Carrying extra fuel for longer trips

[JamesG161]

It's a lot of weigh aft in an already stern-heavy boat

5 gallons of gasoline ≈ 37 lbs
_____
Take one less crew, and substitute 15 Gallons of Gasoline.

Since the OP was needing more Gas, I suspect more Cruising and less Sailing. I would put the extra gasoline aft of the mast and on the centerline of the boat.
Jim...

 

[JimInPB]

In my experience, It's usually better to have extra weight on the stern rather than on the bow, but as close to center as possible is best if you can make it happen. Unfortunately, not everything can go in the center.

 

[JimInPB]

-Will (Dragonfly)

That looks like a really slick little hot rod. What is it?

 

[Will Gilmore]

That looks like a really slick little hot rod. What is it?

Contender
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Contender_(dinghy)

-Will (Dragonfly)

 

[greg_m]

In dinghy sailing weight aft equals serious drag from the transom wave turbulence. We always tried to keep the transom out of the water and have the water break away from the hull clean rather than that backwash that builds up and causes drag. I can assume that would be the same for any size boat with a near vertical transom...

Seems like for all it's vast cavernous space below decks for storage not much of it is useful for fuel storage. Why not use gas tight containers and store them aft inboard under the cockpit sole where weight would be great?

 

[Will Gilmore]

5 gallons of gasoline ≈ 37 lbs

1 gallon of seawater weighs 8.6 lbs, 43 lbs for 5 gallons. Water, as ballast is not as heavy as iron which is not as heavy as lead. All this is obvious, but gasoline doesn't seem that heavy by comparison to other things that could be placed off-center, even on a 22' boat. It just happens to be normally kept all in one place and that adds up.

- Will (Dragonfly)

 

[greg_m]

1 gallon of seawater weighs 8.6 lbs, 43 lbs for 5 gallons. Water, as ballast is not as heavy as iron which is not as heavy as lead. All this is obvious, but gasoline doesn't seem that heavy by comparison to other things that could be placed off-center, even on a 22' boat. It just happens to be normally kept all in one place and that adds up.

- Will (Dragonfly)

Density of fresh pure water is 1kg / 1 liter
Density of sea water average is 1.025kg / 1 liter
Density of iron is 7.87kg / 1 liter
Density of lead is 11.34kg / 1 liter
Density of "gasoline" average is 0.74kg / 1 liter

 

[JimInPB]

I had thought that there were some regulations preventing fuel from being stored below decks, but I can't seem to find them with google. All I find are the regs for propane lockers. I specifically remember that there were certain agency approvals that marine gas cans had to meet, but I can't find that list now either. All I can find is the rules for the new EPA compliant installed tanks & portable tanks. I was dismayed to find that they are now requiring a fuel demand valve to be added between the sealed tank & the motor, even on a portable outboard tank.

 

[Jackdaw]

I had thought that there were some regulations preventing fuel from being stored below decks, but I can't seem to find them with google.

You can store portable tanks below-decks. It's not smart, and you have to meet USCG regs regarding ventilation (33 CFR 175/183, 46 CFR 25) and fire extinguishers.

 

[JimInPB]

You can store portable tanks below-decks. It's not smart, and you have to meet USCG regs regarding ventilation (33 CFR 175/183, 46 CFR 25) and fire extinguishers.

yea, & there is this - http://www.uscgboating.org/assets/1/AssetManager/ABYC.1002.01.pdf

& H-24 (gas) & H-25 (diesel) from ABYC - https://law.resource.org/pub/us/cfr/ibr/001/abyc.H-24.1993.pdf

 

[greg_m]

yea, & there is this - http://www.uscgboating.org/assets/1/AssetManager/ABYC.1002.01.pdf

While this is very interesting and it's always good to keep within the laws to avoid issues in the future however I noted early in the document that it does not apply to outboard propulsion engines setups with portable tanks... I see references in both documents to fixed/permanent tank and fuel system installations!

I see absolutely no references to storage of portable fuel tanks onboard, either on deck or below deck. Please point me in the right direction if I am wrong.

Reason this is important to me is because I am a marine engineering lecturer at our Maritime Academy in Simons Town and we get a lot of students through here who are working in the yachting business. As you know of course most of the yachting business happens on the US east coast down south!

So excellent reference materials for me!

& H-24 (gas) & H-25 (diesel) from ABYC - https://law.resource.org/pub/us/cfr/ibr/001/abyc.H-24.1993.pdf

 

[Jackdaw]

From the federal guide to requirements for recreational boats.

I could read that to say as long as the tank does NOT vent, you can store it where ever you want.

 

[greg_m]

.....

I could read that to say as long as the tank does NOT vent, you can store it where ever you want.

Exactly my point earlier on. I have got no problem storing fuel in a gas tight container down below the cockpit sole.

Gas tight is exactly that. Buying the correct type of container that is fuel approved is the way to go. Low down to reduce the CG as well as add ballast where it's useful. Below the cabin sole it's going to be cool, it's out of the sun and it's in a place away from the cabin. So evaporative pressures will be reduced.

Of course one must actually realise the limitations of the boat itself... I don't believe it was designed to cross oceans in the first place... So to expect to travel by sea motoring for very long distances is not what this boat is about???

On our training school L26 here in Simons Town we not only store the entire outboard motor below deck but it's fuel tank as well when it is not in use. The aft end of the cockpit has a well where the motor would go when motoring. However when racing you actually want less drag so out comes the motor and in goes the well plug! Motor gets mounted on a rack below and fuel tank lashed down next to it under the cockpit sole. Will post a photo when I have one!

 

[CloudDiver]

I pretty much can't find a single 'Marine' fuel container that I feel is sturdy, leak free, not way over-priced for what it is, and without a cumbersome and leak prone 'EPA or CARB approved' neck/cap accident waiting to happen, etc. (For gasoline anyway)
I tend to look beyond the Marine industry offerings and check out the jerry cans that are used in Off-roading and motor racing sports. I have a few 6 gallon 'racing' containers that have vents and fast flow necks, but these are too large and cumbersome for small boat use. Plus, the plastic is susceptible to UV damage (don't ask me how I know this). Overall, I've never had any major spills or over-fills with this type of container at the track, but they are def not 'CARB' approved. Anyway, I have still seen other containers on the market that seem to be pretty smart. I recommend going smaller, like sticking to 3 gallon or less so they are easier to handle and stow. Try RotopaX... expensive, yes. Piece of crap, no.
https://www.amazon.com/RotopaX-RX-2...=UTF8&qid=1522263495&sr=8-10&keywords=rotopax

 

[JimInPB]

I pretty much can't find a single 'Marine' fuel container that I feel is sturdy, leak free, not way over-priced for what it is, and without a cumbersome and leak prone 'EPA or CARB approved' neck/cap accident waiting to happen, etc. (For gasoline anyway)...

I stay with the standard $20 gas cans, but I make up better quality plugs & spouts with Viton O-ring seals that don't leak. The hose on my spout fits in the standard fill neck of a car, just like when you are at the gas station. I get about 2GPM of laminar flow when pouring out of the cans because my spouts are properly vented. I seldom spill a drop.

For diesel service, I use Nitril or Neoprene O-rings rather than Viton.

 

[Newport Bob]

RELATED - I have carried extra gas (dinghy) and diesel in containers on deck during long cruising. AND found the best/safest way to transfer to tanks is a jiggler. Insert into fuel container “jiggle up and down “ and no spill transfer. Here is one brand, not the only - check eBay, etc.
http://www.superjiggler.com/

 

[Will Gilmore]

Insert into fuel container “jiggle up and down “ and no spill transfer. Here is one brand, not the only - check eBay, etc.
http://www.superjiggler.com/

That looks like Leonardo daVinci's water pump invention.

Or is this a jiggler

Will (Dragonfly)

 

[Captain Larry-DH]

RELATED - I have carried extra gas (dinghy) and diesel in containers on deck during long cruising. AND found the best/safest way to transfer to tanks is a jiggler. Insert into fuel container “jiggle up and down “ and no spill transfer. Here is one brand, not the only - check eBay, etc.
http://www.superjiggler.com/

+1 I use the same technique for fuel and water jugs. I carry two siphons that are stored separately, to keep them free of contamination (the one for water is stored beneath the galley sink along with pots and pans).
This method makes it easier to avoid spills, no back-breaking wait holding a full jug while it empties, and no wind-blown fluids while trying to pour.

 

[SwitchintoglideIII]

Our 12 day trip in the North Channel this past summer, we had 6 gal. fuel and water tanks at the mast base.....worked well for us.

 

[JimInPB]

My usual siphon method doesn't use the jiggler. I use a spare fuel bulb that I carry attached to the end of a piece of 3/8" hose to get the party started. When the fuel reaches the bulb, I pull the bulb off & let gravity do it's job. The jiggler seems like a nice option if you have one. The primer bulb trick can be done with things you may already have on the boat. If you don't carry a spare primer bulb like I do, you can temporarily remove the installed one from service in a pinch. Of course, in a pinch you can use the old fashioned method too.