AH800 Autohelm for Christmas - now want to modify

Sep 20, 2014
1,320
Rob Legg RL24 Chain O'Lakes
OK, so DW got me a new toy for Christmas. A used AH800 Autohelm. So now I can go sailing by myself and she does not need to go :cry: . Have only played with it hooked up to a bench supply to repair it. So here is my question. Before I install it, I was thinking of getting an aftermarket remote control relay board with 4 ports. The switches on the Autohelm are Standby, Auto, +10, and +1 in either direction. So only having a way to remote control 4 of the 6 switches, which are the ones I’m most likely to use from a remote location such as the front of the boat? I assume the +10 is a given. So my choices seem to be between the +1 vs the Standby/Auto. Just hoping for some hints from those of you who use an autopilot.

FIY: The boat is used as a daysailor on moderate sized lakes - some with heavy traffic.
 

Ted

.
Jan 26, 2005
1,254
C&C 110 Bay Shore, Long Island, NY
AH800 Autohelm for Christmas

I use a remote for the autopilot which does not have the ability to place it into auto or standby mode. I don't remember a time while sailing solo that I would ever uses that function. Place the autopilot in auto mode then go about your business with the remote. If you're at the bow, I don't see why would you want to place it into standby mode? I would want to have the +10/-10 and +1/-1 functions and not the standby/auto function. The only reason I can think of that the standby/auto function would be nice to have available on the remote is if the main autopilot control head was located in the cabin or someplace really inconvenient to get to.
 
Mar 20, 2012
3,983
Cal 34-III, MacGregor 25 Salem, Oregon
I use a remote for the autopilot which does not have the ability to place it into auto or standby mode. I don't remember a time while sailing solo that I would ever uses that function. Place the autopilot in auto mode then go about your business with the remote. If you're at the bow, I don't see why would you want to place it into standby mode? I would want to have the +10/-10 and +1/-1 functions and not the standby/auto function. The only reason I can think of that the standby/auto function would be nice to have available on the remote is if the main autopilot control head was located in the cabin or someplace really inconvenient to get to.
i agree...
unless you are at the helm, you wont be able to "steer a course" for the auto mode to set to , and unless you are at the helm to take over, there is no reason to go to standby mode...

remember that the autopilot doesnt stop or start the boat, but it only steers it for you:D...
 
Sep 20, 2014
1,320
Rob Legg RL24 Chain O'Lakes
Does the autohelm ever get confused and go bazerk? or way over correct? I'm thinking maybe under the conditions of the wake from a power boat?
 
Oct 17, 2011
2,808
Ericson 29 Southport..
I use a remote am in the opinion of all here so far. Even if you go to 'standby', you still have to be at the wheel to release the clutch. And then of course it free wheels. No, plus minus one and ten, that's all..

And an edit. With the aforementioned plus/minus one and ten, then you have your auto tack on the remote.
 
Nov 8, 2010
11,386
Beneteau First 36.7 & 260 Minneapolis MN & Bayfield WI
On a raymarine TILLER pilot, there is really no such thing as 'standby'. I say this because if you want to turn it off (standby), you have to physically disconnect it from the tiller! So you might as well be there to do that.

The standby mode is valuable for the below deck units, which stay connected at all time.

Go with both the +1s and +10s.
 

Joe

.
Jun 1, 2004
7,999
Catalina 27 Mission Bay, San Diego
I suggest you don't dive into using the remote until you've actually used your AP unit as it is for a while.. A tiller pilot is an essential convenience for single handing, however, you must still respect the fact that you are alone and if you fall off with the TP engaged... bye, bye....

At the very least, stay clipped on any time you're on deck with the tiller pilot engaged.

It's my gut feeling that dragging a wired remote around on the foredeck may lead to a bit of overconfidence and cause one to pay less attention to safety standards

So I would suggest you shake down the acquired tiller pilot with out the remote for quite some time before you start messing with a home made, non marine quality attachment.

The most important part of using an autopilot is to have the rig balanced (sails trimmed correctly). Once the course is set and the unit has a chance to settle in it will find its own "sweet spot" and actually steer the boat better than you. When you start playing with the + - buttons a lot it has a tendency to struggle... You need to learn what you can and can't do effectively before you leave the cockpit and start making remote changes at the pulpit. Once past that stage, you can make some decisions about the remote and how you'll be able to use it....

Bottom line, with or without the remote, the tiller pilot will change your sailing life... congratulations...... stay clipped on.

BTW... "standby" mode means the unit is NOT steering... but... it still has the tiller locked into position. It will not freewheel... you must disengage the AP's arm from the tiller to steer the boat by hand.
 
