I would like to know if anyone owns a MacGregor, any model, that does NOT get water in the under seat storage during heavy, or prolonged, rainfall.
Many thanks.
Many thanks.
Water under seats.
- Thread starter BreezyCricket
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mine stays dry in all conditions..... although im thinking a large wave could change that.
this wasnt so before I re-seald all the deck hardware..... for you to have water under the seats, its highly possible its being channeled in from an unsealed rubrail.... and running between the hull and the liner.....
Does it stay dry when its in the water, but not raining?....
this wasnt so before I re-seald all the deck hardware..... for you to have water under the seats, its highly possible its being channeled in from an unsealed rubrail.... and running between the hull and the liner.....
Does it stay dry when its in the water, but not raining?....
Ours had water there after rain and it was the chain plates on the shrouds and around one window on our S. 15 minutes with some 3M 4000 and it is still dry 18 months later. I didn't remove anything at the time as we didn't have the time. Might do that the next time for a longer fix or just clean and use more 4000 again. It is hardly noticeable as I didn't have to use much and smoothed/radiused it with my finger and removed the excess.
I've heard of the deck joint doing this, but the chain plates are almost always the main culprit and I would start there,
Sum
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I've heard of the deck joint doing this, but the chain plates are almost always the main culprit and I would start there,
Sum
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Thank you for the replies.
My boat got so much water in when it rained that it was basically unusable, unless under seat storage was not required, so I decided to re-caulk the hull to deck joint because I did not think that any other area could be the cause of a problem of such magnitude, and by that I mean that in heavy rain I was getting about a gallon of water an hour under the seats.
When I did this I got a real eye opener.
The existing caulking if it had been applied correctly and was laid in a straight line should have been about 60 feet long. In my boat it was less than 10 feet, meaning, obviously, that a considerable section of the joint had no caulking at all. As to the fasteners, many were not tightened and, in fact, in one group of 10, nine were loose, and one did not even have a nut on.
I should add also that I bought my 26S new so I know it had not been tampered with, unless this 'tampering' was done at the factory, which could only mean that MacGregor have no quality control at all.
Regardless, my problem has not been completely solved. I had applied sealer to the chain plates through the hull joint which may have moved with the mast raising and lowering, but I did not think of the windows so will check them, using 3M 4000 as advised by Sumner, and will post the results, which should not take long because where I live we have a saying, 'If you can see the mountains it is going to rain, if you can't see the mountains, it's already raining'.
My boat got so much water in when it rained that it was basically unusable, unless under seat storage was not required, so I decided to re-caulk the hull to deck joint because I did not think that any other area could be the cause of a problem of such magnitude, and by that I mean that in heavy rain I was getting about a gallon of water an hour under the seats.
When I did this I got a real eye opener.
The existing caulking if it had been applied correctly and was laid in a straight line should have been about 60 feet long. In my boat it was less than 10 feet, meaning, obviously, that a considerable section of the joint had no caulking at all. As to the fasteners, many were not tightened and, in fact, in one group of 10, nine were loose, and one did not even have a nut on.
I should add also that I bought my 26S new so I know it had not been tampered with, unless this 'tampering' was done at the factory, which could only mean that MacGregor have no quality control at all.
Regardless, my problem has not been completely solved. I had applied sealer to the chain plates through the hull joint which may have moved with the mast raising and lowering, but I did not think of the windows so will check them, using 3M 4000 as advised by Sumner, and will post the results, which should not take long because where I live we have a saying, 'If you can see the mountains it is going to rain, if you can't see the mountains, it's already raining'.
when i resealed my chainplates, i noticed they had a bit of movement side to side. I kinda thought the sealer would just work loose with that much movement, so i packed the slack area with epoxy putty..... and cleaned it nice and leveled it with the deck, then sealed it..... its tight and dry.....
Breezycricket; I would think again about using the 3m 4000 on your windows. You might be best off removing them and using something similar but less permanent. There is this stuff called butyl tape that I have seen on the forum (Main Sail). I have tried it and am a convert! I am slowly re-bedding my deck hardware.
What does everyone with a S or D have for sealant between the hull and deck? I think my boat may have been split apart before. I have a 1/4 white foam strip in the joint.
As for leaks on my 26D. Your story sounds like mine. I almost have it all stopped. I used a clear latex calk along the tops only of my windows. I used it because I plan to remove and replace the windows and paint the hull next winter. I don't recommend this unless you know how to remove all of the calking.
I found my 10g shop vac was great for sucking the water out the bilge pump couldn't get. (It gets really heavy! If you can, leave it in the cockpit so you can just dump it out.)
Pic is a roll of butyl tape.
What does everyone with a S or D have for sealant between the hull and deck? I think my boat may have been split apart before. I have a 1/4 white foam strip in the joint.
As for leaks on my 26D. Your story sounds like mine. I almost have it all stopped. I used a clear latex calk along the tops only of my windows. I used it because I plan to remove and replace the windows and paint the hull next winter. I don't recommend this unless you know how to remove all of the calking.
