A Sailing Necessity

[sailaway78]

After reading the sad story of the sailors lost in the Chicago/Mac race, I had to wonder about something. From what I made of the story, the two who drowned did everything right, but could not get themselves loose from their tethers. So, I have to wonder, how many of you out there sail without a good, sharp knife, in your pocket. A tether, if under tension, could be very diffucult if not impossible to unclip. But a good sharp knife will cut the line pretty quick. I never, ever, go anywhere without my stainless Gerber, clipped in my right pocket. It is half sharp blade, half serrated blade and always at hand. How many of you carry a sharp blade at all times?

 

[Ed Schenck]

Almost never. If I have a belt on then I would have my Leatherman with me. But I am usually in swim trunks. When we were offshore heading for Florida and tethered then I would have had a knife. But it was unconscious of me. Like most things.

It is a scary thought though. My tethers are short and the jacklines close to center. So in a capsize we would have been under the boat.

 

[Morgan30]

Many knives in the cabin. Not a bad idea having one on us. Good thread/post.

 

[Steve Dion]

I thought they said that the two that died had head injuries (not drowning)?

Wouldn't we assume that one the other members could have cut them loose?

 

[Gary_H]

I always carry a folding knife on the boat. It just seems to me to be a neccesary part of a sailors equipment. I've been a scuba diving for 40 years and I always wear a dive knife plus another smaller knife attached to my regulator hose. People say "what are you afraid of.. sharks?" I say no I'm afraid of drowning because I get tangled up on someones old fishing line or net. It's dangerous not to dive with a knife and to the same extent it's as dangerouse to sail without one. Besides they are just plain useful tools for many things.

 

[Scott T-Bird]

I always had my Victronox helmsman knife (swiss army knife) with me until I forgot that it was in my pocket at an airport and I had to give it up.

I always have a Davis rigging knife on me when on the boat.

 

[paul1938]

I used to carry around my neck a rigging knife when I was younger and sailed an 18 ft cat. Now that I'm on a Hunter 33, I'm not, but I think I'll start again. Think I'll attach it to my life jacket somehow. I usually carry in my pocket a Gerber Splice which is a very small version of a Leatherman, but don't know if I could get to it in a panic situation.
I just remembered, when I go fly-fishing I have all sorts of hangers, coiled cords, and rewindable tethers that I use for the junk you wear fishing. I think I'll look thru the stuff to see what would work for a small knife.

 

[Warren Milberg]

I typically carry a least one knife with me whenever the boat leaves the dock. I also have a small folding knife clipped to my inflatable waist pack PFD, which I also always wear when th boat is moving. Since I sail solo alot, I have a loop rigged to my swim ladder that I could reach from the water. I am always surprised to see how few of my sailing friends do this, but rather prefer to lash up their swim ladders making it impossible to get aboard their boats if they should fall into the drink. Yet, I have to say that in many years of sailing, I have never had an emergency requiring the use of either the knife or the PFD. I put this in the category of like the guy who crumpled up a copy of the NY Times each day and threw it over his shoulder to ward off attacks by tigers. He was never attacked, so I guess the system works....

 

[LuzSD]

Gotta have a knife and it needs to be on your body

last year, after a similar conversation here, I went out and bought 7 excelent stainless knives with a couple essentials for exactly this reason. I got very highly rated ones for about $17 and gave them to all of our sailing friends/crew for Christmas. Some of us have them on our keychains, some are right there on their Nav Table.......but they are supposted to be on our belt loop while sailing. I think I have told the story of the fishing boat that capsized and the captain had a PFD that opened while he was upside down in the cabin and could not escape with it inflated. The only reason he says he got out was the knife (like I bought everyone) that a crew member had given to him recently. It saved his life.

 

[Ron20324]

Recently right here in Annapolis harbor a young teen was in a sailing school. The daysailer capsized and the girl was caught under the rigging by her PFD and drowned. I can't help but wonder if in a similar situation most people would just panic and not think about the knife? It's not something a person would practice.

 

[gpd955]

I always have a rigging knife attached to me, keep one at the helm in the event anyone needs one if I can't get to wherever it is needed and I keep a set of heavy duty bolt cutters in the cockpit locker if wire needs to be cut (or if I my lock stops working...so i can get into the boat!)

Need to get my knife sharpened though since I needed to trim up my crazy long mainsheet the other day and had to put it on the dock to get through it!

