12v system rewire including Balmar SG200, ACR, Solar, 1/2/B Switch and On/Off Switch

Ward H

.
Nov 7, 2011
3,649
Catalina 30 Mk II Barnegat, NJ
The ACR also has a low voltage threshold. If the voltage goes below 9.5v the battery is locked out, effectively isolating it from the rest of the system.
I agree.
Now if I turn on my battery charger it will supply 13.6 volts to the positive busbar. ACR should see that voltage and connect to the start battery. At least I thought it would. I may test that this week. My charger will work to act as a power supply even if my battery is disconnected, not sure if all do. It's a Sterling Pro Charge Ultra.
 
Jul 11, 2015
18
Pearson 303 Bristol
I can't remember exactly. I believe the starter is a 250 or 300 amp and the ACR a 120 or 150. The ratings can't be read without disconnecting the cables and removing the fuses.



So long as no more than 300 amps continuously passes through the fuse holder all is good. If 301 amps passes through for a brief period, I doubt if anything bad will happen. Take a look at the trip delay curve, if a 300 amp fuse can carry more than 300 amps for almost 2 minutes, then the fuse holder must be able to carry that much too. It would be bad engineering have the fuse holder melt before the fuse blew.
Thanks, Dave. This makes sense. I was thinking that the main bus would see voltage on it (solar or other) even with the house switch open but that shouldn’t happen if the controller is working properly.

My next question to all and to Ward’s point about my alternator wiring to the main bus (that seems pretty common) what happens in the following situation with my proposed setup:

1. House battery is off.
2. DC+ in on position (not combine).
3. I start the engine

Power comes from start/reserve battery. Positive bus bar should have no voltage because house is open and DC+ is not in parallel. ACR wouldn’t be combining because no voltage on main bus. What does the alternator do immediately after starting? I would think it would be outputting even just momentarily but would the ACR respond quickly enough to allow current to the start/reserve battery or would the alternator output have nowhere to go and burn the diodes? Or, am I going way down a rabbit hole with this that isn’t needed.

Thanks again for all the comments. I want to make sure I get this right the first time and fully understand how to operate the system.
 
Jan 11, 2014
11,399
Sabre 362 113 Fair Haven, NY
Thanks, Dave. This makes sense. I was thinking that the main bus would see voltage on it (solar or other) even with the house switch open but that shouldn’t happen if the controller is working properly.

My next question to all and to Ward’s point about my alternator wiring to the main bus (that seems pretty common) what happens in the following situation with my proposed setup:

1. House battery is off.
2. DC+ in on position (not combine).
3. I start the engine

Power comes from start/reserve battery. Positive bus bar should have no voltage because house is open and DC+ is not in parallel. ACR wouldn’t be combining because no voltage on main bus. What does the alternator do immediately after starting? I would think it would be outputting even just momentarily but would the ACR respond quickly enough to allow current to the start/reserve battery or would the alternator output have nowhere to go and burn the diodes? Or, am I going way down a rabbit hole with this that isn’t needed.

Thanks again for all the comments. I want to make sure I get this right the first time and fully understand how to operate the system.
Good question and I can't give you a definitive answer. I think it will depend on where the source of the regulator's power and the location of the regulator's sense circuit.

A regulator needs power to operate, if the power source for the regulator is turned off then the regulator cannot provide power for the field and with no power to the alternator's field it can't generate electricity.

If the regulator sees the battery as being fully charged (i.e, the voltage above a certain level) through the sense wire, then the regulator should (?) reduce the field current so that it does not produce electricity.

I can't even speculate about how this would work on an internally regulated alternator.

The very basics of generating electricity is to pass a coil of wire through a magnetic field. At least in the old school (when I learned about this) the magnetic field was supplied by permanent magnets and the current produced was DC. As I understand alternators, the magnetic field is provided by electromagnets, the presence and strength of that field is determined by the field current produced by the regulator. Thus, if there is no field current there is no electricity being generated and our worries about frying diodes and rectifiers is unwarranted. (there are also issues about how the strator is wound and the number of poles on the armature, but I think bringing those up would distract from the core issue).

To answer your question, I think it depends. It depends on how your alternator is regulated and wire. I suspect it is a slightly different situation than the classic situation where the alternator is producing electricity and then the load is suddenly cut off cause the diodes to blow. But I can't be 100% confident.
 
Oct 22, 2014
21,085
CAL 35 Cruiser #21 moored EVERETT WA
am I going way down a rabbit hole with this that isn’t needed.
No you're not going down the rabbit hole. You are examining all of the issues associated with an electrical system on your boat.
It depends on how your alternator is regulated and wire.
:plus:
Looking at the diagram provided in Post 40 link to "MarineHowTo-DIY" it is easy to protect the alternator. you do not provide the sensing wire with an electrical source. This stops the alternator from producing electricity on the +B terminal (which you have connected thru your switch to the battery.)

Not knowing how your alternator/internal regulator is wired is the issue. You will need to resource that. There are several reasons to use an external regulator. This is one of them.

I think your intent is to have access to alternator power while you are shutting down the house battery side of your system. This is one of those compromises, I believe, you will need to address manually. If you want to isolate the batteries individually from the power sources (i.e. the alternator) then you are going to need to take manual control of the alternator power and affirm you have a battery connected prior to starting your engine. Or you must have a way of stopping the alternator from energizing the field. The clue with the external regulator is to have the field wire shut down when the alternator is off line. Shown in the linked diagram.
 
  • Like
Likes: Scott T-Bird
Feb 6, 1998
11,667
Canadian Sailcraft 36T Casco Bay, ME
@Maine Sail Rod, good to see you back posting.
You wont see too much in the way of new /detailed posts as my left arm/ hand are still 100% paralyzed and I am having a lot of trouble learning speech to text software. 1 finger typing is not my thing.. I am checking in when in-between PT, OT & ST.Considering I was about as close to death as it gets, and I survived, things could be worse
 
Jan 11, 2014
11,399
Sabre 362 113 Fair Haven, NY
You wont see too much in the way of new /detailed posts as my left arm/ hand are still 100% paralyzed and I am having a lot of trouble learning speech to text software. 1 finger typing is not my thing.. I am checking in when in-between PT, OT & ST.Considering I was about as close to death as it gets, and I survived, things could be worse
I am certain you will be persistent! It will be a long recovery. We all wish you the best. If I ever post anything too off the wall, feel free to remind me that I don't have my ABYC Certification. ;)
 
  • Ha
Likes: jssailem
Nov 14, 2013
200
Catalina 50 Seattle
You're doing the hardest re-wiring job there is: your brain. But there's nobody more qualified. Keep at it, we're pulling for you!
 
  • Like
Likes: Hello Below

dLj

.
Mar 23, 2017
3,414
Belliure 41 Sailing back to the Chesapeake
You wont see too much in the way of new /detailed posts as my left arm/ hand are still 100% paralyzed and I am having a lot of trouble learning speech to text software. 1 finger typing is not my thing.. I am checking in when in-between PT, OT & ST.Considering I was about as close to death as it gets, and I survived, things could be worse
@Maine Sail Really happy to have you back!!!!

Speech to text takes a bit to work out, but once you get there, it's really great!

As they say, you robbed the Reaper - that's about as good as it gets! Stay tough, I'm sure there will be more tough days yet to come.

Super to have you back!

dj
 
  • Like
Likes: jssailem

Goobs

.
May 8, 2020
11
Catalina 30 30 TR Bridgeport
Good luck to you. Was there any history or warning this was likely to happen? Or completely out of the blue?