60a Solar Array at Costco

[sinnettc]

We had to go to Costco (Albany, OR) for some stuff tonight and I saw a new offering: They have a 60 amp (4x 15a panel) solar array with a smart controller, 110 inverter and maybe a battery for under $300. The "mount" appears to be a folding PVC "A" frame.

I've got a single 20a panel and controller that ran me $200 last summer that does ok keeping my batteries topped off between sailing weekends. If I thought I had room to mount/store it on a Capri 22 I'd go buy one of the 4 panel arrays and really juice things up.

Chris

 

[Hermit Scott]

Do you mean watt not amp?

 

[Joe]

did you have a question?

http://www.costco.com/Browse/Produc...ogName:BC&lang=en-US&Sp=C&search=solar&topnav=

 

[sailingdog]

I seriously doubt that coleman 60 WATT array would last any significant time on a boat. I've found that generally going cheap is more expensive than getting the proper parts in the first place.

 

[Brian Schwerdt]

Do you really have space for an array of that size? I am having a hard time placing a small 5W panel on my O'Day 22, which is about the same size. I'd love to see a picture of where you mount your current panel.

 

[ish]

I seriously doubt that coleman 60 WATT array would last any significant time on a boat. I've found that generally going cheap is more expensive than getting the proper parts in the first place.

While I wouldn't dispute the general sentiment here, I believe the Coleman panels are simply re-branded ICP panels, the same as the Sunsei devices that many boaters already use quite happily. I've had one of the smaller versions aboard for two years with no problems, even after frequent dousings. IIRC when I worked it out at the time, if the thing holds out for even four years but then breaks and I have to buy another, I still come out ahead. But so far, no sign of problems.

I think some degree of healthy skepticism is appropriate when it comes to many "marinized" products. There are some things I won't skimp on, but more often than not I have been pleasantly surprised at the durability of off-the-shelf Costco/Home Depot/generic hardware store equipment on the boat, where the "marine" equivalent sometimes costs twice as much.

 

[sinnettc]

ACK! Watts not Amps!

Sorry, yes, it was Watts not Amps. Still not a bad deal. They do have a 246w/30 2-panel setup online for a lot more money than I've got.

 

[Hermit Scott]

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200373666_200373666
I might buy this generator rather than honda 2000 eu. It is half price. And it is briggs and stratton not (china co-night flyer LLC). I need to check the unit out a little more, but so far I like what I see.
With this you could run a TV, playstation, air conditioner, and your bow thrusters with no problem! I assume you're not a live aboard so if you want power right now I think a generator would be the best bang for your buck.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Lower cost (yikes!) generators - beware

I might buy this generator rather than honda 2000 eu. It is half price.

You might want to check out this thread and also read the embedded links in it, for info: http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,4862.0.html

And he's got a 22 foot boat - storage could be an issue!

 

[Anchor Down]

ish is Such an Ish

ish is right: I visited the Costco site, found the product, downloaded the pdf, visited the referenced "colemansolar.com" link given on that, and my browser was re-directed to http://www.sunsei.com/coleman , where this product is listed as "Coleman Backup Power Kit CL-3600" about halfway down the page. It's Sunsei equipment.

Here's the parts list (for the panels) from the Costco site:
• (3) x 1.3A (20W) solar panels that provide up to 3.9A (60W) of charging power
• LED charging indicator on panels
• 4A charge controller with battery status indicator to protect and prevent overcharging your battery
• Plug’n’Play for quick connections, cigarette lighter adapter, battery clamp connector & 3 in 1 wire junction harness
• (3) Mounting screw sets

The quality question seems to have been answered.

So, three interconnecting 20w Sunsei panels, charge controller, wiring, and a small inverter for $320, shipping included.

It's listed at $399 plus shipping at Sunsei; at Costco the price is $319, shipping included. Let's call it a $100 difference, for argument's sake.

Good deal?

 

[Cpt. Jon]

And it is briggs and stratton not (china co-night flyer LLC).

I was under the impression that Briggs and Stratton is pretty much all made in china now. I might be wrong though. Also, I don't see the noise level on that genny, I've looked around a lot for anything comprable to powerwise and as quiet at the Honda 2000 and have yet to find anything. I'm probably going to have to pony up the money for the honda IF I end up deciding I want one...

 

[Hermit Scott]

It's absolutely made in china, but I can get parts for that engine right up the street. Could you say the same for the harbor freight generator's engine.
Yes the noise issue could very well be worth the extra $500. This is a brand new unit on the site, so no reviews yet. It appears to be competition for the honda 2000. Which needs some at the price they have on it.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Briggs & Stratton cheaper generator

Also, I don't see the noise level on that genny,

I also don't see the weight! That was an important issue in the link I just provided. Heck, if it's got wheels as an option....just sayin', ya know...

 

[Hermit Scott]

it does say lightweight design and ultra-quiet design. I can't find specs on it any where. quiet is a realative term, quiter than a honda 2000 or quiter than a very quiet freight train?
I was looking at solar panels also. I have decided to add a generator first. For the same reason I chose to fix the engine and realted parts before I worried about sailing parts.

