Just completed my first boat trailering and pack up for the winter. The first modifications that I plan to make is to put some guide tubes on the trailer and add a swim ladder. Getting the keel to line up on the trailer without a guide on the trailer was not fun. It seems to me that these really should be standard on the trailer due to the importance (and difficutly) of getting it right. Any suggestions on the guide tubes - how many and the best way to attaach?
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Jeff Prideaux
216 improvements
The following link shows some of the improvements I have done including trailor guides and swim ladder. Those two were my most usefull improvements.
The following link shows some of the improvements I have done including trailor guides and swim ladder. Those two were my most usefull improvements.
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Ranger Paul
H216 Trailer Guides
Ron, 1) After a year or so, one of my trailer guide cracked. I had always thought they were too wimpy. With a side wind, the guides, although **far** better than no guides, would bend all over the place. The guides are simply a chunk of PVC pipe stuck over a metal support. I went down to Lowe's and bought three different sizes of PVC pipe, stuck them inside each other, used them as my "improved" guide PST, and have been very pleased with the results. Far stiffer and stronger than the original. 2) Watch out for your rub rails. The guides will wear a chunk out in a heartbeat. I now have my guides adjusted such that they lightly touch the rub rails on both sides if I have the trailer perfectly centered. I hot glutted chunks of carpet on the guides where they contact the rub rail and eliminated the wear problem on the rub rail. By having the guides touch the rub rail on both side, I get extra help centering the boat. 3) But, I still find it impossible to center the keel on the keel rest. Without the keel centered, there is significant pressure between the guide and one of the rub rails while on the other side, there is a gap. This weekend I fabricated a "keel centering guide" that I have not tried out as yet (I need to install it without the boat on the trailer). I will be installing it next weekend and it it works, I plan on taking pix and posting my results. If all works out as planned, I will be able to hitch up the bow winch and drive away with no fiddling trying to get the boat centered.
Ron, 1) After a year or so, one of my trailer guide cracked. I had always thought they were too wimpy. With a side wind, the guides, although **far** better than no guides, would bend all over the place. The guides are simply a chunk of PVC pipe stuck over a metal support. I went down to Lowe's and bought three different sizes of PVC pipe, stuck them inside each other, used them as my "improved" guide PST, and have been very pleased with the results. Far stiffer and stronger than the original. 2) Watch out for your rub rails. The guides will wear a chunk out in a heartbeat. I now have my guides adjusted such that they lightly touch the rub rails on both sides if I have the trailer perfectly centered. I hot glutted chunks of carpet on the guides where they contact the rub rail and eliminated the wear problem on the rub rail. By having the guides touch the rub rail on both side, I get extra help centering the boat. 3) But, I still find it impossible to center the keel on the keel rest. Without the keel centered, there is significant pressure between the guide and one of the rub rails while on the other side, there is a gap. This weekend I fabricated a "keel centering guide" that I have not tried out as yet (I need to install it without the boat on the trailer). I will be installing it next weekend and it it works, I plan on taking pix and posting my results. If all works out as planned, I will be able to hitch up the bow winch and drive away with no fiddling trying to get the boat centered.
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Jeff Prideaux
Look forward to seeing if it helps
Paul, I have the same experience as you. Having the guides helps a lot but doesn't totally eliminate the alignment issue. About 50% of the time when pulling the boat out of the water, I have to back down the ramp again, float it off, and try again. While that is better than what I was experiencing before I put guides, on, it is still a pain. I always feel lucky and fortunate when it aligns when I first pull it out of the water. I will follow with great interest if you come up with a full-proof way to always get the keel in the support slot on the trailer. Jeff
Paul, I have the same experience as you. Having the guides helps a lot but doesn't totally eliminate the alignment issue. About 50% of the time when pulling the boat out of the water, I have to back down the ramp again, float it off, and try again. While that is better than what I was experiencing before I put guides, on, it is still a pain. I always feel lucky and fortunate when it aligns when I first pull it out of the water. I will follow with great interest if you come up with a full-proof way to always get the keel in the support slot on the trailer. Jeff
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Ron M
Centerboard guides.