 

[Alan]

There are some key issues with having a knife on you while sailing. It must be attached to your clothing and you can carry it in a pocket or clip it to your belt. I use a short length of 1/8" bungy cord that will stretch as far as your arm can reach. If I drop it it remains with me. It MUST be able to be opened with one hand. Those multi tools like Leatherman are good for what they are but not for emergencies where you need instant access.
Having a knife stashed where you think you can get it when you need it is not the same as having it on your person.

 

[thinwater]

What reason have we to believe a knife would have helped?

They were not being towed by a moving boat; the boat was upside down. There is also speculation that the cause was head injury, but for the moment I'm going to leave that out of the my discussion.

I'm having a hard time believing it would be simpler to find a knife, while moving up and down in the dark, and cut the right line with just one hand, while trying to keep the boat from beating me on the head with the other. My gut is that if I could not release the tether at the harness end, I wouldn't be able to manage a knife either, in the time I would have. I am a climber with lots of time spent with biners, so perhaps clipping and unclipping blind and in the dark, sometimes in a blizzard, is commonplace to me. Handling a knife in bouncing wet, dark conditions is not.

I wonder if they were already injured. I wonder if they were pinned in some other way (lots of ropes and lifelines too). I wonder if a PFD inflated and made movement difficult.

I hope more information comes. We all know there are risks in sailing but it's chilling to read about, and disturbing when you consider the impact on those involved. It is also a good lesson about the fury of storms. You have to know when to prepare and position your boat for survival.

 

[Joe]

My tether has a "quick release" snap shackle on the harness end with a beaded lash.... I carry a knife andhave one stowed at the helm.... but I don't think I could cut the tether faster than just pulling the shackle's lash.

 

[MaranaF]

I always carry a knife... And I have one strapped at the foot of the mast and one on the transom. Might be overkill but have sailed loads of small boats that are prone to being up the wrong way. I also worked as a safety boat driver and rescuer at the UKs biggest inland lake and while there witnessed many accidents and the use of many knives.

My boat is a big heavy 50ft ketch but I still have the lives there and have used them!

 

[Ross]

I have carried a pocket knife since was old enough to not loose it. But if could be hard to get into action under water. I should have a sheath knife for when I am on the boat.

 

[Scott B]

After reading the sad story of the sailors lost in the Chicago/Mac race, I had to wonder about something. From what I made of the story, the two who drowned did everything right, but could not get themselves loose from their tethers.

From Sailing-Anarchy, and someone close to the 2 lost

Memorial services for Suzanne are tonight and tomorrow in Saginaw. I've heard Mark's will be next Friday the 29th. I did learn that Suzanne did not drown - no water in her lungs. She hit her head hard and was gone before she hit the water.

and from an interview with the co-owner of Wingnut

Co-owner Dent from interview in Saginaw MI newspaper.
...Dent said the crew eventually dropped the boat's sail and clipped their safety harnesses to the WingNuts. All were wearing flotation devices. We were all hunkered down and enjoying the lightning storm, he said. We didn't expect it would get much worse, Dent said.

Then this one sail got us, picked us up and pushed us straight over. Without warning, WingNuts flipped to its right and capsized, sending its tethered crew into the water, Dent said. Usually, if the boat tips, it would right itself right away, said Dent, who recalls a similar severe storm hitting the WingNuts during its first Chicago race. I couldn't say why it didn't (right itself) this time. I've thought about it a million times, and I'm sure people will be discussing for months what happened.

So, yes it is a good idea to carry a knife, but also not to make assumptions until all the facts are known.

 

[thinwater]

I have carried a pocket knife since was old enough to not loose it. But if could be hard to get into action under water. I should have a sheath knife for when I am on the boat.

The second question--just for fun, honest--is whether a sheather knife is statistically more likely to save me or stab me. Speaking for myself alone, perhaps I'm safer with the knife I keep a the helm.

 

[DannyS]

Not always, but when I'm solo...

I have one clipped on my PFD with a tether as long as my arm so I can cut anything and not lose it! I also carry my handheld VHF in my PFD as well as my strobe light on my chest. Sorry about the double photos of me, I'm not that vain but they show my "gear".
Oh yeah, harnessed and tethered as well.

 

[kenn]

I always had my Victronox helmsman knife (swiss army knife) with me until I forgot that it was in my pocket at an airport and I had to give it up.

I always have a Davis rigging knife on me when on the boat.

(stupid airport rules :cussing: )

I have a Victorinox "skipper" knife, bought in Switzerland during a European trip. Has a few more doodads than the skipper. i call it my Swiss Navy knife.

We put knife pouches on our inflatable PFDs and I've put rigging knives in them. So we always have'em.

Our harness tethers have quick-release shackles on the 'person' side.