 

[Bill Roosa]

Best casing a solar set up

Couple of things:
solar only works during the day so you are going to discharge your batteries at night to have things running then. This discharge causes a reduction in battery life with 1 deep discharge shortening life more than 2 discharges of half the amount.
I'd estimate that you only get 100% output for an hour a day. The two hours around that you might get 70% and the two hours on either side of that you will only get 40% The output falls off dramatically as the angel the sunlight hits the panel increases from directly overhead. Soooo...
Time output% Amps out
0600 0% 0
0700 10% .39
0800 15% .58
0900 20% .78
1000 40% 1.56
1100 70% 2.73
1200 100% 3.90
1300 70% 2.73
1400 40% 1.56
1500 20% .78
1600 15% .58
1700 10% .39
1800 0% 0

Total AH out per perfectly sunny day 15.98 AH at best with no shading of the panels and no clouds. An anchor light alone will be drawing 2 amps for 12 hours or 24 AH. Not a cruising solution. Weekend sailor, possibly but then you would need to be on a mooring to not have shore power available to even want to go this route. A good battery charger is a better buy.

There are better and cheaper ways to make power on a boat!

 

[Bob J.]

As someone that is involved in the renewable energy business I would say don't do it, it's a trick. If you were ever planning on installing a solar system on a boat be sure to use top quality componets that have a track record.

We have a saying here at our company, you get what you pay for & when it comes to renewable energy it really is the truth.

 

[sinnettc]

Wow, this has been an interesting thread . . . I was posting the Costco info as an FYI - With a Capri 22 storage is at a premium and a 4 panel array just won't fit in my boat.

I am a weekend sailor, though we may do a week in the Puget Sound area at some point. The one 20w Sunsei panel seems to do a decent job of recharging the battery after a weekend that may see a single night on the hook or tied up at the marina depending on the wind and the Admiral's mood (portapotty vs real potty).

The comments regarding generators are interesting and informative. I know Dad ran a small gen set on the Bristol 24 that he eventually "built in". Not sure what he did on the Pearson 34 that he & my step-mom cruised up & down the intercoastal on. It had a diesel so maybe that was their generator. I can see getting a *really* small one for Verboten if we decide to do the Puget Sound thing next year, cuz even with a conversion to LED nav lights (did the cabin last weekend), a chart plotter (on my xmas list), depth sounder, etc. will eat up the batteries. From what I hear some of the smaller ones are pretty quiet. I may have an alternator(?) put on the 4hp Merc too, though I'm not too keen on motorsailing half the day just to charge the battery . . . 8^/

Speaking of generators, Dad switched from water yacht to land yacht (5th wheel) last year and ended up running 2 small generators in parallel instead of 1 large one because of the weight. I think he said he ended up with 2-2000 watt generators for less $, much less weight, and more power than the 3000 watt he was originally looking at. He did have to buy some kind of $pendy doodad to make them play nice together but I think the overall cost was still less than the 3K gen.

Anyway, thanks for all the input & discussion.

Chris

 

[sailingdog]

Bill—

Just FYI, the typical solar panel on average gives the equivalent of FIVE hours of full output a day...This is the number that is generally used when calculating things like daily amp-hour output AFAIK. Of course, where you are on the planet, what time of year, and how the panels are angled can have some effect, but in general, the five hour rule is a pretty safe estimate.

Couple of things:
solar only works during the day so you are going to discharge your batteries at night to have things running then. This discharge causes a reduction in battery life with 1 deep discharge shortening life more than 2 discharges of half the amount.
I'd estimate that you only get 100% output for an hour a day. The two hours around that you might get 70% and the two hours on either side of that you will only get 40% The output falls off dramatically as the angel the sunlight hits the panel increases from directly overhead. Soooo...
Time output% Amps out
0600 0% 0
0700 10% .39
0800 15% .58
0900 20% .78
1000 40% 1.56
1100 70% 2.73
1200 100% 3.90
1300 70% 2.73
1400 40% 1.56
1500 20% .78
1600 15% .58
1700 10% .39
1800 0% 0

Total AH out per perfectly sunny day 15.98 AH at best with no shading of the panels and no clouds. An anchor light alone will be drawing 2 amps for 12 hours or 24 AH. Not a cruising solution. Weekend sailor, possibly but then you would need to be on a mooring to not have shore power available to even want to go this route. A good battery charger is a better buy.

There are better and cheaper ways to make power on a boat!

 

[Cpt. Jon]

It's absolutely made in china, but I can get parts for that engine right up the street. Could you say the same for the harbor freight generator's engine.

Ah, I read ya. I do have a B&S pressure washer, might be the first brand new combustion engine I have ever owned... works great and no complaints, so I wouldn't be against buying a genny from them if it wasn't too loud or heavy.

 

[Nereussailor]

I guess my question would be if they are amorphous or crystalline panels. The amorphous panels, in my understanding don't last very long.
I would think that a company like Coleman, which has a track record that is pretty reliable, would have done the research before marketing the product with their name on it. Think about it, have you ever bought a product with the Coleman name on it that was junk? I still have my grandfathers Coleman lantern and camp stove and both my dad and my grandfather have passed on years ago.
I don't see any "Tricks", just research what type of solar panel they are. There are many solar panels on the market, and there is going to be a lot more in the near future. Check around, look at quality and products, and see what you come up with. Just my 2 cents.

Dave