'93 P42 Sanitation hose replacement

Jun 21, 2022
23
Hunter Passage 42 Parkside Marina, Md
The previous owner of my boat replaced just the last 4 feet of his sanitation hose and I am going to replace all of it. Looking at the diagrams in my owner's manual I do not see a vented loop in either of my discharge hoses and of course not all of the hose is visible. Can anyone confirm if there is a vented loop?
 
Jan 4, 2006
7,223
Hunter 310 West Vancouver, B.C.
Looking at the waste water drawing :

1693767650384.png


................. the only vented loop would be for the sea water inlet to any head as it could find itself below sea level and the bowl is not a sealed vessel. It is not clear if a forward head is included in this model of Hunter, but if it is, it must be treated the same as the aft head with a vented loop on the sea water inlet :

1693769274680.png


The macerator pump does not require a vented loop as the holding tank is a sealed vessel.

The head sink(s) and galley sink(s) drains do not require a vented loop as they are well above sea level.
 
Jun 21, 2022
23
Hunter Passage 42 Parkside Marina, Md
It flows into a "catch" in the bilge with its own bilge pump. The only lines into the holding tank are from both heads.
I did not think there was a vented loop anywhere but in the intake lines.
I am about to attempt to install a new sanitation hose starting with the forward head. I am guestimating the run at no more than 15 ft. Any help on whether I am accurate or not is appreciated
 
Dec 2, 1997
8,926
- - LIttle Rock
The intake vented loop is in the wrong place. As you'll see in the installation instructions for every manual toilet, it' belongs between the pump and bowl, which requires replacing the short piece of hose the toilet mfrs used to connect them two pieces of hose long enough to put it 6-8" above water line AT MAX HEEL, not just when the boat is at rest...which on most sailboats puts it 2-3 FEET above the bowl.

Ralph, I'm guessing that your waste water plumbing drawing shows a vacuum breaker instead of the air valve should be in that vented loop because it is in the wrong place and you--or maybe Hunter--found it necessary because otherwise it would interfere with the toilet's ability to prime.

--Peggie
 
  • Like
Likes: SailorShaggy
Dec 2, 1997
8,926
- - LIttle Rock
The previous owner of my boat replaced just the last 4 feet of his sanitation hose and I am going to replace all of it. Looking at the diagrams in my owner's manual I do not see a vented loop in either of my discharge hoses and of course not all of the hose is visible. Can anyone confirm if there is a vented loop?
Hi Shaggy! Vented loops are not needed in any toilet discharge line that ONLY goes to the holding tank. They are needed in any line that connects to a below-waterline thru-hull...toilet direct overboard discharge and/or holding tank overboard discharge and they need to be at least 6-8" above waterline AT MAX HEEL, same as the one in the toilet intake line.

I strongly recommend that you go with Raritan SaniFlex hose for everything except your tank vent line and toilet intake line....it's the top rated sanitation hose, has a 10 year warranty against odor permeation and has the added advantage of being so flexible it can be bent almost as a tight as a hairpin without kinking....which makes most re-hosing jobs a LOT easier. Available in 1" and 1.5". Defender has it for the best price and I've read they have free shipping for $100+ orders. Raritan Sani / Flex Sanitation Hose at Defender

You can use Shields or Trident #148 flex PVC (the cheapest sanitation hose) for the vent and toilet intake lines.

--Peggie
 
Last edited:
Dec 25, 2000
5,919
Hunter Passage 42 Shelter Bay, WA
Can anyone confirm if there is a vented loop?
No vented loop on the discharge lines (not needed IMHO), but do on the intake lines. The one for the forward head is located through a removable panel. Go to the most forward cupboard in the main cabin and on the left hand side of it you will see a removable panel. The vented loop is in there. The one for the aft cabin is in the engine room; and it is not the one on the starboard bulkhead next to our Genset. That is the one for the main engine.

As far as the length of discharge hose for the forward head, 15' might be a safe bet. I have replaced our aft cabin discharge hose due to a clog. That was quite the ordeal. And the aft shower drains into a sump box below the companion way steps.

