1985 Catalina 30 broken alternator brkt.

[Dean5735]

After our 2200 mile trip to florida from michigan aboard the Rubaiyat, her alternator bracket broke and tore a hole in the from cover of the engine.
Universal M25 . I have heard of the brkt breaking, but does it useually do this to the engine? Looks like it is a pull the motor repair

 

[Tim R.]

I do not see a need to pull the engine. That is the cover for he raw water pump drive gear. You may need to remove some other bits but completely doable in the boat.

 

[Dean5735]

I just ckd. a Catalina 34 posting of the upgraded brkt. it looks like the new one eliminates the old base mounting and the old upper mounting too. If so I could replace it without pulling the motor, just epoxy the cover piece back in place. My upper bolt on the old one is broken off sticking out about a 1/4 " of the exhaust manifold, does it eliminate both the old mountings ?

 

[Tim R.]

I do not recall. 2 years since I had that motor. Check the Cat 34 sites. Lots of info regarding this conversion there.

 

[kloudie1]

I agree with Tim.. that is the gear case . a good shop could braze and reinforce and reclaim the gasket face or ya might be able to buy a new or used part for less.. That is a Kubota block, if I'm not mistaken, and ya might be able to find one for cheap(er) at a tractor place. Ya don't have a lot of room there but it looks like ya might be able to get the case out.. Ya gonna have to have full use of ya port and starboard dexters, but do-able.. (makes you dexterous) Worse case is ya have to cut the fiberglass panel a little and make a new larger cover. That doesn't look like enough iron to hold it (Hindsight statement of the day !) Seems like there should be another brace from the bracketry to the block to share the load.
Anyone have pix of this engine showing the brackets?

 

[Ray T]

The upgraded mount sounds like a great idea but epoxying the old piece sounds like a bad idea. I know repairing the old cover that way sounds easy but it wouldn't be strong. You would feel more confident in your engine with a new cover. You could pull the cover and have it welded for less money. I have repaired more than one gearbox this way with good results.

 

[Dean5735]

If the new mount eliminates both old mounting points that would be great. I think epoxying the chunk back into place would hold as there would be no pressure on it or in it. The cover doesn't look like it will come off without cutting fiberglass or sliding the engine back a little. I am ordering the conversion kit now, we'll see

 

[dparilla]

I just installed this new bracket. Did not even need to extend the coolant line or replace the screw studs in the radiator (heat exchanger). Took about 35 minutes including installing new belt (and cleaning up the gallon of antifreeze I dumped on my lap.)

 

[Stu Jackson]

Here are some other M25 Critical Upgrades: http://c34.org/bbs/index.php/topic,5078.0.html

I had the alternator bracket fail on my boat. I'd read of the need to do it and even had the parts on the boat... That's why I wrote the article and have been posting about it since 1999. Pictures included, go look.

http://www.c34.org/wiki/index.php?title=M-25_Alternator_Mount_Conversion_Kit_"B/M_256891"

That forward facing housing has been cracked big time. My oil filter and the hose to the HX stopped the alternator from doing any damage, other than draining all the oil and all the coolant. Read the links.

kloudie's right - if you need a part, go to a Kubota tractor dealer, D-850 tractor engine. If it was my engine, I'd replace that housing.

It also appears that you'll need to use the new studs with the kit. I was lucky that my studs were long enough for the new bracket.

 

[mherrcat]

Catalina Direct had the best price I could find on that replacement bracket...

 

[eherlihy]

Last November (2010) I installed the upgraded Alternator mounting bracket, with the kit available through Torrensen Marine, and while I was at it I installed a new Leece-Nevile / Prestolite 90 amp alternator on my Universal M25. If you are reading this far, you probably know that the new alternator uses EXACTLY the same housing as the old 55 amp Motorola. BTW the kit is now ~$180.00

When I opened the box containing the kit, I was happy to see that it included all the parts, including the Alternator mounting bolts.

I did the installation using the new bolts, but noticed that they did not seem to fit perfectly. The SAE Grade 5 pivot bolt allowed "a little" play of the alternator, and the tension bolt never seemed to fit "right." At the time I assumed that the alternator was machined so that the bolt would jam, thus preventing the bolt from loosening. The real reason is embarrassing....

I thought it strange that both of these bolts, and the nut were SAE.
031555 - 5/16NC x 1
031615 - 3/8NC x 3-1/2
031762 - Nut 3/8-16 Hex Steel Zinc

However, EVERY other fastener is Metric. I assumed that Torrensen would know and include the correct bolts, however the extra play was because the bolts did not fit... you know what happens when you ass-u-me...

The Pivot bolt SHOULD BE a Metric M10 fastener. The tension bolt (connects the tension arm and the alternator) SHOULD BE a Metric M8 coarse thread.

I realized this because I was getting a little belt dust on the engine. After only 50 hours this summer, I thought that was unusual, or I would need to buy a lot of belts. In October of this year (2011), I checked the alternator tension, and the "little" play seemed a "little" worse than it should have...

Because by now I had stripped some of the threads with the bolt that was included with the kit:cussing:, I purchased a slightly longer bolt, a nut, and lock washer to use as a tension bolt. I also replaced the pivot bolt with a slightly longer M10 Fine thread bolt. It fit perfectly (no play at all). I used 2 nuts and a spring washer to jam the pivot bolt, so that it will not vibrate loose.

I can't speak to the kit available through Catalina Direct, but the Torrensen kit has the wrong friggin' bolts!

Lesson 1: If the components in the "kit" don't seem right to you, they are not.
Lesson 2: DO NOT USE THE ALTERNATOR MOUNTING BOLTS INCLUDED IN THE TORRENSEN KIT if they are SAE, and you have a Leece-Neville or Motorolla Alternator.

 

[Stu Jackson]

Thanks, I added it to the C34 Tech wiki article. Your report is much appreciated. Lock washers are your friend! I put one under the top bolt, and on both the thru bolt and under the lower bolt. We also use a belt tensioner.

 

[eherlihy]

Thanks Stu,

I feel honored to be included there.

Am I the first and only person that has noticed this? The bolts would be a problem with the Motorola alternator too...

Also note that I check the Catalina Direct site, and they have the same "kit" with the same WRONG BOLTS! - But you save ~$20 over Torrensen

 

[Stu Jackson]

Re: 1985 M25 Engine broken alternator brkt.

Yes, you are the first. As I said, I used lock washers on both my old Motorola when i first did the install in '99, and when we replaced the old OEM alternator with our blue Circle 100A. I'd been having belt tensioning issues for years, and maybe this is why. Although a recent change to a new belt seems to have fixed that issue. Dunno. Thanks again for that post, very helpful. I also noted it on the Ericson site and linked back to the updated wiki.

I remain amazed that folks with M25 engines still don't know about the alternator bracket upgrade requirement as well as the harness upgrade and ammeters in cockpits. I've been posting about this for 13 years.

Oh well, all we can do is to keep helping out.