I found my 10g shop vac was great for sucking the water out the bilge pump couldn't get. (It gets really heavy! If you can, leave it in the cockpit so you can just dump it out.)
Pic is a roll of butyl tape.
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The 4000 is nothing like the 5200 and even much more flexible than the 4200 and not that permanent, the reason I'll probably have to re-do ours at some point. You just need a very fine bead to work on the windows, at least that was what we found.
http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/...ECIE20S4K7000000_nid=GW4D41NSGBbeQH8HT14PGTgl
We did get some tape from MS recently and will use it for deck hardware, but I can't see how we would use it to seal the windows that are in and don't believe that it would hold new windows in. As far as I can see it needs to be compressed between two components that are held together with fasteners, but I might be wrong on the windows used in our boats, but they aren't like ports with fasteners going through their frames,
Sum
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Ah. I thought 4000 and 5200 were (life calk). I didn't mean to seem to suggest butyl for the windows. I think Sumners idea of a thin bead of calk (4000?) is a good idea. I used a product I hate to use but one of the guys must have left it in the van. DAP latex, goes on white and dries clear. (One of my guys says his p is thicker than it.) (Junk! shrinks more than 1/2 its size if you use it to fill anything over 1/4".) (Likes to keep coming out of the tube after you let the pressure off the calking gun. Messy.)
I used it because I know how to remove it and it dries clear. Because it is a temporary fix I also only calked along the top of the windows without removing them.
What about other peoples deck and hull joints. Foam anyone? I've heard of there supposedly being something like 5200 used form the factory but I cant seem to see any on my 88 26D??
Here is a picture of the joint/foam from inside my laz.
I used it because I know how to remove it and it dries clear. Because it is a temporary fix I also only calked along the top of the windows without removing them.
What about other peoples deck and hull joints. Foam anyone? I've heard of there supposedly being something like 5200 used form the factory but I cant seem to see any on my 88 26D??
Here is a picture of the joint/foam from inside my laz.
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that is just your typical weather stripping foam like you can get at the canopy dealer for sealing out the water between a canopy and pickup bed.... you can probably get it at any home improvement center also....
Read my "quest for a dry bilge" on my mods page: http://www.holderness.info/boats-a-projects/macgregor-mods.html
I sealed my hull/deck joint without taking out the 200 odd bolts and four years later, there are no leaks. The chain plate fix I mention has also been permanent and didn't leak under varying rig tensions and temperature ranges.
The way I found most of the leaks was by inspecting the bilges during a heavy run storm. As you can see in my photos, the water streaks running down the sides of the hull were dead giveaways that it was the hull to deck joint.
Teliki is now totally dry inside...
What I didn't mention was the "other" massive gap I found when I removed the trim around the engine mount. There was a gap of over 3/4 inch that was letting a lot of water into the aft locker.
The speaker hole was another story - and it's now gone!
Chris
I sealed my hull/deck joint without taking out the 200 odd bolts and four years later, there are no leaks. The chain plate fix I mention has also been permanent and didn't leak under varying rig tensions and temperature ranges.
The way I found most of the leaks was by inspecting the bilges during a heavy run storm. As you can see in my photos, the water streaks running down the sides of the hull were dead giveaways that it was the hull to deck joint.
Teliki is now totally dry inside...
What I didn't mention was the "other" massive gap I found when I removed the trim around the engine mount. There was a gap of over 3/4 inch that was letting a lot of water into the aft locker.
The speaker hole was another story - and it's now gone!
Chris
Update.
I still could not trace the exact source of my problem but I did seal the chainplates and the windows and so far my boat is dry. However, when I start lowering and raising the mast I think what 'centerline' says about movement of the chainplates will bring back the problem so I intend to use his cure by applying epoxy putty.
I should add also that I have been told of 2 other ex-MacGregor owners, one who had a 26X and the other a 26M, both of whom sold their boats because of the same water under the seat problem, so maybe this is a design problem that MacGregor should look into.
I still could not trace the exact source of my problem but I did seal the chainplates and the windows and so far my boat is dry. However, when I start lowering and raising the mast I think what 'centerline' says about movement of the chainplates will bring back the problem so I intend to use his cure by applying epoxy putty.
I should add also that I have been told of 2 other ex-MacGregor owners, one who had a 26X and the other a 26M, both of whom sold their boats because of the same water under the seat problem, so maybe this is a design problem that MacGregor should look into.
Chainplates and that area are designed to have some movement. I'd be leery of putting something in that area that really sets up and was not capable of movement. We've had the mast up and down since our 'quicky' repair with no problems. Once the mast starts down the shrouds are slack and not moving the chain plates. If you want to spend time on the area I'd go with the butyl tape before trying the more permanent epoxy myself.
I feel that is a pretty poor reason to sell the boat. Even big boats have to have the chain plates re-bedded from time to time. On the board with more X and M's they address the problem and the owners are happy,
Sum
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