6" Recessed LED Light Fixture

[Wisp]

So I had a burned out 6" recessed LED in my daughter's cabin. When I purchased a new one to replace it, the site mentioned that the replacement lights were in lieu of the older design which was discontinued.

Now that I've got it onboard, I'm a bit reluctant to start drilling holes in the overhead to install the new light. Has anyone found a way to use the 'friction' installation bracket on the older model to install the newer light?

TS

 

[Phil Herring]

Hi Wisp,

This replacement situation is new and you're one of the first to go through the process.

Here's the replacement light compared to the original:

http://shop.hunterowners.com/hp/part.php?m=45cc&c=5&p=54231

The original is a CCF light made by Taylorbrite that has been discontinued. (There were still a handful of them left last I checked so if anyone really wants to grab an original do it now...)

The original uses friction -- 2 springs -- to secure the fixture to the liner. The replacement we found is an LED unit that is the same size, lower profile, and uses screws to mount to the liner.

 

[RHUMB RUNNER]

If you use them in the main cabin I think you will have a problem with the dimmer. CCF vs LED

 

[Phil Herring]

That's a good point, they may not work with the LED. The dimmers have been discontinued too and I believe that inventory is gone.

We may still be able to get a spec on the dimmer from Taylor but usually these companies deny any knowledge of their discontinued models. If anyone has an overall size and cutout dimensions of the dimmer clusters let me know and I'll see what we can come up with for a replacement.

 

[Wisp]

Hi Wisp,

The original is a CCF light made by Taylorbrite that has been discontinued. (There were still a handful of them left last I checked so if anyone really wants to grab an original do it now...)

Yeah, that's the one. So, how do I go about getting one of the few originals left in stock? When I ordered the light, only the new, low profile light seemed to be available.

TS.

 

[RHUMB RUNNER]

I replaced the main cabin lights with LED's used the same 6" round lights and glued three 15 disk LED's in them.The Taylorbrite dimmer would dim but would not bring the LED's to full brightness. I replaced the dimmer with a Blue Sea. I now have 3 times the light as the ccf's, with less than a half amp per light.

 

[RHUMB RUNNER]

These our the lights that I modified.

 

[Wisp]

I wish you were out in DC. I'd hire you to do the same to Wisp!

TS

 

[Brezzin]

Nice job RR. Can you post the part numbers and source for those little led disks. And part number for the dimmer.

 

[RHUMB RUNNER]

The reading lights our Dr. LED MR 3W MK II 12V. Remove all of the ccf light. The ring on the Dr. LED's can be unscrew and painted any color you what, I choose black or you can leave them white. Used gap forming instant glue, put the light in the ring and glued from the back. Used sockets from Super Bright LED's Inc. Socket- GX5.3/GZ4 $ 1.95 each.

On to the 6" overheads. Used from Imtra Marine Products ILSPG4-15W-B Corona LED Bulb, G4 10-30VDC, Warm 15 x LED, Side Pin. Remove the light, the body will come out of the mounting ring. Don't loose the O ring. Take an x-acto knife and run it around the back of back cover, this should come off fairly easy. The front lens is just put in with pressure. Remove all the ccf light and ballast. I made a paper temp-let to space the 3 light disks evenly around the circle. Then I drilled 3 1-1/2 holes in the plastic and 1 2-1/8 hole in the center, cut away all the plastic stand offs. Instant glue the three LED disks into the holes. Used the same sockets as the reading lights. Used the wires with the lights so I had the same plugs to attach on the boat. You will only use two wires in the headliner. One ground and the one blue wire that dims, the other blue wire is 12v's all the time for the old ccf ballast.
The old dimmer is part of the Taylor-bright system you must use a different dimmer. I used a Blue Sea Systems PN 7506 Deckhand dimmer Plus I replaced the three switches on the pannel with Blue Sea. 1-#8231 on/off for the lights and 1 #8216 bright/dim switch, you can set your brightness and then turn all off and on. I then replaced the red safety light switch to match another #8231. The dimmer just lays in behind the switches, you wire it up right at the switches for all the overhead lights. Very simple. Mounting the switches is a bit tricky Blue Sea sells a three gang mounting plate I had to do a lot of Drumel work to get it in, but it can be done. and you have all three switches in the same place. You will be amazed at how much more light you get. Good Luck and let me know how it turned out

