1985 Hunter 23 Lee Helm when Close Hauled

[DanFleig]

Today was a beautiful day for sailing on the Chesapeake Bay. Winds were gentle, blowing 5-10 (max) seemingly out of the SSE-SE. As soon as I cleared selby bay I was able to get the sails up, stow the motor, and set a tack straight towards Thomas Point Lighthouse. I immediately noticed that I was having to apply a disturbing amount of rudder to keep on a straight course (lee helm). As I struggled to balance the sail plan, I ended up steering too far north, and having to tack to avoid the shallows around Thomas Point. I decided to tack almost due South, figuring it would put me on a close hauled port tack, and I could continue to work on balancing the sails. Unfortunately the wind died down to almost nothing. Unable to overcome the lee helm and steer where I wanted to I decided I was going to be a hazard to other boats navigating the sough river and headed back. Strangest part is returning I stuck mostly somewhere between a beem and broad reach, and experienced NO lee helm...

Please help me! I didn't experience this at all last year, and i'm sure my rig is tuned wrong somewhere.

I have a 1985 Hunter 23, Wing Keel (With swing down centerboard ). I am still running what I believe are the original sails (100 maybe 110 Jib). Rigging wise, the only thing i've changed since last season is running all of my halyards back to the cockpit, added a boom kicker, lazy jacks and and a downhaul for the jib.

I'm pretty sure I must have goofed something up when I tuned the rig. This year was my first attempt at doing it on my own. Last year my broker did it for me.

I was at a loss trying to better balance the sail plan. With the light air, I didn't have the jib or main crancked down super tight tight, but it was definitely close hauled, with a healthy dose of boom vein. My traveler was just windward of center so the boom was around center line. I swear I tried everything I could think of, loosening the jib only caused it to want to luff, I tired bringing the traveler more to windward, to lee ward, adding more vein, less.... nothing seemed to help. When the wind slowed down a lot, I was almost stopped because of the rudder input needed (hence I decided just to turn back)

Appreciate your help! Hope you all are having a happy 4th of July weekend!

Dan

 

[Sailorjohnca]

Lee helm is a bit unusual, I have just got a hunter 26.5 and that has some significant weather helm. Lee helm normally means not enough power in the main or maybe you need a bigger head sail. As you didn't have this happen last year I'm wondering if your centre board has developed a twist or got banged up? Your description seems to indicate a major change and rig tuning does not normally do that. Do you have any rake in the mast, you would normally try around 6 inches or so

 

[Brian M H23]

It could be something hung up on the rudder or keel?? Easy enough to hoist a weight on the main halyard and check mast rake

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

I would tend to believe it is the rake of the mast is the culprit here and you will need to move the mast. Ok you all can get a laugh but not sure which way. It could be that you are not letting the sails out far enough or you have too much sail for the wind speed or combination thereof.

Check the tuning first.

 

[isaksp00]

Never had that problem on mine, but it seems to me that raking the mast more aftwards would increase weather helm - the center of pressure would move back, and that would tend to push the stern more away from the wind. Or the center of fulcrum (whatever it is called) formed by the centerboard/keel could be too far aft - like if the board were partially down? I don't really pay too much attention to the mast rake on mine, but I'd guess a vertical plum line from the masthead would be about 4 in aft of the mast base at the gooseneck.

If I recall, if you tighten the upper shrouds it pushes the spreaders in, and since they are swept back, that pushes the "middle" of the mast forward on a fractional rig, which makes the mast bend aftwards. So maybe the uppers are too loose? Just a theory.

 

[danm1]

I'd go with centerboard not down all the way or not locked down or fouled. Even if the mast were straight up and down lee helm shouldn't be so pronounced when beating.

 

[Crazy Dave Condon]

Take a photo looking sideways with the full mast shown in the slip when the water is still and post. As for a swing keel, this is a fixed keel.

 

[John A12737]

I put new sails on my 26.5 and experienced the same problem. The wind would pick the bow up and then force it to leeward. Very scary, and not safe!!
Dave is right, you need to adjust your mast. After talking with some of our racers, I readjusted my mast, bringing the rake back. It didn't take much to make one heck of a difference. Now in stronger winds and close hauled, the tiller has little pressure, and when hit we have windward helm.
I suggest you find a someone (a racer?) and have them help you with setting up the mast. Good luck, leeward helm is NOT good!!!

 

[peptobysmol]

Yeah. That's strange for sure. I have one of those fancy '85 swing wing keels. I run the same sail plan that you do. 110 jib with full main just last night :dance: I would suspect that either you have something fouling your swing keel (if you have it deployed) or your rudder. Like others have said you need to check your mast. Hope you can solve it quickly, let us know.

 

[inarathree]

the thing i learned from sailing/racing Hobie Cats - especially the 16 - is the importance of mast rake. While Hobies take this to the extreme over a mono, the effect is the same. With a lee helm your center of effort is forward. Raking the mast back will reduce your lee helm. Not experiencing it on a mono hull, I can't tell you how much, but i seem to recall that you should be looking at inches off a plumb line, not the foot or more on an H16.

How your head sail - jib, genoa, spinnaker - is set up or the condition they are in, can also cause your center of effort to move forward. which can also be compensated for with rake, but I think that moving your jib car forward or backward is the usual way to control that.

I will say that if your sails are the original 1985 sails, then its time to replace them. It seems that every non-racer in the world waits as long as possible to replace sails. Waiting YEARS too long. Every H16 i have ever owned I replaced the sails first. Every mono hull I have owned I replaced the sails first. Even after i stopped racing, all the cruising boats i have had, i replaced the sails. For performance, handling, and control, replacing the sails is the BIGGEST improvement you can make to your boat (other than a clean bottom).