Stretch the vang all the way out until one can be on deck and still hold on to the bitter end, jam cleat facing down, tighten up on the main halyard, then pull in on the bitter end with one hand and push the halyard out and away from the boat to keep the dinghy from rubbing on the hull.

With the dinghy stowed aft of the mast this works fine; however, if on the foredeck there may be a problem in the launching phase with the halyard not having a fairlead going forward.

Hope this helps.

Thanks for finding this picture, Stu. I still can’t believe it! That was way back. Fred Fricara was still around. Where did he go anyway?

 

[Stu Jackson]

John's picture

John, I was so impressed with that picture I copied it to my computer's boat files, and use it now it then when the subject comes up. 2009.

Just in case you're out cruising...

It really is a nifty solution.

KISS, no motors, or elekrzity.

 

[jlp0217]

I do just as you asked. I use my spare halyard, clipped to the bow eye on my Achilles 350 (160 lb) dingy. The tail of the halyard I wrap 3 times around the mast mounted halyard winch then forward to the windlass and 3 turns around the capstan wrapping downward then back to the side by the shrouds. I use one hand to tail the line off the windlass, and the other to hold the dingy off the side and push the button on my windlass remote. Onse the dingy clears the lifelines, it just a matter of lowering it and walking it back close to the mast, so I remove the loops off the windlass and get the tail out of the way. Very easy for lifting the dingy on board. I leave the line clutch engaged so nothing will fall if I loose the line.
Not so easy to launch the dingy, as it is in the way of the line from the winch to the windlass, so I usually just hand winch it to a vertical position from which I can walk it to and over the lifelines and then just lower it slowly so I can unhook the transom and later the bow eye as it hangs up on the lifelines and toe rail. This is much easier with a helper, but I often do it alone.
I do have davits on the stern, which I usually use while cruising, but I much prefer to be able to walk off the swim step when in a slip. Plus I'm 5 feet shorter without the dingy on the davits, so $3 to $10 cheaper per night.

 

[Neil McDonald]

After listening to all the feedback, here is what is have decided to do.

Hang a 2:1 or 3:1 reduction tackle system from the spinnaker halyard and attach it to the dinghy bow. Run the tail line from the top block down to a turning block/cam cleat setup attached at deck level between the boat's two bow cleats located forward of the windlass. From here run the line back horizontally to take 2-3 wraps on the vertical windlass drum.

The available bow area to simultaneously operate the windlass deck switch with one knee and use a hand to keep line tension on the windlass drum is minimal. A contortionist with marine survival skills would do well! The ideal location to manage the operation is standing next to the mast where the suspended dinghy will also be at one critical stage.

So I will install a $50 E-Bay remote windlass control system and attach another turning block to the toe rail opposite the windlass. This allows the line coming off the windlass to run via the turning block straight to my hand where I stand by the mast... hopefully in total control. Sounds complicated but hopefully only the first time setup!

Thanks everyone for all the ideas and comments that fuelled this plan.

 

[scotmcpherson]

Although I haven't built mine yet, I had planned on using the clubsail boom to double as a davit which can swing out over the water, haul the dinghy out, and place it in the center of the deck.

 

[Terry Cox]

Dinghy Handling

Hi Neil, the link below describes how I stow our dinghy while underway and in the slip. Did it this way with our H28 and now with our P42. Been doing it this way for years and thousands of miles and have never had an issue during sea or wind state conditions.

http://hunter.sailboatowners.com/mods.php?task=article&mid=45&aid=6195&mn=42

 

[Ken Cross]

We do it like this:

I know you mentioned the stern is pretty congested, but here is what we do.
In the pic you can see 3/4 inch PVC bent to cradle the dink. Inside the PVC is a floating line that I attach to the handles on the stern of the boat. When I pull on the lines the kink easily tips up and rests against the boat. I do need to put a rag under the oarlock to keep it from making black marks on the transom.

If we want to use the open transom, it's pretty easy to put the dink in the water (only a few seconds.) Cost is cheap like me.

Ken

 

[All U Get]

I know you mentioned the stern is pretty congested, but here is what we do.
In the pic you can see 3/4 inch PVC bent to cradle the dink. Inside the PVC is a floating line that I attach to the handles on the stern of the boat. When I pull on the lines the kink easily tips up and rests against the boat. I do need to put a rag under the oarlock to keep it from making black marks on the transom.

If we want to use the open transom, it's pretty easy to put the dink in the water (only a few seconds.) Cost is cheap like me.

Ken

Ken that's so simple. :wow:

All U Get

 

[mz4wheeler]

I know you mentioned the stern is pretty congested, but here is what we do.
In the pic you can see 3/4 inch PVC bent to cradle the dink. Inside the PVC is a floating line that I attach to the handles on the stern of the boat. When I pull on the lines the kink easily tips up and rests against the boat. I do need to put a rag under the oarlock to keep it from making black marks on the transom.

If we want to use the open transom, it's pretty easy to put the dink in the water (only a few seconds.) Cost is cheap like me.

Ken

What a great design Ken! I think I'm going to do the same, but I'll change it a little (see hacked photo).

 

[Ken Cross]

What a great design Ken! I think I'm going to do the same, but I'll change it a little (see hacked photo).

It might be worth playing with your changes. The most difficult part of this design is getting the PVC in the right place under the dink. The exact position of the dink changes each time I do it.

Ken