The overboard discharge macerator pump does not have a vent loop and does not need one IMHO. Others might disagree, but as long as you keep the valve closed until needed, and close it when finished, no problem. If you leave it open it will fill the holding tank as it is below the waterline. Ditto the sea water valves for incoming flushing. Those I keep closed until needed.

Please let me know what else you would like to know about the P42; a most wonderful vessel.
 
Last edited:
  • Helpful
Likes: SailorShaggy
Jun 21, 2022
23
Hunter Passage 42 Parkside Marina, Md
No vented loop on the discharge lines (not needed IMHO), but do on the intake lines. The one for the forward head is located through a removable panel. Go to the most forward cupboard in the main cabin and on the left hand side of it you will see a removable panel. The vented loop is in there. The one for the aft cabin is in the engine room; and it is not the one on the starboard bulkhead next to our Genset. That is the one for the main engine.

As far as the length of discharge hose for the forward head, 15' might be a safe bet. I have replaced our aft cabin discharge hose due to a clog. That was quite the ordeal. And the aft shower drains into a sump box below the companion way steps.

The overboard discharge macerator pump does not have a vent loop and does not need one IMHO. Others might disagree, but along as you keep the valve closed until needed, and close it when finished, no problem. If you leave it open it will fill the holding tank as it is below the waterline.

Please let me know what else you would like to know about the P42; a most wonderful vessel.
just placed my order for 15 ft of the Saniflex from Defender and plan on doing the work this weekend as long as the hose arrives.
 
Jan 4, 2006
7,223
Hunter 310 West Vancouver, B.C.
Ralph, I'm guessing that your waste water plumbing drawing shows a vacuum breaker instead of the air valve should be in that vented loop because it is in the wrong place
Just typing faster than I'm thinking because my vacuum breaker is exactly where you describe it in the loop, between the pump discharge and the bowl.

My only other defense for this gaff is that I was in the process of breaking up a fight between our parrot and rabbit. The rabbit had a piece of apple and the parrot wanted the apple just because the rabbit had it first. Everybody has their own %$^#& piece of apple. Worse than little kids.

1693802419434.png


I see in the Passage 42 setup, an electric air inlet valve is required and NOT a vacuum breaker because obviously a vacuum breaker wouldn't stay closed on the pump intake in this application. A less than ideal setup IMO as it just adds another electrical device to fail. A vacuum breaker on the pump discharge would be a simpler installation. My loop is located within a back wall to eliminate the loop and breaker being LOCATED out beside the head.

1693803894294.png
 
Last edited:
Dec 25, 2000
5,919
Hunter Passage 42 Shelter Bay, WA
just placed my order for 15 ft of the Saniflex from Defender and plan on doing the work this weekend as long as the hose arrives.
To replace the old with the new, at the toilet end use a nylon barbed butt connector fitting, then wrap with electrician tape to make sure they do not separate. Wipe on some lubricate to the new to help with sliding through. Have one crew push the new while the other pulls the old out. Should go smoothly. At least it did when I replaced the aft cabin discharge hose.

One other thing. Before I connected the discharge hose to the toilet, I placed a high loop in the hose, maybe six or seven inches. What that does is after flushing, that will leave enough water in the bowl for the next use. Without that loop, the pump will empty the bowl leaving no water. I found this out by accident, but it sure makes a big difference. The joker valve on our toilets, due to age, do not work very well, and being a proprietary device, no replacements available.

Please let us know the outcome.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Likes: SailorShaggy
Dec 2, 1997
8,926
- - LIttle Rock
There's a reason why marine toilets aren't designed to hold water in the bowl: heeling and rough water can send the water all over the head. As long as you're ok with that, I see nothing wrong with your plan.

As for your reason for keeping a worn out joker valve... toilet pumps have finite lifespans--rubber parts wear out but they're replaceable. However, the inside of the pump cylinder also wears, preventing even new seals, o-rings from performing efficiently even if you can still get them. Jabsco replacement pumps cost very more than a "service kit" that no longer includes a joker valve that fits your plumbing and who knows what else isn't a GOOD fit...so what's preventing you from replacing the pump??? I know many people who replace Jabsco manual pumps annually as preventive maintenance!