Mar 20, 2012
3,983
Cal 34-III, MacGregor 25 Salem, Oregon
On a raymarine TILLER pilot, there is really no such thing as 'standby'. I say this because if you want to turn it off (standby), you have to physically disconnect it from the tiller! So you might as well be there to do that.

The standby mode is valuable for the below deck units, which stay connected at all time.

Go with both the +1s and +10s.

to clarify for anyone who may misunderstand... there IS a standby mode built into in the tillerpilots, but all it does it stop the unit from keeping its course and places it in standby (on but not working) with the tiller locked in the direction it was when you pressed the standby button.

but as Jackdaw says, you need to lift the pilot arm off the tiller peg to manually steer, cuz there is no clutch:D...
 
Sep 20, 2014
1,320
Rob Legg RL24 Chain O'Lakes
I guess technically they should have labeled Standby as Manual mode.

In the past, I have always cleated the tiller down to keep the boat basically on course so I could attend to things up front. (although I often sail with the tiller cleated just for convenience) The main thought is to assist when raising or lowering the sails. There have been times in the past when I have been in the middle of lowering the sails, and have had to run back and make a course correction and then run back up front to finish the job. This is particularly an issue when heading in, because that section of the lake gets crowded around quitting time. As soon as you start your motor, you loose your right of way. You can start out with an open path but it fills up, as the power boats speed past you to put in for the night. That is where I could see putting it into standby, and then bumping the tiller position to make a long sweeping curve in, rather than changing course a bunch of times. it just gives me more time to stay up at the front of the boat, taking stuff down. When I have had someone at the tiller, I usually have the sails in the cabin by the time I make my final approach to the marina.

Going into the marina is usually down wind, but usually by evening, the wind has died down enough to lower the sails while motoring down wind. There is still be some load, so as the sails come down, the boat directions changes. I assume that is where I would want it in auto, but once the sails are not catching air, then standby would be useful to make a large sweeping curve into the marina, while I'm still securing things.

BTW: IF I fall off, I can always hit the buttons on the wireless remote and have the boat come get me :) But seriously, every time I go up front, I always have my life jacket on. The usable area of the lake is only about 600 acres, so the shore is always pretty close by. The weighted center board would probably anchor the boat before it ever ran into the shore, as the lake is very shallow.

Kind of excited about getting this thing, as it was sold cheap as non-working for parts. As it turned out, it was a very minor electrical connection issue, so I really didn't even need to dive into the circuitry.
 
Mar 20, 2012
3,983
Cal 34-III, MacGregor 25 Salem, Oregon
Does the autohelm ever get confused and go bazerk? or way over correct? I'm thinking maybe under the conditions of the wake from a power boat?
if you get a magnet or any magnetic objects/steels near it, it can and will turn you every direction except upside down...

it sometimes has trouble keeping up in a large following sea, depending on the wave action... im not sure about the model you have, but they usually have a way to adjust the "gain", which is an adjustment that adjusts the speed/delay at which the tillerpilot reacts to a yawing vessel on the wakes/waves...
 

Joe

.
Jun 1, 2004
7,999
Catalina 27 Mission Bay, San Diego
I guess technically they should have labeled Standby as Manual mode.

In the past, I have always cleated the tiller down to keep the boat basically on course so I could attend to things up front. (although I often sail with the tiller cleated just for convenience) The main thought is to assist when raising or lowering the sails. There have been times in the past when I have been in the middle of lowering the sails, and have had to run back and make a course correction and then run back up front to finish the job. This is particularly an issue when heading in, because that section of the lake gets crowded around quitting time. As soon as you start your motor, you loose your right of way. ....etc.

Dave... sound's like you're wanting to do a lot more single handing and for some reason think the Tiller Pilot with a remote is going to answer all your concerns. Well it won't and you shouldn't rely on the tiller pilot to maneuver you around in tight areas.... I'm afraid you have a more grandiose idea of it's usefulness than what is practical and safe. I implore you to be cautious and rethink how you will handle things by yourself.

What you need to do is set your boat up for single handing. This means, besides having a tiller pilot to give you some rest and allow you to leave the helm from time to time.. you should set up some other systems... The first would be to run your halyards back to the cockpit... with the winch on the cabin top... this allow you to raise and drop the sails without going forward... the Second would be to rig a jib downhaul if you have a hanked on headsail... it will keep the sail securely on the foredeck until it's time to hoist, and it will allow you to control the drop easily ... right back down on the deck. Once the headsail is down you can pick and choose when to lower the main... some times I just leave it up and let the boom swing free... if you're on a mooring or an upwind slip there's really no mandate to drop the mainsail until the boat is secured.

Another thing you can learn to do is to straddle the tiller and steer with your knees... I do this all the time when I'm dropping the headsail... jib downhaul in one hand, halyard in the other.. steer the boat with your knees, putting it directly under the sail as you bring it down in a controlled manner...

If you make some of these changes and learn these techniques you'll feel a lot safer in a crowded area...knowing you can the sail down without leaving the cockpit....
 
Sep 20, 2014
1,320
Rob Legg RL24 Chain O'Lakes
I'm not going into this totally blind. I sailed my previous boat single handed many times on this lake. I did have a jib downhaul added to that boat, although the one time I needed it most, the hankons jammed.
There really are several things I plan to do to this boat to make it reasonable to single hand. The autohelm is only one piece of the puzzle. I had planned on setting up to single hand without the autohelm, the autohelm was just a deal that fell into my lap, so I want to make the most of it. I plan to add lazy jacks for the main, with some of my own tweaks to help manage dropping it and keeping it contained. All the lines do run back to the cockpit already.
My previous boat had a flat blade rudder which made me very paranoid when I got within a 100 feet of another boat. Crowded is a relative term. That section of the lake is about 350 feet wide, with everyone aiming for the channel that is 50 feet wide. The boats tend to stack up at the no-wake buoys. The reality is, if I had to bail, I can always overshoot the channel and continue into a wider section of the lake. I always take the outside path, which is why I was talking about a sweeping curve in. No, there is no way I would try to actually enter the channel without being at the tiller, and physically steering.

BTY: This does bring up a point. Anyone know why they would design the slot in the mast so high up, where you slip the sail in? Its at least 18 inches above the boom. This means the track slides fall out of the slot prematurely. I typically wrap a bungy cord around the mast at that point to keep the slides from going too low, but this keeps the sail bunched up pretty high up the mast. I don't like the added windage. I've been trying to figure out a way to cover the slot so they don't fall out.
 
Oct 26, 2008
6,046
Catalina 320 Barnegat, NJ
Get a track stopper ...

BTY: This does bring up a point. Anyone know why they would design the slot in the mast so high up, where you slip the sail in? Its at least 18 inches above the boom. This means the track slides fall out of the slot prematurely. I typically wrap a bungy cord around the mast at that point to keep the slides from going too low, but this keeps the sail bunched up pretty high up the mast. I don't like the added windage. I've been trying to figure out a way to cover the slot so they don't fall out.
It does seem odd that your slot is so much higher. Is the gooseneck adjustable? It doesn't appear so, but that would be the only reason I can think of, other than the mast may not be made for the boat ... that seemed to be a question regarding sail trim when some were noting how bendy the mast seems in photos of other RL 24 compared with the pictures of yours.

In any case, a slug can be installed in the track just above the slot to prevent the sail slugs from exiting when you drop the sail. I must have about 5 of them in the house somewhere. Every year, I remove the slug and put it in my pocket when I remove the main sail. Then, I find the slug in my pocket when I go home. Either I put the slug on my nightstand for the winter, and Sue eventually picks it up and puts it somewhere or discards it (when she gets tired of looking at it - and she doesn't know what it is); or, I put it somewhere safe ... where I will never find it again. This has been going on for years. So far this year, it is still on the nightstand as of this morning.

Do you sail on Pistakee or Fox Lake?
 
Oct 24, 2010
2,405
Hunter 30 Everett, WA
BTY: This does bring up a point. Anyone know why they would design the slot in the mast so high up, where you slip the sail in? Its at least 18 inches above the boom. This means the track slides fall out of the slot prematurely. I typically wrap a bungy cord around the mast at that point to keep the slides from going too low, but this keeps the sail bunched up pretty high up the mast. I don't like the added windage. I've been trying to figure out a way to cover the slot so they don't fall out.
Our old MacGregor 26D had the high slot you speak of. I always had to prevent the main from falling off when I lowered it. There are commercial stops made for that purpose, but I always just used the tag end of my reefing line tied around the mast and through a fitting above the slot.
 
Sep 20, 2014
1,320
Rob Legg RL24 Chain O'Lakes
I sail on Pistakee. The marina that everyone uses is on Pistakee, not sure if there is any alternatives on Fox Lake. Getting to Fox Lake would mean going under a bridge. There is an unwritten rule that all the sailboats sail on Pistakee. The power boats cruise through, but always go to Fox Lake. Fox Lake is known for some really high speed racing, and heavy partying, as well as accidents. The power boaters normally respect us blowboaters. Only once in 3 years have I ever had a power boat intentionally be obnoxious - turned just as he came by to create a wake. Most deviate course, and give us space. As long as their trajectory is not going to hit me, I prefer when they just run wide open, because they are gone quick, and leave no wake.
 

Joe

.
Jun 1, 2004
7,999
Catalina 27 Mission Bay, San Diego
I'm not going into this totally blind. I sailed my previous boat single handed many times on this lake. I did have a jib downhaul added to that boat, although the one time I needed it most, the hankons jammed.
The jib downhaul should not be connected to the sails headboard, where the halyard is fixed. It should attach to the hank below that.... this will keep the downhaul from pulling the head down over he hank. Also... do not thread the downhaul line inside the hanks or grommets. Let it run free, so it doesn't jam. On my 27 footer the jib downhaul line is 3/32 braided polyester.

BTY: This does bring up a point. Anyone know why they would design the slot in the mast so high up, where you slip the sail in? Its at least 18 inches above the boom. This means the track slides fall out of the slot prematurely. I typically wrap a bungy cord around the mast at that point to keep the slides from going too low, but this keeps the sail bunched up pretty high up the mast. I don't like the added windage. I've been trying to figure out a way to cover the slot so they don't fall out.
http://www.sailrite.com/Sail-Track-...5wCmJkORWBScZm-bsBT0QphLb3CF6HhiwaAiuI8P8HAQ#



http://www.rigrite.com/Spars/MetalMast_Spars/MetalMast_Mainsail_Gates.html

 
Sep 20, 2014
1,320
Rob Legg RL24 Chain O'Lakes
Thanks on the downhaul. Seems like that may have the been the issue.

I'm not sure that gate will be practical, as the biggest problem is how high it is. Anything in the track defeats the end goal. However, the link does give me a good search term, (track gates) which is leading to some ideas.
 
Oct 26, 2008
6,046
Catalina 320 Barnegat, NJ
Yes, I'm pretty familiar ...

I sail on Pistakee. The marina that everyone uses is on Pistakee, not sure if there is any alternatives on Fox Lake. Getting to Fox Lake would mean going under a bridge. There is an unwritten rule that all the sailboats sail on Pistakee. The power boats cruise through, but always go to Fox Lake. Fox Lake is known for some really high speed racing, and heavy partying, as well as accidents. The power boaters normally respect us blowboaters. Only once in 3 years have I ever had a power boat intentionally be obnoxious - turned just as he came by to create a wake. Most deviate course, and give us space. As long as their trajectory is not going to hit me, I prefer when they just run wide open, because they are gone quick, and leave no wake.
with the craziness! My friend used to own Inboard Water Sports on Rte 12 years ago (across the highway from the marinas). He sold his boat store to Munson Marine, but they may not be selling boats at that location any longer. We would run from the marina at Rte 12 to a creek just off the river down by Johnsburg. He had a slalom course and he used to take many friends over to ski it, most of the time in the early morning on weekdays before work. I used to work in downtown Chicago and there were many mornings when I would get to work at about 10 with Fox River mud in my hair! He had a houseboat that he would park in the creek, next to his course, so there would be some Sunday afternoons where we could ski slalom course and park our ski boats for a party atmosphere ... we were into skiing, not drinking ... well maybe except for the occasional Thursday night craziness at Blarney Island. He liked to see all the folks he sold Malibu ski boats to and have a good time on the water. Our house was on Deep Lake, so we were used to a much quieter atmosphere.

I would guess that Fox Lake would have larger sailing grounds and more consistent depth. But I suppose there are fewer marina options. When the water is churning like a washing machine, which it always is, I suspect that your light displacement boat has a tough time gaining momentum and keeping speed. Lake Hopatcong has the same conditions with regard to boat wakes in the summer. I'm always amazed at the speed I can attain when sailing at night with a light wind (we have a no wake speed restriction on Lake Hopatcong from sundown to sunrise). As far as I remember, there were never any night speed restrictions on Chain o lakes.
 
Sep 20, 2014
1,320
Rob Legg RL24 Chain O'Lakes
I sail on Sunday afternoons, so the worst of the craziness has died down by then. My previous 17 footer was heavy for its size, but still got tossed around and stopped by other boat wakes. On that boat, I modified the mast so it would rotate, which didn't change the speed, but helped it muscle through the wakes. Comparatively speaking, this boat seems to not be bothered by other boat wakes. It sits rather shallow in the water and tends to just go over them, rather than trying to plow through. Since I only got the boat in the water midway through the season, my experience has been limited. To me, the boat is so much faster than my previous boat (like twice as fast), that it really changes my perspective on speed anyway. It was built for the coastal waters of Australia. With my limited experience, to me it seems to do very well.