I noticed that the 216 at the Annapolis Boat Show looked like it wasn't properly centered on the trailer. Seemed centerboard was off of the carpeted support board on the trailer. As an h26 owner I remember some posts of people who added centerboard guides to their trailers. Do a search. It might provide some ideas. The lack of a factory ladder on this boat really surprises me. Don't most people like to swim off their boats? Ron Mehringer h26 Hydro-Therapy
I noticed that the 216 at the Annapolis Boat Show looked like it wasn't properly centered on the trailer. Seemed centerboard was off of the carpeted support board on the trailer. As an h26 owner I remember some posts of people who added centerboard guides to their trailers. Do a search. It might provide some ideas. The lack of a factory ladder on this boat really surprises me. Don't most people like to swim off their boats? Ron Mehringer h26 Hydro-Therapy
H216 swim ladder
The lack of a swim ladder and what various H216 owners have done about it has been discussed quite a bit on this forum. Most interested owners install a permanent ladder on the stern and you can look up the posts as to the type of ladder and how it was installed. For myself, though, I really cheaped out. I wasn't fond of adding more hardware to the stern and potentially blocking access, especially in an MOB situation. Instead I bought a 4 (5??) step swim ladder from K-Mart last year on sale for $10. It hooks over the rail and has a couple little support legs part way down the ladder that hinge out and rest against the hull. I had to spread out the hook part a little so it would fit over the rails, I hot glued carpet onto the hook areas where it contacts the hull, and added bigger rubber feet on the short support legs (I think I hot glued rubber cane/crutch feet I got at the hardware store). This works fine for me and, even though it is somewhat bulky, it fits nicely under the seats.
The lack of a swim ladder and what various H216 owners have done about it has been discussed quite a bit on this forum. Most interested owners install a permanent ladder on the stern and you can look up the posts as to the type of ladder and how it was installed. For myself, though, I really cheaped out. I wasn't fond of adding more hardware to the stern and potentially blocking access, especially in an MOB situation. Instead I bought a 4 (5??) step swim ladder from K-Mart last year on sale for $10. It hooks over the rail and has a couple little support legs part way down the ladder that hinge out and rest against the hull. I had to spread out the hook part a little so it would fit over the rails, I hot glued carpet onto the hook areas where it contacts the hull, and added bigger rubber feet on the short support legs (I think I hot glued rubber cane/crutch feet I got at the hardware store). This works fine for me and, even though it is somewhat bulky, it fits nicely under the seats.
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Ron M
MOB
Paul - I think your solution sounds good. Especially considering how much room there is below, under the cockpit seats, for storage. However, I was wondering why you considered a stern mounted swim ladder a hinderence in a MOB situation. If anything, i've always felt that a built in swim ladder provides an extra level of safety, by giving you an instantly deployable device for re-boarding the boat. Just my 2 cents. Ron
Paul - I think your solution sounds good. Especially considering how much room there is below, under the cockpit seats, for storage. However, I was wondering why you considered a stern mounted swim ladder a hinderence in a MOB situation. If anything, i've always felt that a built in swim ladder provides an extra level of safety, by giving you an instantly deployable device for re-boarding the boat. Just my 2 cents. Ron
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Ranger Paul
H216 MOB and swim ladder
Ron, I have a 9.9 hp Nissan outboard (far too big for the boat but the cost was just perfect for me...free...from by brother-in-law when he upgraded his worn out old stinkpot for a 25' Grady White...with only 30 hours on it...eat your hearts out guys) on the stern which is pretty big and takes up a lot of room. If the MOB is still physically active, I can mount my ladder pretty fast. My concern is when the MOB is injured or hypothermic. One possibility is to drag the MOB up over the stern. But, there is not much room with the motor and it would be even more difficult if one side was taken up with a swim ladder. Where would I stand? Is there enough room to grab the MOB and get them on board. With a injured or hypothermic MOB, I plan on dragging them up over the side. I have an 8x1 block and tackle all set for this purpose (made up from my old boom vang that came with the boat). I also carry a Life Sling. Next summer my crew and I plan on doing some real MOB drills. Binit has volunteered to be the MOB provided I loan him my shorty wet suit. I guess then I'll have a better idea how it all works. So, the real answer to your question is that I don't think there is enough room to stand in the stern and drag an MOB on board if the outboard is in the center and a swim ladder is on the other side. Besides, I'm cheap. ;-) Plus, my ladder requires no intrusion into the hull. If I could get a permanent ladder for $10 and someone else mounted it, I'd do it in a heartbeat! I'll fill everyone in next spring on my MOB drills.
Ron, I have a 9.9 hp Nissan outboard (far too big for the boat but the cost was just perfect for me...free...from by brother-in-law when he upgraded his worn out old stinkpot for a 25' Grady White...with only 30 hours on it...eat your hearts out guys) on the stern which is pretty big and takes up a lot of room. If the MOB is still physically active, I can mount my ladder pretty fast. My concern is when the MOB is injured or hypothermic. One possibility is to drag the MOB up over the stern. But, there is not much room with the motor and it would be even more difficult if one side was taken up with a swim ladder. Where would I stand? Is there enough room to grab the MOB and get them on board. With a injured or hypothermic MOB, I plan on dragging them up over the side. I have an 8x1 block and tackle all set for this purpose (made up from my old boom vang that came with the boat). I also carry a Life Sling. Next summer my crew and I plan on doing some real MOB drills. Binit has volunteered to be the MOB provided I loan him my shorty wet suit. I guess then I'll have a better idea how it all works. So, the real answer to your question is that I don't think there is enough room to stand in the stern and drag an MOB on board if the outboard is in the center and a swim ladder is on the other side. Besides, I'm cheap. ;-) Plus, my ladder requires no intrusion into the hull. If I could get a permanent ladder for $10 and someone else mounted it, I'd do it in a heartbeat! I'll fill everyone in next spring on my MOB drills.