--Peggie
 
Dec 2, 1997
8,926
- - LIttle Rock
I am guestimating the run at no more than 15 ft
Most marine toilets can only move bowl contents up to about 6' without a LOT of help from gravity. You can create that help with a high loop in the discharge line immediately after the toilet (easy to do with SaniFlex hose). Aim the discharge fitting straight up and run the hose to create a loop that's at least 2 feet above the bowl (even higher would be better but no higher than 4' cuz that's as far as your toilet can lift). You'll only have to pump long enough to move bowl contents over the top of the loop...gravity will get them the rest of the way to the tank. You can even use the dry mode, followed by enough water to rinse behind the flush.
I hope you bought enough hose to do this unless it's already a downhill run from the toilet to the tank, which would be very unusual on a sailboat.

--Peggie
 
Jan 4, 2006
7,223
Hunter 310 West Vancouver, B.C.
@Terry Cox , do you have the electrically operated air valve on your sea water inlet located in a loop immediately after the thru hull :

1693843479300.png


or is it a vacuum breaker located in a loop and situated after the pump :

1693843965997.png
 
Dec 25, 2000
5,919
Hunter Passage 42 Shelter Bay, WA
As for your reason for keeping a worn out joker valve..
Jabsco no longer makes the proprietary joker valve that fits our toilet. Even the smallest do not fit. No worries, as the toilet works just fine.

so what's preventing you from replacing the pump
The macerator motor assembly (not really a pump) works just fine, so no need to replace. And no leaks.

However, the inside of the pump cylinder also wears, preventing even new seals, o-rings from performing efficiently even if you can still get them.
Our toilet electric macerator has no cylinders. The motor shaft and fixed metal assembly works much like a blender that also brings in sea water as it spits bowl contents out the discharge hose. Pretty simple and effective.

You can even use the dry mode, followed by enough water to rinse behind the flush.
These Jabsco electric toilets have no dry mode. Either the sea water valve is open or closed. In order to achieve a dry toilet I have to close the valve and then run the flush motor until dry. Normally, that is what I do after each cruise where I flush two gallons of fresh water to clear the hose of any remaining material. The aft discharge hose does not gravity feed all the way to the tank. There is a hose low point to the stringer that encloses the tank. The hose then rises about ten inches to cross through the stringer and into the tank. That is where the clog was that I covered in a previous thread. My thought was that the PO, over time, did not clear the hose with fresh water, which caused the clog to form in the first place.

Whoever designed the toilets for our boat was a genius. Using a proprietary joker valve was not the best idea, but in the scope of the macerator operation, it is simple, effective and no parts to wear out, other than the motor itself. The old joker valve seems to have not effect on toilet operation.
 
  • Like
Likes: SailorShaggy
Dec 25, 2000
5,919
Hunter Passage 42 Shelter Bay, WA
@Terry Cox , do you have the electrically operated air valve on your sea water inlet located in a loop immediately after the thru hull :

Hi Ralph. I think so. Unable to say for sure, as I've never really dug into it. The forward head valve is in a difficult location and as long as the toilet works, no need to pursue its operation.

View attachment 219528

or is it a vacuum breaker located in a loop and situated after the pump :

View attachment 219530
 
  • Like
Likes: SailorShaggy
Jan 4, 2006
7,223
Hunter 310 West Vancouver, B.C.
The forward head valve is in a difficult location and as long as the toilet works, no need to pursue its operation.

Just sat say a little prayer before seating yourself and you should be good to go :laugh: ! Thanks.
 
Dec 2, 1997
8,926
- - LIttle Rock
The macerator motor assembly (not really a pump) works just fine, so no need to replace.
Oops...where did I get the idea your toilet was a Jabsco manual??? However I'm pretty sure that your toilet does have a PUMP/motor assembly..the macerator is only a device that has a lot in common with a blender blade. The pump is a couple of impellers that pull waste out of the bowl and push it down the discharge line.

--Peggie
 
Last edited: