LONGER lengths of anchor-lead chain

[DianaOfBurlington]

Hi, gang.

I'm interested in finding lengths of polymer-coated chain, preferably BBB or Hi-Test, in 1/4" or 5/16" size. Standard retail-available lengths at 4-6 ft are inadequate for most cruising boats (probably serving only appearance requirements). A 13- or 14-lb Danforth (Lightweight) anchor needs at least 6- or 7-to-one scope (deck to bottom) in order to set safely; this means at least 6-7 ft of chain at minimum.

I keep a 13-lb Hooker lightweight and a 14-lb Delta at the bow; they do not have enough chain. I'd like 8 ft on the plow and 10 ft on the lightweight. Yes; I thought of shackling two standard lengths together - it's messy going through the roller, looks bad, has too many extra connections to worry about. I want the polymer coating as these leads have to lie along the inside the aluminum toerail extrusion, and rust and corrosion need to be avoided.

I hope to find any of the following:
- custom, cut-to-order lengths of polymer-coated chain;
- reliable, local source for polymer dipping of readily-available chain;
- premade packaged assemblies of polymer-coated chain (including D-rings?), but at 8-10 ft in length.

Also, does anyone know where and from whom I can get 8-plait NER anchor line (realtively economically) spliced with eye thimbles? I have 200 ft on a spool. My usual guy says he can't do 8-plait. I get this is kind of normal.

I'll be eager to learn of your suggestions. Thanks for all the good reading on here!

 

[jssailem]

Wow... That is a lot to digest.

I'm interested in finding lengths of polymer-coated chain, preferably BBB or Hi-Test, in 1/4" or 5/16" size.

I am not in the polymer coated chain camp. Anchor chain needs to be in the air to avoid rusting. If not little nicks in the coating let water get to the chain. This permits rust to begin to eat away at the chain hidden from view. You may never see the rust until the chain gives way as it was being held together by the poly coating.

this means at least 6-7 ft of chain at minimum.

On uses chain to (A) keep the boat in place in line with the anchor, (B) keep teh anchor on the bottom so that it resets in line with the bottom. You have a 25 ft boat. Common chain length, depending where you are anchoring is usually 3 times boat length. I know some folk do not follow this suggestion but it is the chain that helps keep the anchor in place not the rode. Minimum 25 feet, 75 feet better if going to be at anchor in any kind of weather.

8-plait NER anchor line (realtively economically) spliced with eye thimbles

Since you already have the line would you be willing to learn the seaman ship skill of doing your own splice? Cost is just materials.

1. http://www.sw-marine.co.uk/acatalog/8_Strand__Multi-plait__Eye_Splice.html
2. https://www.neropes.com/services/splicing/mega-plait-to-chain/
3. http://www.samsonrope.com/Pages/Splice_Instructions.aspx

Splicing is not a difficult skill to learn. It is time consuming and depending on my perfectionist nature I have been know to rip it all out and try again doubling the time allotted.
But it is satisfying to complete a splice and know you did this and it works.

 

[dlochner]

I'm interested in finding lengths of polymer-coated chain, preferably BBB or Hi-Test, in 1/4" or 5/16" size. Standard retail-available lengths at 4-6 ft are inadequate for most cruising boats (probably serving only appearance requirements). A 13- or 14-lb Danforth (Lightweight) anchor needs at least 6- or 7-to-one scope (deck to bottom) in order to set safely; this means at least 6-7 ft of chain at minimum.

In addition to the concerns that @jssailem mentioned about polymer coated chain, the coating makes it difficult to store because the chain won't collapse into a nice neat pile. It will twist around and take up too much space.

Depending on where you sail and the water depth the amount of rode and chain you will need will vary. In deeper water you'll need longer lengths of chain, shallower water less. Figure at least a boat lengths worth of chain, in your case that will be 25 feet. Coupled with the 200 ft of line, you'll be good to anchor in 30 feet of water. If you will be anchoring in deeper water, then more chain will be needed.

The longer the chain the less scope you will need. With an all chain rode you can go to 5:1 or a little less. Of course with more chain you'll have more weight to heft when it is time to bring the anchor up.

If the hooker anchor is one of those reversible anchors, like this one: https://www.wholesalemarine.com/hoo...DUlDfmmpUSXPO-Y3-6VmE37GykGSKSTwaAsEbEALw_wcB
Relegate that to a lunch hook or the scrap metal dealer. The anchor will not survive a wind or current shift as it will reverse the pull on the anchor and unset it. It may or may not reset. Get a real danforth or a Fortress.

There is a YouTube channel, SV Panope that has a lot of interesting videos of anchors setting. Worth some time watching.

 

[Stu Jackson]

I agree, don't buy coated chain. Period.

 

[All U Get]

Yep, I found it on the net.
http://www.sw-marine.co.uk/acatalog/8_Strand__Multi-plait__Eye_Splice.html
Looks simple enough. Buy your own chain and make it as long as you want. When you try it the first few times tie a float to the anchor so if your eye splice slips, you will have a second line on it.

 

[Charlie Jones s/v Tehani]

Another voice against coated chain. Should be against the law to sell the stuff. Like coated lifelines, you have no way of knowing if the chain is corroded under the coating. And it will NOT store in a locker

Also agree 100 % on those anchors with the long loop shank. I wouldn't trust one to reset on a bet

On my own boat, I carry 75 feet of chain, backed with 175 feet of 3 strand nylon. That has served me well anchoring the entire coast, Texas to Annapolis, and all through the Bahamas

 

[Jackdaw]

No to coating. Same with lifelines. Rule of thumb says at least a boatlenght of chain.

 

[JimInPB]

Count me as another guy that avoids coated chain. I had that stuff once. I will not get it again.

When I pulled up the remains of my coated chain, the broken link was rusted through inside the nice white coating.

Galvanized or stainless are the only two real choices for me.

Also, why 8-plait? It is generally accepted that 3-strand has better stretch properties that promote a stronger hold of the anchor. I do keep a 100' piece of cheap 8-plait on board in case I ever need to extend my existing line in an emergency, but I don't ever plan to use the 8-plait by itself.

 

[Benny17441]

The rule of thumb is One foot of chain for every foot of boat. You should be looking at 25' of chain minimum.

 

[dlochner]

Also, why 8-plait? It is generally accepted that 3-strand has better stretch properties that promote a stronger hold of the anchor. I

8 plait stores in a smaller space than 3 strand.

 

[JimInPB]

Good to know. Thanks

 

[thinwater]

Don't be so negative about the 13# Hooker. There are several products bearing this name, including an economy product by Tie Down Engineering, the makers of Danforth. It is a solid anchor. I had one on a prior boat that I cruised many thousands of miles with. That said, there are also poor products using the same name. I also had a Fortress FX-12 on that boat; I'm not sure which held better, they were both very similar.

The OP is from New Jersey. Probably shallow water with sand an mud. No rocks, no coral, not much weed. Also no windlass, making more than a token of chain a big pain in the neck. Somethings to consider when advising >100 feet of chain.

Yeah, coated chain is a risk I would avoid. It really doesn't solve anything and causes several problems.

I've used all-chain. I've also used as little as 6-feet of chain in shallow sand and mud areas. Just different techniques. For example, you may need to take other steps to control yawing, although once the wind comes up, chain doesn't actually help with that (not much is on the bottom). Curiously, the only times I dragged were with all chain (undersized Delta that was soon remedied). Chain is only one piece of the puzzle.

 

[dlochner]

Don't be so negative about the 13# Hooker. There are several products bearing this name, including an economy product by Tie Down Engineering, the makers of Danforth.

Hooker anchors with a solid shank do not have the same issue as the Hooker anchor that has the rod loop and ring. It was the latter I was expressing concern about. The ring allows the rode to slide down to the flukes and reverse the pull on the anchor, a nice feature for retrieving a stuck anchor, however, if winds and current cause the boat to swing it can become a self-releasing anchor. Fine for a lunch hook, but I wouldn't trust it over night or when away from the boat.

 

[Charlie Jones s/v Tehani]

Hooker anchors with a solid shank do not have the same issue as the Hooker anchor that has the rod loop and ring. It was the latter I was expressing concern about. The ring allows the rode to slide down to the flukes and reverse the pull on the anchor, a nice feature for retrieving a stuck anchor, however, if winds and current cause the boat to swing it can become a self-releasing anchor. Fine for a lunch hook, but I wouldn't trust it over night or when away from the boat.

exactly

 

[Stu Jackson]

Also no windlass, making more than a token of chain a big pain in the neck. Somethings to consider when advising >100 feet of chain.

True, but I've been anchoring with 50 feet of 1/4" chain of 20 years without a windlass and I was over 50 when we bought the boat. Before that we had a Catalina 25 for 13 years, no windlass at least 25 feet of 3/16" or 1/4", hauled manaully.

It's a 25 foot boat the OP has. Not unreasonable to haul this amount of chain. You're right, 100 feet and more would be pushing it. And not required for the territory if being limited to that. If the OP moves, then re-evaluate.

 

[Charlie Jones s/v Tehani]

True, but I've been anchoring with 50 feet of 1/4" chain of 20 years without a windlass and I was over 50 when we bought the boat. Before that we had a Catalina 25 for 13 years, no windlass at least 25 feet of 3/16" or 1/4", hauled manaully.

It's a 25 foot boat the OP has. Not unreasonable to haul this amount of chain. You're right, 100 feet and more would be pushing it. And not required for the territory if being limited to that. If the OP moves, then re-evaluate.

I'm 77 and my 25 footer has no windlass. I haul back my chain by hand, up to the full 75 feet.. But it's very seldom I anchor in water deep enough to have to haul the entire weight- usually 15-20 feet is all, and normally only in 8-10 feet of water- It isn't all that bad

 

[jssailem]

@DianaOfBurlington is sailed in NJ. They know shallow waters there. They know sand and mud bottoms. The boat is a 25ft Hunter.
That is why I suggested he get chain and rode to match the sailing area he is planning on cruising. I gave the big picture if the waters were going to be off the NE of Maine or Canada. They have some big water there like we in the PacficNW (50 fathoms within a 1/4 mile of shore in some places).

In suggesting to a person a solution, I believe, you need to give them context. That way they can make their own decisions. After all as my friend @Stu Jackson shares.. "It is your boat and Your decision."

J Cherubini II, is a wood worker craftsman who has been rebuilding his boat Diana since 2014. He can make decisions. I think he was looking for ideas.

 

[DianaOfBurlington]

In addition to the concerns that @jssailem mentioned about polymer coated chain, the coating makes it difficult to store because the chain won't collapse into a nice neat pile. It will twist around and take up too much space.

The polymer coating is an epoxy 'paint' that sufficiently seals the chain from environmental elements = no rust. Of course it needs to be regularly inspected and eventually replaced, like anything else. No one reasonably expects to get 15-25 years out of anything of ferrous metal on any true saltwater boat.

Till recently I ran a marine-supply store and sold this stuff regularly. I just do not like the limitations of short lengths.

I think what you are thinking of is that awful stiff vinyl coating that does admit water (because it cracks) and does resist flexibility. I can't think of one good reason to use that junk. The polymer coating is what people are going to now because of the limitations of vinyl coating.[/QUOTE]

 

[DianaOfBurlington]

You guys are all negative about it! If I have to I'll just paint the darn stuff.

I have limitations (due to the boat size) on both weight and space to store a lot of chain. I'd be happy to have all-chain rode if I could; but I can't; so there you have it. The chain has to lie along the toerail where, if not painted or coated, it will rust, rattle. and help damage and corrode the toerail. Hence the question.

Unlike most (all?) of you, I have rode lockers aft of the V-berth, where they belong for both weight and balance. I can raise the anchor from standing in the foredeck hatch (manually). The chain has to extend from the roller (and chock) to the hawse pipes. That's about 8 ft, minimum.

I've sold and used Hooker anchors for years and like them very much. Compared to them the Danforth is unconscionably expensive. The Hookers are really nice-- heavily built, good-sized (unlike the Seachoice substitutes, which are junk), and the price point is excellent. Good blade thickness for area, unlike even some 'name-brand' anchors.

I dislike Fortress anchors as much as you guys all hate coated chain. Aluminum is the very stupidest thing for an anchor, for which weight is the saving grace, even more than is shape. It is made of machined, not forged, parts, too many of them, with too many bolts and nuts and connectors, all easily damaged, bent, and loosened. The Fortress anchor is known to 'sail' its way down, going this way and that with tide, current, waves. It's too lightweight to fall straight. Usually the chain lead beats it to the bottom; and then what do you have? --no set (even a potential tangle). It must be then set with reverse power (remember I have an outboard-powered boat) and plenty of downwind room. That's fine; sure; you set every anchor every time. That's by process; it should not be by a limitation of anchor design. Speaking of which, the Fortress requires that the user assemble it himself; and often the user dismantles it for storage and reassembles it each time-- if ever there were a recipe for failure, and for attendant liability suits, that's it. In my experience with (not) selling these at WM and where I was last, the Fortress is for go-fast boaters who 'can't be bothered' with the 'hassle' of a 'big heavy anchor' (exact terms used by buyers). These people nearly never anchor-- so what would they know about seamanship preference? If the only anchor available were a Fortress I would carry a 350-lb railroad wheel instead. Give me a big heavy hunk of forged & welded steel with pointy spikes on it any day!

 

[DianaOfBurlington]

8 plait stores in a smaller space than 3 strand.

8-plait fits into the self-tailer of the bronze Barlow 32 winch (that came from Warren Luhrs' Cherubini 44) that I have for an anchor winch on the foredeck. 3-strand (the other two rodes on the boat) do not (as well).