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Lamar Sumerlin
MOB - Opinion of the figure 8 drill
Ranger Paul, Since you appear to be well into the MOB situation, I was wondering what your opinion is of the figure 8 drill normally presented in the literature for recovering someone that has fallen overboard. Honestly even though the people that write the text books are the experts and I'm not I wonder about how practical the figure 8 MOB procedure is under most situations. I normally sail on an inland lake and to me the best way to recover someone that has fallen overboard, injured or not, is with the heave too manuever or Quick Stop drill. I would appreciate your opinion on this relative to a coastal situation with which I have little experience. Lamar
Ranger Paul, Since you appear to be well into the MOB situation, I was wondering what your opinion is of the figure 8 drill normally presented in the literature for recovering someone that has fallen overboard. Honestly even though the people that write the text books are the experts and I'm not I wonder about how practical the figure 8 MOB procedure is under most situations. I normally sail on an inland lake and to me the best way to recover someone that has fallen overboard, injured or not, is with the heave too manuever or Quick Stop drill. I would appreciate your opinion on this relative to a coastal situation with which I have little experience. Lamar
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Jeff Prideaux
stern ladder
I'm happy with my stern-mounted folding ladder that is just to the side of my 4HP motor. We have no problem using the ladder with the motor in place. I like the ladder always in place so I can get back in myself if I happen to fall overboard while single-handling (assuming I can get back to the boat). I haven't really thought through, though, pulling someone immobile back into the boat. I'll have to get some of my crew to "play dead" and give it a try. I have my motor mounted on the stock motor mount which is centered at the stern of the boat (factory position). I remember at least one person posting here a year or two ago about moving the motor mount over to the side a bit to give more room for the ladder. That is a thought for those concerned about needing more room particularly of you have a larger sized motor. But then you have to drill more holes, etc. I decided to stick with the factory setup. Jeff
I'm happy with my stern-mounted folding ladder that is just to the side of my 4HP motor. We have no problem using the ladder with the motor in place. I like the ladder always in place so I can get back in myself if I happen to fall overboard while single-handling (assuming I can get back to the boat). I haven't really thought through, though, pulling someone immobile back into the boat. I'll have to get some of my crew to "play dead" and give it a try. I have my motor mounted on the stock motor mount which is centered at the stern of the boat (factory position). I remember at least one person posting here a year or two ago about moving the motor mount over to the side a bit to give more room for the ladder. That is a thought for those concerned about needing more room particularly of you have a larger sized motor. But then you have to drill more holes, etc. I decided to stick with the factory setup. Jeff
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Ranger Paul
MOB - My opinion of the figure 8 drill
Lamar, I am a lake sailor and definitely not a MOB expert. But, I think about it a lot. They have done a lot of MOB exercises in San Francisco bay the last couple years and I have read every article very carefully. Hence, my purchase of the Life Sling which ended up being very highly rated. With the Life Sling, the figure 8 is meaningless as you circle around the back of the MOB exactly like you do with a water skier. I judge there are four vastly different scenarios: 1. Someone on my boat falls overboard. 2. I fall overboard and someone else on the boat is at least partially capable of sailing. 3. I fall overboard and nobody else on the boat knows how to sail. 4. I fall overboard and I was single handing, therefore there is nobody else left on the boat. My current plans: 1. Someone falls overboard. a) Assign someone to glue their eyes on the MOB. b) get someone to drop the floatable cushion in the water. b) Furl the jib. c) Turn around. d) get someone to ready the Life Sling. e) Circle the MOB so they get into the Life Sling. f) Stop the boat and drag the MOB over to the boat. g) Figure out how to get them on board. Unfortunately there are a million variations to this plan. What if the MOB does not have a PFD and is hurt or unconscious? What if I am the only other one on board? What if the wind is howling? Is there a stinkpot nearby and am I better off blowing my air horn and hailing the stinkpot? I don't know the answers to any of the questions. I do know that when I am landing, I have the crew furl the jib so I can concentrate on handling the boat while the crew readies the fenders, yada, yada... This works very well for me and I don't have to depend on having someone else do something to maneuver the boat. Therefore, I think it is a good move to immediately furl the jib giving me total control of the boat and freeing anyone else on board to handle the Life Sling, throwable cushion, swim ladder and block and tackle. My only concern with this is losing speed in a light wind. I think I will still furl the jib and maybe re-deploy it once a course is set. I like the concept of the Life Sling because it is more forgiving. I don't have to stop the boat right next to the MOB. Rather I circle then drag the MOB to the boat. 2. I go overboard. Pray.