 

[artboas]

You have a problem

The reading lights our Dr. LED MR 3W MK II 12V. Remove all of the ccf light. The ring on the Dr. LED's can be unscrew and painted any color you what, I choose black or you can leave them white. Used gap forming instant glue, put the light in the ring and glued from the back. Used sockets from Super Bright LED's Inc. Socket- GX5.3/GZ4 $ 1.95 each.

On to the 6" overheads. Used from Imtra Marine Products ILSPG4-15W-B Corona LED Bulb, G4 10-30VDC, Warm 15 x LED, Side Pin. Remove the light, the body will come out of the mounting ring. Don't loose the O ring. Take an x-acto knife and run it around the back of back cover, this should come off fairly easy. The front lens is just put in with pressure. Remove all the ccf light and ballast. I made a paper temp-let to space the 3 light disks evenly around the circle. Then I drilled 3 1-1/2 holes in the plastic and 1 2-1/8 hole in the center, cut away all the plastic stand offs. Instant glue the three LED disks into the holes. Used the same sockets as the reading lights. Used the wires with the lights so I had the same plugs to attach on the boat. You will only use two wires in the headliner. One ground and the one blue wire that dims, the other blue wire is 12v's all the time for the old ccf ballast.
The old dimmer is part of the Taylor-bright system you must use a different dimmer. I used a Blue Sea Systems PN 7506 Deckhand dimmer Plus I replaced the three switches on the pannel with Blue Sea. 1-#8231 on/off for the lights and 1 #8216 bright/dim switch, you can set your brightness and then turn all off and on. I then replaced the red safety light switch to match another #8231. The dimmer just lays in behind the switches, you wire it up right at the switches for all the overhead lights. Very simple. Mounting the switches is a bit tricky Blue Sea sells a three gang mounting plate I had to do a lot of Drumel work to get it in, but it can be done. and you have all three switches in the same place. You will be amazed at how much more light you get. Good Luck and let me know how it turned out

There are several issues:
Firstly, the color temperature of the original ccfl fixtures and the new led are totally different. If you put in a led fixture, it will stick out like a sore thumb

Secondly, the dimmer for the ccfl is a rather simple PWM (pulse width modulation ) low level signal that goes from approx 50% duty cycle to 100%. I put a scope on it awhile ago to measure.
The led and ccfl will react totally differently to the duty cycle.

You have 2 choices:
Buy a few of the remaining stock of ccfl lamps ( I bought 4)
Or
Switch them all over to led.
The lifetime of the led bulbs is huge, so it's a one time investment.
I am not 100% sure if the original dimmer is specified to run tge led fixtures, but I suspect it does. I would think they kept it compatible with the Pwm specs of earlier fixtures

The modification that Rhimb Runner did is neat, but unless you are as handy as he is with this stuff, better of buying tge fixtures off the shelf
As far as mounting with 2 screws, this is simple.
Just put the fixture in place, and drill 2 small (1/8") holes
Self tapping screws hold the light in easily

Good luck

 

[artboas]

Ok, another problem

There are several issues:
Firstly, the color temperature of the original ccfl fixtures and the new led are totally different. If you put in a led fixture, it will stick out like a sore thumb

Secondly, the dimmer for the ccfl is a rather simple PWM (pulse width modulation ) low level signal that goes from approx 50% duty cycle to 100%. I put a scope on it awhile ago to measure.
The led and ccfl will react totally differently to the duty cycle.

You have 2 choices:
Buy a few of the remaining stock of ccfl lamps ( I bought 4)
Or
Switch them all over to led.
The lifetime of the led bulbs is huge, so it's a one time investment.
I am not 100% sure if the original dimmer is specified to run tge led fixtures, but I suspect it does. I would think they kept it compatible with the Pwm specs of earlier fixtures

The modification that Rhimb Runner did is neat, but unless you are as handy as he is with this stuff, better of buying tge fixtures off the shelf
As far as mounting with 2 screws, this is simple.
Just put the fixture in place, and drill 2 small (1/8") holes
Self tapping screws hold the light in easily

Good luck

I just looked at the fixture. 2 wires only.
Which means that it us a straight led fixture with no dimming.

It won't work with the taylorbrite dimmer.
Keeping your life really simple, go buy a few remaining ccfl units.

 

[RHUMB RUNNER]

Re: Ok, another problem

The aft cabin lights our two wires. the main cabin has three. 3 times the brightness with the LED's.

 

[artboas]

Aft cabin versus main

The aft cabin lights our two wires. the main cabin has three. 3 times the brightness with the LED's.

Hi there,
The fixture has 3 wires coming out of it;
Pos, neg, and dimming control.
In the aft cabins there is no dimmer.
To use these lights without a dimmer, you connect the dimmer control lead to 12v +.
I believe that the led replacement fixtures are perfect for the aft cabins, but in the main salon it's a problem, as they aren't compatible with the existing CCFL fixtures.
There is a very inexpensive and easy way to convert the main salon fixtures.
I touch complicated, so bear with me...
On the main cabin fixtures, they are all connected with 3 wires:
The +, -, and brightness control.
You can buy on ebay a very inexpensive LED wireless remote control.
The cost is about $6. It can easily run 10 Amps of current in the receiver.
So, here is what you do:
Take out all of the old ccfl fixtures
Wire the new led fixtures as follows:
The boat's yellow wire is neg (-). Connect all the fixture neg wires to the yellow wires.
The boat's blue wires are cabin light (+) 12v.
At any one of the lights, connect the input of the wireless receiver to it.(you will bury the receiver in the headliner at this location)
Then connect the output of the receiver to the dimmer control wire that is running between each fixture. Also connect this to the + (red ) wire of the led fixture where you are installing the receiver.
Then, at all the other fixtures, connect what was the dimmer control wire to the red (+) of all the led fixtures.
The blue (12v+) is not connected. Be sure to tape the end of it.
So, essentially what you are doing is using the dimmer wire as the new voltage feed for all the led fixtures.
The remote can be used anywhere in the cabin.
This is an excellent low cost solution, and doesn't involve stringing new wires.
I like this a lot more than using a Blue Seas dimmer because:
It's 100 bucks cheaper
Remote can be anywhere
I'll try and post a photo of the remote

Questions. ????
Contact me

 

[artboas]

Hi there,
The fixture has 3 wires coming out of it;
Pos, neg, and dimming control.
In the aft cabins there is no dimmer.
To use these lights without a dimmer, you connect the dimmer control lead to 12v +.
I believe that the led replacement fixtures are perfect for the aft cabins, but in the main salon it's a problem, as they aren't compatible with the existing CCFL fixtures.
There is a very inexpensive and easy way to convert the main salon fixtures.
I touch complicated, so bear with me...
On the main cabin fixtures, they are all connected with 3 wires:
The +, -, and brightness control.
You can buy on ebay a very inexpensive LED wireless remote control.
The cost is about $6. It can easily run 10 Amps of current in the receiver.
So, here is what you do:
Take out all of the old ccfl fixtures
Wire the new led fixtures as follows:
The boat's yellow wire is neg (-). Connect all the fixture neg wires to the yellow wires.
The boat's blue wires are cabin light (+) 12v.
At any one of the lights, connect the input of the wireless receiver to it.(you will bury the receiver in the headliner at this location)
Then connect the output of the receiver to the dimmer control wire that is running between each fixture. Also connect this to the + (red ) wire of the led fixture where you are installing the receiver.
Then, at all the other fixtures, connect what was the dimmer control wire to the red (+) of all the led fixtures.
The blue (12v+) is not connected. Be sure to tape the end of it.
So, essentially what you are doing is using the dimmer wire as the new voltage feed for all the led fixtures.
The remote can be used anywhere in the cabin.
This is an excellent low cost solution, and doesn't involve stringing new wires.
I like this a lot more than using a Blue Seas dimmer because:
It's 100 bucks cheaper
Remote can be anywhere
I'll try and post a photo of the remote

Questions. ????
Contact me

Here is the remote
Cheap & cheerful!!