Lamar, I am a lake sailor and definitely not a MOB expert. But, I think about it a lot. They have done a lot of MOB exercises in San Francisco bay the last couple years and I have read every article very carefully. Hence, my purchase of the Life Sling which ended up being very highly rated. With the Life Sling, the figure 8 is meaningless as you circle around the back of the MOB exactly like you do with a water skier. I judge there are four vastly different scenarios: 1. Someone on my boat falls overboard. 2. I fall overboard and someone else on the boat is at least partially capable of sailing. 3. I fall overboard and nobody else on the boat knows how to sail. 4. I fall overboard and I was single handing, therefore there is nobody else left on the boat. My current plans: 1. Someone falls overboard. a) Assign someone to glue their eyes on the MOB. b) get someone to drop the floatable cushion in the water. b) Furl the jib. c) Turn around. d) get someone to ready the Life Sling. e) Circle the MOB so they get into the Life Sling. f) Stop the boat and drag the MOB over to the boat. g) Figure out how to get them on board. Unfortunately there are a million variations to this plan. What if the MOB does not have a PFD and is hurt or unconscious? What if I am the only other one on board? What if the wind is howling? Is there a stinkpot nearby and am I better off blowing my air horn and hailing the stinkpot? I don't know the answers to any of the questions. I do know that when I am landing, I have the crew furl the jib so I can concentrate on handling the boat while the crew readies the fenders, yada, yada... This works very well for me and I don't have to depend on having someone else do something to maneuver the boat. Therefore, I think it is a good move to immediately furl the jib giving me total control of the boat and freeing anyone else on board to handle the Life Sling, throwable cushion, swim ladder and block and tackle. My only concern with this is losing speed in a light wind. I think I will still furl the jib and maybe re-deploy it once a course is set. I like the concept of the Life Sling because it is more forgiving. I don't have to stop the boat right next to the MOB. Rather I circle then drag the MOB to the boat. 2. I go overboard. Pray.
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Lamar Sumerlin
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Ranger Paul
MOB Figure 8 Drill
Lamar, I re-read your post and realized you were asking about the Figure 8 versus heaving to or doing a Quick Stop and I did not address the heaving to or Quick Stop part of the question. Basically, after doing some tests I do not think it is a good idea. Test 1 - I had a crew drop a fender over, wait a few seconds, the yell "man overboard". I was aghast at how far I traveled before I reacted and brought the boat head to wind. If I had tried to maintain my station by, say, heaving to, my MOB would have had a good swim to get to the boat. This might be OK in 80 degree waters with a young, strong, uninjured swimmer, but would be useless in every other case. Try it! Test 2 - I was curious how far I drifted when hove to, so in about an 8-10 mph wind, I heaved to then dropped a paper towel overboard (which, I might add, was about a eco friendly as I could figure out...the towel sunk as planned and I presume disintegrated). We then watched our drift rate. I'm 63, in pretty good shape, and a medium swimmer. I figured I could swim as fast as our drift rate...for 5 minutes or so...then I would be a goner! The H216 is light with a large free board for the weight and the windage is pretty severe. Bottom line: Plan on going back and getting the MOB.
Lamar, I re-read your post and realized you were asking about the Figure 8 versus heaving to or doing a Quick Stop and I did not address the heaving to or Quick Stop part of the question. Basically, after doing some tests I do not think it is a good idea. Test 1 - I had a crew drop a fender over, wait a few seconds, the yell "man overboard". I was aghast at how far I traveled before I reacted and brought the boat head to wind. If I had tried to maintain my station by, say, heaving to, my MOB would have had a good swim to get to the boat. This might be OK in 80 degree waters with a young, strong, uninjured swimmer, but would be useless in every other case. Try it! Test 2 - I was curious how far I drifted when hove to, so in about an 8-10 mph wind, I heaved to then dropped a paper towel overboard (which, I might add, was about a eco friendly as I could figure out...the towel sunk as planned and I presume disintegrated). We then watched our drift rate. I'm 63, in pretty good shape, and a medium swimmer. I figured I could swim as fast as our drift rate...for 5 minutes or so...then I would be a goner! The H216 is light with a large free board for the weight and the windage is pretty severe. Bottom line: Plan on going back and getting the MOB.
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Lamar Sumerlin
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