 

[Brezzin]

I like this idea!
My wife's wants to set odds on how long it would take me to lose the remote.

 

[artboas]

The remotes are cheap. Less than 6 bucks

I like this idea!
My wife's wants to set odds on how long it would take me to lose the remote.

If you are going to implement, let me know.
A few in depth tech points to be observed.
The original 6" round ccfl lights were junk
I have totally redone my salon & fwd cabin.
I will include photos .
It is stunning

 

[Brezzin]

I agree that those CCFL lights were junk, and expensive too. I probably will switch over to LED's but I'll do it slowly leaving the main salon for last.

 

[RHUMB RUNNER]

Here is a copy of my original posts,
I replaced the main cabin lights with LED's used the same 6" round lights and glued three 15 disk LED's in them.The Taylorbrite dimmer would dim but would not bring the LED's to full brightness. I replaced the dimmer with a Blue Sea. I now have 3 times the light as the ccf's, with less than a half amp per light.
The reading lights our Dr. LED MR 3W MK II 12V. Remove all of the ccf light. The ring on the Dr. LED's can be unscrew and painted any color you what, I choose black or you can leave them white. Used gap forming instant glue, put the light in the ring and glued from the back. Used sockets from Super Bright LED's Inc. Socket- GX5.3/GZ4 $ 1.95 each.

On to the 6" overheads. Used from Imtra Marine Products ILSPG4-15W-B Corona LED Bulb, G4 10-30VDC, Warm 15 x LED, Side Pin. Remove the light, the body will come out of the mounting ring. Don't loose the O ring. Take an x-acto knife and run it around the back of back cover, this should come off fairly easy. The front lens is just put in with pressure. Remove all the ccf light and ballast. I made a paper temp-let to space the 3 light disks evenly around the circle. Then I drilled 3 1-1/2 holes in the plastic and 1 2-1/8 hole in the center, cut away all the plastic stand offs. Instant glue the three LED disks into the holes. Used the same sockets as the reading lights. Used the wires with the lights so I had the same plugs to attach on the boat. You will only use two wires in the headliner. One ground and the one blue wire that dims, the other blue wire is 12v's all the time for the old ccf ballast.
The old dimmer is part of the Taylor-bright system you must use a different dimmer. I used a Blue Sea Systems PN 7506 Deckhand dimmer Plus I replaced the three switches on the pannel with Blue Sea. 1-#8231 on/off for the lights and 1 #8216 bright/dim switch, you can set your brightness and then turn all off and on. I then replaced the red safety light switch to match another #8231. The dimmer just lays in behind the switches, you wire it up right at the switches for all the overhead lights. Very simple. Mounting the switches is a bit tricky Blue Sea sells a three gang mounting plate I had to do a lot of Drumel work to get it in, but it can be done. and you have all three switches in the same place. You will be amazed at how much more light you get. Good Luck and let me know how it turned out.

 

[tkwhalen]

I solved it differently ... I bought the replacement light offered here at sailboat owners that has the screw mounts ... the lights have the same circumference of the old lights ... so I took a router and trimmed away the plastic edge that included the screw holes ... with the edge gone the light fixtures themselves are the same size as the old ones and the drop right into the old spring clip bezels ... no screw holes needed and it makes mounting and future servicing easy ... The pictures show 1) the fixture as received before trimming the edge 2) the fixture after trimming the edge 3) the fixture dropped into the bezel from the front and 4) the fixture dropped into the bezel from the back